Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

[BadAspen]

I have a bridge on my guitar that looks like a synchronized tremolo but actually operates closer to a Floyd Rose. When I got my guitar back from the shop they cranked it all the way down so that you couldn't pull up and the bar was pointed way up at a weird angle.

I figured I'd just back the trem claw up until I got it set to what I had before, but now when I pull up the claw falls loose from the screws and I can feel it through the bar and hear it rattle. How do I fix this?

[ICTGoober]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

You have to do it gradually. For a floating system, you have to tune, adjust, tune, adjust, and so on until you hit the correct balance point. It's a pain to be sure, but patience is the key.

Also, NEVER go back to that shop for service. They are obviously clueless.

[jeremy]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

how many springs are in there now? you can put rubber tubing over the trem claw screws to kinda hold it in place if need be

[BadAspen]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Also, NEVER go back to that shop for service. They are obviously clueless.

In their defense, they did a pretty good job at fixing my headstock that broke off.

how many springs are in there now? you can put rubber tubing over the trem claw screws to kinda hold it in place if need be

2 springs parallel at the outside, but with 3 I can't loosen it enough to float properly.

[Mincer]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

You might experiment with different springs, as they aren't all the same. Many companies make springs at different tensions.

[BadAspen]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

You have to do it gradually. For a floating system, you have to tune, adjust, tune, adjust, and so on until you hit the correct balance point. It's a pain to be sure, but patience is the key.

Also, NEVER go back to that shop for service. They are obviously clueless.

Oh, and to clarify. I can get the bridge balanced and in tune properly, I just can't get the claw to stay pushed against the head of the screw whenever I pull up on the bar.

[BadAspen]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

You might experiment with different springs, as they aren't all the same. Many companies make springs at different tensions.

The issue isn't the tension, the issue is that when I release the tension the claw falls off. This same set of springs was working just fine earlier.

[Chistopher]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Set it up so the claw is slightly diagonal. That way when you pull up one spring still has tension on the claw.

[ItsaBass]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Unless you're talking about a design I haven't seen, the claw can't fall off. The screws go through it. The springs can fall off the claw. Is this what is happening?

Also, why so mysterious about what vibrato it is? "Looks like a synchronized tremolo but actually operates closer to a Floyd Rose" seems like a vague way to put it.

[BadAspen]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Unless you're talking about a design I haven't seen, the claw can't fall off. The screws go through it. The springs can fall off the claw. Is this what is happening?

Also, why so mysterious about what vibrato it is? "Looks like a synchronized tremolo but actually operates closer to a Floyd Rose" seems like a vague way to put it.

The claw isn't "falling off", when I pull up on the bar the springs slack so that the claw is no longer pulled against the spring, if I dive further they actually push the claw towards the back of the route. This ruins the smoothness of the tremolo and makes a considerable amount of noise. So far I've tried putting springs on the screws that mount the claw to the body as a sort of counterbalance, but that doesn't work.

The bridge is actually a Vegatrem, the reason I didn't go into detail was because the specifics of the trem don't make a difference to the problem and as it is a less then common design it would confuse people. As you can tell from most of the previous posts, people aren't quite clear on the problem as-is.

[akio]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Start from scratch. Block the trem level, crank the claw down enough to hold it firmly. Might want to add a couple toothpick slivers to the claw screw holes just in case. Tune as normal, then unblock the trem. Slowly let the claw out until you come back into tune. If this doesn't work, give us some pictures of what's happening. Only other thing I can think of is maybe the Vega Trem springs might be shorter than standard, and your repair tech substituted a set of standard Strat springs.

[BadAspen]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Here's a video of what I'm on about:

Those springs were an attempt to fix the problem, but they didn't make a difference. I've tried angled the claw, short high tension springs, normal springs, and long lower tension springs all to no avail. Like I said, the only thing that changed before this was the guy tightened to bridge all the way down so it was down-only.

The camera didn't pick it up that well, but that noise is really loud.

[ItsaBass]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

The claw isn't "falling off", when I pull up on the bar the springs slack so that the claw is no longer pulled against the spring, if I dive further they actually push the claw towards the back of the route. This ruins the smoothness of the tremolo and makes a considerable amount of noise. So far I've tried putting springs on the screws that mount the claw to the body as a sort of counterbalance, but that doesn't work.

The bridge is actually a Vegatrem, the reason I didn't go into detail was because the specifics of the trem don't make a difference to the problem and as it is a less then common design it would confuse people. As you can tell from most of the previous posts, people aren't quite clear on the problem as-is.

