NS2 and delay FX loop

[Mincer]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

The reason I always put the tuner last is so it mutes everything while I tune, except the delays in the effects loop. But thinking about it, a Metal Zone into a 5150 has one too many stages of gain for any kind of hope of it being quiet.

[Coma]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

The reason I always put the tuner last is so it mutes everything while I tune, except the delays in the effects loop. But thinking about it, a Metal Zone into a 5150 has one too many stages of gain for any kind of hope of it being quiet.

Ideally, I'd use a booster pedal. But I'm not entirely sure I even need one, so using my old MT2 that's just lying around anyway seems like a decent enough proof of concept.

[Coma]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

This was from Boss Tech support.

Hi Daniel,

That connection scheme will not get rid of noise from within your amp's preamp circuitry when you're using the amp's internal distortion channel. That's not what the four cable method is for and the NS-2 is not designed to be used that way either.

The NS-2 is designed to be either used "in-line" between noisy guitar pedals and you're amp, or by using it's Send / Return jacks as a "mini" effects loop where you could instead place your noisy, high gain pedals.

You're welcome to try different connection schemes to see if you can find a custom configuration that suits your purposes, however, the two main connection schemes that the NS-2 was really meant to be used with are the ones on page 2 of the Owner's Manual. We have attached this NS-2's Owner's Manual to this e-mail for your convenience.



Kind Regards,
Roland Product Support

So odd, but I'm gonna try the different setups once I get my pedals delivered and see what works best. Will report back any findings.

[mantis]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

I'm curious why you have the Boss Metal zone? The 5150 drive channels are fantastic and very versatile . The only reason I sold mine was the fact I felt is was more a 2 channel amp then 3. The shared EQ for clean and crunch just didn't work for me. Not to mention the volume jump was the deal breaker. Everything else about it I loved. It was a great sounding and Midi controlled head. Took pedals like a champ. I used the NS-2 on it.

[DeadandBuried]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

I don't follow you. The wah isn't in the loop, the NS2 and the Delay is.

Why does the tuner need to be last? I've always run it first. Is this wrong?





Yes, I realise I may have made a mistake here. I've got the wah set last on my pedal board atm, and the NS2 is physically placed on top of my amp head. So by force of habit, I put it farthest to the left in the picture, LOL. But yeah, obv it should be somehwere else in the chain.

I'm trying to eliminate both guitar and amp noise. That's actually what the "send - return" jacks are for. The NS2 is apparently designed to go through the FX loop and eliminate preamp noise as well as regular noise from the guitar. So as of right now, I'm running:

Guitar -> Tuner -> Wah -> NS2 in -> NS2 send -> FX loop in -> FX loop out -> NS2 return -> NS2 Out -> Amp in.


Unless, of course, I've completely misunderstood how the NS2 and FX loops work.
But I want to run the delay through the FX loop as well, and this is basically where I'm stuck. I'm not entirely certain how to set everything up in the "right" order.

I'd refer to what Mantis said above, if the delays aren't causing any noise then put them in the loop of the amp, not the NS-2. I have a similar set up to yourself but only want to reduce the noise from an OD pedal, I have my head modded on the lead channel so its silent so I don't need multiple noise gates or more connections.

[Coma]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

I'm curious why you have the Boss Metal zone? The 5150 drive channels are fantastic and very versatile . The only reason I sold mine was the fact I felt is was more a 2 channel amp then 3. The shared EQ for clean and crunch just didn't work for me. Not to mention the volume jump was the deal breaker. Everything else about it I loved. It was a great sounding and Midi controlled head. Took pedals like a champ. I used the NS-2 on it.

There's no shared EQ on the 5153. At least not on the 100 w head.

I only wanna try to use the MT2 as a booster, see what happens. My philosophy when it comes to dirtboxes is if you buy a full tube head and then get your distortion out of a stompbox, you've missed the whole point.

[mantis]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

There's no shared EQ on the 5153. At least not on the 100 w head.

I only wanna try to use the MT2 as a booster, see what happens. My philosophy when it comes to dirtboxes is if you buy a full tube head and then get your distortion out of a stompbox, you've missed the whole point.

My bad , I didn't realize you had the 100 watt head. I was so referring to the 50 watt head which I owned and thought you did as well. Yeah no shared EQ on the 100 watt head and no Midi either which is a bummer for me.
There are so many better IMO pedal to use a Booster then the MT2. That pedal is designed to be a distortion over the top metal pedal for people who like solid state sounding gain. Nothing wrong with it but I think you could do so much better with what you wanna do with a tc electronics spark. It really works well with the 5150 III, It worked killer with my 50 watt version. It can be a clean boost, a mid range boost , a OD pedal and a Bass push if you will. It's so versatile it single handily got me to try most of the tc electronics single pedals. I purchased like 8 of them.

Missing the point with stomp boxes I don't agree. I do agree if you have a tube head that has Drive channels to use them but adding dirt pedals can add additional tones you might not be able to get out of your amp. My Krank Revolution is a 2 trick pony. It has amazing cleans like a fender Twin reverb or more like a Bassman 10 and a drive channel thats a nasty as a 5150 Peavey or Mesa Boogie Triple REC. But thats all it can do, I can't get rock tones out of it so I have to add Pedals out front of my clean channel to get the other tones I want.
It's a strong reason why I purchased the 5150 III 50 watt head because you can get killer rock tones out of channel 2 and man did it do a excellent job.

