ToneX. Game changer or just another gadget?

[Top-L]

Have any of you heard about the new IK Multimedia ToneX? Apparently it is a profiling system like the Kemper, but the hardware pedal that holds/plays the profiles only costs $400. (The profiling itself is handled in computer software.) In fact, the profiler allows you to create VST plugins that can be inserted in your host, which I don't think can be done by the other platforms.

People are saying it gets better results than the Kemper and Quad Cortex. Null tests seem to confirm this as well.

I almost clicked the "reserve now" button on Sweetwater, but something held me back. Concerns:

1) It adds 3ms latency to whatever rig you are using. So in an analog pedalboard, 3ms latency is nothing, but if you are adding it to the loop of a MFX processor, now you have two rounds of conversion plus 3ms... which for something like a Helix (or zoom g11) may well be above 10ms.. which I can absolutely feel. In this case a Kemper would still be a better live device.

2) I'm not sure I want to get into a "hunt and peck" profiling ecosystem, finding the perfect profiles and the perfect IRs. Everyone is raving about how accurate it is, but EVERY profile I've heard so far is a "can of bees" 5150. Do we really need this? I'd rather just twist the knobs on my modeler to get my sounds, it doesnt bother me that my tone is not a direct decendent of an actual tube amp.

Any other thoughts on this that could sway my decision?

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ToneXPedal--ik-multimedia-tonex-pedal-amplifier-cabinet-pedal-modeler

[Mincer]

I didn't like the sound on the promo video. But I hope it works really well in person. This would be a wonderful pedal if it sounds better than the video.

[Top-L]

I didn't like the sound on the promo video. But I hope it works really well in person. This would be a wonderful pedal if it sounds better than the video.

I searched for that video and couldnt find it. Apparently they gave every gear reviewer on Youtube a ToneX pedal and there are tons of gushing reviews.

Even if it is 99.9999% accurate, is it something that everyone needs in their rig?

[Mincer]

I am always doubtful about online reviewers, especially if they are given products. Those 'reviews' are paid for. I think the video I didn't like was the Reverb one. But if it sounds better in person (I'll wait until I try it myself), it would be a welcome addition to the guitar landscape, especially at that price.

[Etienne]

I've heard from more or less legit sources that the IKM Tonex tech not only makes it possible to sound like real (snapshots) but also delivers the corresponding feel of each capture.
Another thing: Tonex takes allegedly real overdrive and boost pedals in front well. High headroom but of course only as long as you don't clip the AD (analogue to digital) converter.

[Top-L]

I've heard from more or less legit sources that the IKM Tonex tech not only makes it possible to sound like real (snapshots) but also delivers the corresponding feel of each capture.
Another thing: Tonex takes allegedly real overdrive and boost pedals in front well. High headroom but of course only as long as you don't clip the AD (analogue to digital) converter.

Do you even need the pedal to use the software and do captures?

I *think* the ToneX software application does the profiling and/or allows you to load/play profiles in your projects as VSTs.

They may have it set up the the pedal is a dongle that enables certain features in the software, but I believe the pedal is just a way to port your profiles to a hardware rig.

That being said, I dont think I would need the pedal if the software does everything. Could use the tonex profiles as VSTs within something like Guitar Rig.

[Etienne]

Do you even need the pedal to use the software and do captures?

No. You don't need the pedal/hardware at all. You can purchase the Tonex software version and capture+play profiles without the pedal.

Could use the tonex profiles as VSTs within something like Guitar Rig.

You can load the Tonex player VST plugin in your DAW on your computer. You can also play the Tonex profiles within IK Multimedia's Amplitube 5.
But you can't load and play profiles in other brands' products like NI Guitar Rig which are not capable to host VSTs within.

[Etienne]

Everyone is raving about how accurate it is, but EVERY profile I've heard so far is a "can of bees" 5150.

Here's a video with something other than ultra gain amp setting captured by Tonex software.

[Rex_Rocker]

I don't think it's a game changer, but it's certainly an interesting product. I mean, it really does nothing another product didn't already do before, it just does it an a more affordable price point.

Then again, I've never been a that interested in profiling because it's just a snapshot of the amp/cab/mic setup with certain settings. Yes, there's stuff you can adjust after the fact, but I mean, if I'm going digital, I'd rather go with the full adjustability of amp models at that point, personally.

but EVERY profile I've heard so far is a "can of bees" 5150

Sorry you don't like TOAN, man.

[jeremy]

that last vid sounds great, but its super wet too. i hate that cause i feel like it covers up so much of the natural tone of the simple amp

[Top-L]

You can load the Tonex player VST plugin in your DAW on your computer. You can also play the Tonex profiles within IK Multimedia's Amplitube 5.
But you can't load and play profiles in other brands' products like NI Guitar Rig which are not capable to host VSTs within.

I thought that GR6 could also be a VST host for plugins, but checking the manual, it has special versions of NI plugins that are integrated with GR6.

This was an exciting possibility because if GR6 could host VSTs, then you could save everything at the patch level and use GR6 switching, perhaps for a live rig.

Guitar Rig has pretty great effects, but the amp models are iffy.

[Top-L]

I saw on TGP that there is an open source profiler called "Neural Amp Modeler", that is as good as the commercial products. These methods have been published. Anyone with a computer science or data science background can figure it out.

Which brings up an interesting idea. If any amp can be profiled to within an inch of it's life, then the big players (L6, Boss, Fractal, etc), could create in-house profiling of any amp, and include them within their devices. It may be that Neural DSP has already been doing this for their plugins.

Which further means, I suspect in the next 2-3 years, that the Helix2 and the Boss Gt2000 will include profiled amps. and there will be a great convergence between the devices, because the profiles are all correct, all the models will sound essentially the same. It might come down to licensing.

I cant see Boss soldering on with their "Crunch" and "HI Gain" models when they could include a completely credible MarkV or JVM410 on board.

[Etienne]

that last vid sounds great, but its super wet too. i hate that cause i feel like it covers up so much of the natural tone of the simple amp

Here's a video with dry real amp, Quad Cortex and Tonex capture sound. You should only hear what the microphones in front of the speakers hear(d). No post-processing at all.

[justFred]

you can download for mac or PC: https://www.ikmultimedia.com/product.../#nl_form_area and try for free.
I tried it, didn't like it. Maybe their hardware/pedal version is better...

[Rex_Rocker]

IWhich further means, I suspect in the next 2-3 years, that the Helix2 and the Boss Gt2000 will include profiled amps. and there will be a great convergence between the devices, because the profiles are all correct, all the models will sound essentially the same. It might come down to licensing.

Do people who buy the Boss stuff actually use the amp models? I mean, obviously, to some extent, but is that like their main target? I don't know about the newest generation of Boss modelers, but in the past, I think the majority of the people who bought the GT stuff used it as a compliment to their amps. They just happened to have amp models as well if you needed them. But I've always had the impression the Boss GT target market is the people who use the effects with their real amps. Has that changed?

What I mean to say is I don't think Boss is as concerned with competing as much as Line 6. I mean, after all, Amplitube was competing with the Line 6 stuff since the Ampfarm plugin was available for ProTools only.

Ah, those were the days, LOL.