Power Tube Saturation

[Jeff Seal]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

I am not the tube geek
And the guy who is doing it is a whiz...and it works, but I have no idea how he does it, but no clipping diodes like the rest of the so called tubedrives.
Niels

...good enough!...

JS

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

Well I hope it will be...because the sound is very good.

[ErikH]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

Sounds cool, Rid. By any chance, is that tube whiz in Germany?

[jeremy]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

couple things that i dont think anyone mentioned.

gt sells at least two types of el84's sovtek, jj and maybe ei as well. jj's are branded as GTEL84S and are noticably better than the sovteks.

when you crank a good tube amp they start pushing a lot more low end. while your amp may sound great with the bass cranked at low volume, at higher volume youll need to turn it down, probably below half, to keep the bottom end tight. same thing with the gain or preamp control, too much preamp saturation will turn to mush in the power section.

you will never get as much power tube distortion as you can preamp. its a much different thing, less sustain and saturation, more grit.

[Thames]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

Now we're getting somewhere!
Regarding the '59 being too thin in the SG...a few of our forum brothers said that was the closest pup to what Clapton used with his SG in Cream. I do think it is thin at times. I have also thought about the Custom Custom but I think it may lose the vintage vibe I want for early ZZ Top and Cream. I have also thought about Seth Lovers, though I quesiton their sound with gain dialed in.

You said the EL84 doesn't fit with the job of dialing in Cream/Sabbath/ACDC et al. Then do I just need to switch tubes? And re: Greenbacks, I heard they were too mid-focused and not right for an SG. That's why I went with the GH1230. Lastly, if I am going to ditch the Peavey, I need a supple combo replacement. I would go directly to Marshall, but I have heard VERY spotty things about the DSL401. The Bluesbreaker combo looks great but may be a bit too much for me at this stage of the game. Maybe the Laney is the answer. How are the cleans on it?

The Seth Lovers are great pickups, highly recommended for the tone you're after. They are the most versatile p'ups I tried so far. YOU control the response/pick attack, and they'll deliver the goods.

Regarding the tubes, you cant put anything else than EL84 in the C30. And the problem is the output transformer, you'll not get any "balls" with that tiny OT.

RE : speakers. You went right with a G12H30 for that amp, but the same rule applies : never underestimate the power of a quad of greenback in a marshall 4x12

Also, there's alot of blog about adding a external speaker cab. Dont do that, it will provide more bass and maybe more torque, but still not the tone you want. You need to go with a closed back, minimum 2x12 cab, with EL34/KT66 equipped amp. THAT is the solution.

[Vasshu the humanoid typhoon]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

Sounds cool, Rid. By any chance, is that tube whiz in Germany?

Nope here in DK
And he is brilliant, even had a job offer from Marshall...so he is not your everyday tech.

[Rich_S]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

Wouldn't it be nice to get power tube distortion in a pedal?

Unfortunately, in most vacuum tube pedals, the tube is merely used in "starved plate mode" as a clipping diode. This is not not true tube amplification and it's not going to give you power tube saturation.

Wouldn't it be nice to get a pedal that couples a 100% vacuum tube signal path with high plate voltage? This would allow the tubes to operate to their fullest potential and provide the most gain and the smoothest tone.

It never hurts to wish...

You're describing the Garnet Herzog - Randy Bachman's original source of the American Woman tone. The Herzog is basically a hotrodded Champ, driving a dummy load, cascaded into a regular amp. Terry Kath of Chicago did something similar driving small Bogen PA amps cranked into larger Fenders (set clean). But since this effect has preamp, output stage, power supply, and output transformer, it won't fit in a stompbox. If anyone's interested in this concept, many of the guys at AX84.com have fooled around with 'zogging small DIY amps.

Of course, these don't get the cranked-plexi sound JonnyM's looking for. The 'zog concept is better at getting heavy overdrive, though fatter and less buzzy than today's many-cascaded-preamp-stages gain machines.

I'm inclined to go along with the folks who blame the EL84's in your Peavey. The EL84 is not generally the right choice for copping cranked-octal tones. HOWEVER... I think my 18 Watter clone sounds pretty Marshally (without the excessive volume) so it is possible to get these tones out of EL84s. Having a really good output transformer with good bass response is required. (I suspect your Classic is lacking in this area, its the first place manufacturers skimp to save money.)

Look around and try out various other amps, keeping in mind how much power you need. Don't automatically assume you need a big Marshall to get this tone unless you need the volume.

[ErikH]

Re: Power Tube Saturation

Nope here in DK
And he is brilliant, even had a job offer from Marshall...so he is not your everyday tech.

Ahh, OK. Well heck, with those credentials, it better sound good. I was thinking maybe it was Ton, does some stuff with EH and is a tube nut himself.