I guess I'm going to give Gibson some credit

[beaubrummels]

I bought an R0. Mine doesn't have any of the issues that guy had. Light body, fast neck, great sounding electronics. I only paid the amount of the discount off retail, because the guy listing the ad screwed up and reversed the discount amount and list price. I was just patient and waited until one came up with a particular peculiar flame that looks like another rather 'famous one', and I got a great price on it.

[Bogner]

The old models had ______________. Let's not fix or improve that because we don't want to change anything.

I guess I like my guitars and their makers wanting to move forward and improve on the instrument rather than rest on yesterday's nostalgia. He never said how much more it would have cost if the pickups matched in look, the knobs were all the same and working properly and the scratch wasn't there.

[Securb]

This guitar is absolutely beautiful. Nice score.

[Ashurbanipal]

If we're thinking about just prices (setting aside Gibson's business decisions; whether or not people's wages have kept up with inflation etc.), back in 1959, a burst was $265, which in today's money is about $2500. Today, you can get a regular USA Standard for about that, with various finish options, in a 50s or 60s neck, with humbuckers or P90s. Don't quite have the money? There's the Studio, which is a similar format for 1k less. If you couldn't afford a burst back in 1959 but still wanted a solid body Gibson, your choice was either a Special or Junior.

Bottom line: flagship Gibsons were never cheap as such (not talking about the more stripped down, budget models).

[LLL]

The old models had ______________. Let's not fix or improve that because we don't want to change anything.

I guess I like my guitars and their makers wanting to move forward and improve on the instrument rather than rest on yesterday's nostalgia. He never said how much more it would have cost if the pickups matched in look, the knobs were all the same and working properly and the scratch wasn't there.

I have a love/hate relationship with the Les Paul.

On one hand, I recognize the history, provenance, the tone from that big hunk of mahogany (with or without maple top), etc...

OTOH, the upper fret access sucks balls, and the weight (forget about swiss cheesing the body) is typically not great.

(not to mention the extreme angle of the headstock for the 3+3 style - which apparently aids with snapping the headstock off easily when dropped)

Seems like Gibson finally figured out that "2 foot thick" heel of theirs on the LP was getting in the way of everybody.

But it apparently took Lerxst (Alex Lifeson) for them to actually do something about it (Les Paul Axcess).

And now we have the LP Modern with its sculpted heel.

My main guitar during my heyday years was a LP Custom black beauty.

I don't miss it. My Custom Shop SG is superior, not because "custom shop" (doesn't hurt though) but because the fretboard access is killer... and it sounds great too.

So, the SG really was an (and "the") improvement over the LP - remember they stopped making the LP after 1960, and introduced the "LP/SG" in '61 (to eventually be just the "SG").

[ErikH]

I have a love/hate relationship with the Les Paul.

On one hand, I recognize the history, provenance, the tone from that big hunk of mahogany (with or without maple top), etc...

OTOH, the upper fret access sucks balls, and the weight (forget about swiss cheesing the body) is typically not great.

(not to mention the extreme angle of the headstock for the 3+3 style - which apparently aids with snapping the headstock off easily when dropped)

Seems like Gibson finally figured out that "2 foot thick" heel of theirs on the LP was getting in the way of everybody.

But it apparently took Lerxst (Alex Lifeson) for them to actually do something about it (Les Paul Axcess).

And now we have the LP Modern with its sculpted heel.

My main guitar during my heyday years was a LP Custom black beauty.

I don't miss it. My Custom Shop SG is superior, not because "custom shop" (doesn't hurt though) but because the fretboard access is killer... and it sounds great too.

So, the SG really was an (and "the") improvement over the LP - remember they stopped making the LP after 1960, and introduced the "LP/SG" in '61 (to eventually be just the "SG").

Correction, that's Neal Schon's design. He did that with Gibson before Alex even had a sig model. The NS Les Paul Custom essentially became the Lifeson sig minus the sustainer circuitry. But yeah, a cool neck heal nonetheless.

I've said it before. Gibson is damned if you do, damned if you don't. "We want innovation" so they innovate and make changes. Here comes the purists "It's not vintage correct, this is crap" so they make vintage correct. Back and forth and back and forth. What they have now with the traditional and modern lines I think is a nice way of saying to both parties, "here ya go, now shut up and play yer guitars!"

I love my Les Paul. It's a weight relieve 2009 Traditional Pro and plays great. I would like a Goldtop one day but in no hurry. I'd be looking used most likely anyway.

[LLL]

Correction, that's Neal Schon's design. He did that with Gibson before Alex even had a sig model. The NS Les Paul Custom essentially became the Lifeson sig minus the sustainer circuitry. But yeah, a cool neck heal nonetheless.

I've said it before. Gibson is damned if you do, damned if you don't. "We want innovation" so they innovate and make changes. Here comes the purists "It's not vintage correct, this is crap" so they make vintage correct. Back and forth and back and forth. What they have now with the traditional and modern lines I think is a nice way of saying to both parties, "here ya go, now shut up and play yer guitars!"

I love my Les Paul. It's a weight relieve 2009 Traditional Pro and plays great. I would like a Goldtop one day but in no hurry. I'd be looking used most likely anyway.

I remember the Schon LP.. have a pic of the prototype here from my archives:




But I don't remember if it was a production model available to public.

[ErikH]

I remember the Schon LP.. have a pic of the prototype here from my archives:




But I don't remember if it was a production model available to public.

That’s sweet. From what I recall, it was available through the Custom Shop in 2005/2006. After Gibson stopped production, it shows up as the Lifeson LP. From what I’ve read, there were only 80 of the NS models made.

[Mincer]

I'd like the NS if it was all blacked out. Looks too blingy for me.