They aren't clear because you aren't describing it very well.

You said:

[T]he issue is that when I release the tension the claw falls off.

Now you say, "The claw isn't falling off."

It will not "confuse" people to tell them what you are talking about. It confuses them not to, and to use long winded descriptions instead, e.g. "looks like a synchronized tremolo, but actually operates closer to a Floyd Rose". And this wordy description is highly flawed anyhow. This vibrato has almost nothing in common with a Floyd Rose...nor does it look like a Fender Synchronized Tremolo. It's basically a Super Vee Blade Runner (which is an utter piece of garbage IME) with Wilkinson/Gotoh-type saddles.

Your description is unclear and all over the place here, and it needs to be nailed down before anyone can give you a useful answer.

To me, it sounds as simple as: Your claw is sliding off of the screw heads during extreme pull ups. This is common. It was probably doing it before too, to some degree, but you didn't notice it.

This is a classic issue for those who do extreme pull ups on a Strat. The best solution is to ignore it, because it doesn't matter. A ghetto fix is to stuff something behind the back of the claw and the front edge of the vibrato cavity. A bundle of cloth. a piece of wood. Whatever.

If you want to keep messing with setup, then I you don't need to change the number of springs or try different springs. It sounds to me like they might have used a lower tension set of strings than what was on there previously.

With the back cavity open, push the vibrato down (i.e. pull the arm up) as far as you ever will. This should loosen to claw from its screws (according to you). While holding it there, tighten the claw screws until the claw is just barely held tightly. Release the vibrato arm. If your bridge is no longer level, you need higher tension strings.

[BadAspen]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

They aren't clear because you aren't describing it very well.

You said:



Now you say, "The claw isn't falling off."

It will not "confuse" people to tell them what you are talking about. It confuses them not to, and to use long winded descriptions instead, e.g. "looks like a synchronized tremolo, but actually operates closer to a Floyd Rose". And this wordy description is highly flawed anyhow. This vibrato has almost nothing in common with a Floyd Rose...nor does it look like a Fender Synchronized Tremolo. It's basically a Super Vee Blade Runner (which is an utter piece of garbage IME) with Wilkinson/Gotoh-type saddles.

Your description is unclear and all over the place here, and it needs to be nailed down before anyone can give you a useful answer.

To me, it sounds as simple as: Your claw is sliding off of the screw heads during extreme pull ups. This is common. It was probably doing it before too, to some degree, but you didn't notice it.

This is a classic issue for those who do extreme pull ups on a Strat. The best solution is to ignore it, because it doesn't matter. A ghetto fix is to stuff something behind the back of the claw and the front edge of the vibrato cavity. A bundle of cloth. a piece of wood. Whatever.

If you want to keep messing with setup, then I you don't need to change the number of springs or try different springs. It sounds to me like they might have used a lower tension set of strings than what was on there previously.

With the back cavity open, push the vibrato down (i.e. pull the arm up) as far as you ever will. This should loosen to claw from its screws (according to you). While holding it there, tighten the claw screws until the claw is just barely held tightly. Release the vibrato arm. If your bridge is no longer level, you need lower tension strings.

If I didn't describe it well, watch the video.

I never said it was "falling off", the closest I said was "falling loose", ie coming slack. I wasn't aware falling loose was an uncommon phrase.

The Vegatrem is closer in range and feel to a Floyd Rose than any other bridge I could think of. The tech that did the work on it mistook it for a Synchronized. End of story, no aggression necessary.

It was most certainly not doing this before hand. All my other strats, this one before now included squeaked. This one makes a loud "clunk".

I don’t think I need lower tension springs, as I'm sure you meant, because I've used now 4 different sets, including 2 high tension springs parallel to each other, 2 angled high tensions springs, 2 angled medium tension springs, and just to try it also a single low tension springs

Again, let me reiterate, there is no need to get aggressive, no need to tell me the problem I am having doesn't exist, no need to bash Super Vee as if it hurts me in any way.

[Larioso]

Re: Trem Claw won't stay put when pulling up on whammy?

Isn't there a drawing how much space the claw needs to move. It could be that tech missed to take out some more in body for this trem to work properly.

Maybe you need more room to tighten springs as well etc.

In your opening post you did not say this is as guitar came back from tech the installed a new trem. It sounded like you had this trem working before but had a neck repair done in another post later, nothing else.

Nobody is aggressive just because they don't get the information you have in your head, but don't write.