So I suggest you check out the spark, pick one up and try it in front of any channel you wish on your 5150 III, you'll be surprised all the new tones you can get and alter the ones you already love now. It's a fantastic pedal and the best OD pedal like Boost I've ever owned or tried out. It's so much better to me then the Ibanez Tube screamers , all of them.

[Coma]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

My bad , I didn't realize you had the 100 watt head. I was so referring to the 50 watt head which I owned and thought you did as well. Yeah no shared EQ on the 100 watt head and no Midi either which is a bummer for me.
There are so many better IMO pedal to use a Booster then the MT2. That pedal is designed to be a distortion over the top metal pedal for people who like solid state sounding gain. Nothing wrong with it but I think you could do so much better with what you wanna do with a tc electronics spark. It really works well with the 5150 III, It worked killer with my 50 watt version. It can be a clean boost, a mid range boost , a OD pedal and a Bass push if you will. It's so versatile it single handily got me to try most of the tc electronics single pedals. I purchased like 8 of them.

Missing the point with stomp boxes I don't agree. I do agree if you have a tube head that has Drive channels to use them but adding dirt pedals can add additional tones you might not be able to get out of your amp. My Krank Revolution is a 2 trick pony. It has amazing cleans like a fender Twin reverb or more like a Bassman 10 and a drive channel thats a nasty as a 5150 Peavey or Mesa Boogie Triple REC. But thats all it can do, I can't get rock tones out of it so I have to add Pedals out front of my clean channel to get the other tones I want.
It's a strong reason why I purchased the 5150 III 50 watt head because you can get killer rock tones out of channel 2 and man did it do a excellent job.

So I suggest you check out the spark, pick one up and try it in front of any channel you wish on your 5150 III, you'll be surprised all the new tones you can get and alter the ones you already love now. It's a fantastic pedal and the best OD pedal like Boost I've ever owned or tried out. It's so much better to me then the Ibanez Tube screamers , all of them.

Thanks for the tip, I'll add it to the watch list. Been thinking of the MXR 133 or the Xotic EP.

[Coma]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

BTW, Spark or mini Spark?

[mantis]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

BTW, Spark or mini Spark?

\
Full size spark, I don't mess around with the mini pedals. I have not had the gut feeling to plug on of those in. It's like all these Mini heads that are around now. I'm just not totally comfortable with them yet.
I heard the Mini is very nice but it's also very limited compared.

[Mincer]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

I dig the Pickup Booster for my boost. Dead clean, and it adds a resonance switch.

[Coma]

Re: NS2 and delay FX loop

NO MAN,
Let me tell you exactly how to use the Boss NS-2 properly so you get the best overall noise gating out of it.

With your current pedal line up I suggest the following wiring.

GUITAR>>>WAH>>>TUNER>>>NS-2 INPUT>>>NS-2 SEND>>>BOSS METAL ZONE>>>RETURN OFF THE NS-2>>>OUTPUT OF NS-2>>>>FRONT OF 5150 III>>>SEND OUT OF EFFECTS LOOP OF THE 5150 III>>>>TC ELECTRONICS FLASHBACK DEALY>>>>RETRUN OF EFFECTS LOOP OF 5150 III.

This is the best overall way to use it. I have owned most of your gear there and this should give you the best overall tone IMO. There is no right or wrong way to do this but I really went through the entire signal chain and in this setup, you will have the best results.
Now if you add any OD or distortion pedals, they live in the loop of the NS-2 where the Metal Zone lives. If you add any Modulation effects like Reverb or Chorus , they should live around the Flashback Delay. So the Chorus pedal would go infront of the delay in your loop and the Reverb would go after the Delay in your 5150's Loop. This chain IMO is the very best of the best for clean effects sounds and nothing gets in the way of others.

SO I went to our rehersal space today and tried out the different conneciton patterns. And this didn't work AT ALL. If anything, it created MORE noise.
Now, I don't know what your experience with this stuff is, and you're absolutely right that this is how the Boss manual says to set the pedal up. But it simply didn't work.
Patched it back into the X pattern and it worked as a charm, just like before.

My connection was, BTW:

GUITAR -> NS2 IN -> NS2 OUT -> AMP IN.
And just to make sure, I also tried:
GUITAR ->NS2 IN -> NS2 SEND -> AMP IN.
And that basically did nothing.

So I dunno what to tell you, man. Maybe I missed out on some detail or connected it wrong, but it really didn't work.
What I can't really wrap my head around is why the jacks are labeled the way they are. Going by the X pattern, the SEND should be marked as OUTPUT and vice versa. That fact that they aren't lends further credence to your connection, as well as the suggested use in the manual. But again, it simply doesn't work.

Unless, OFC, the idea is that you NEED to put effects in the loop of the pedal for it do do anything. In which case, I shall now put on the hat of shame and stand in the corner of shame whilst drinking the coffee of shame.