the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

[appar111]

For those of you rocking a fairly traditional strat for rock & metal (i.e. vintage trem, SSS setup), do you feel that the key is the pickups, the body and neck wood or the amp and effects?

I've had a ***** of a time getting a strat to work for me, and I can't figure out why, but I think I'm narrowing it down and it may be a combination of things.

My amp and effects setup is fine for my other guitars (teles, humbucker equipped tele & strat-type and even jazzmaster), but a fairly standard strat (swamp ash, maple neck, vintage full-block trem, SSS setup) just doesn't have "it". Tried a variety of pickups in it (Dimarzio FS-1's, Injectors, Fender Fat 50's, Duncan Hot Rails, Dimarzio Fast Track 2), and I either lose the strattiness, or things just sound a little too "ehhh" compared to my other guitars. Tried different pot values (250 & 500K) and taking the tone pots out of the circuit. Trem blocked and floating. Nothing really gets my goat w/ this strat.

So what's the missing part of the equation here? A beefier neck, lower output pickups (something more like HS-3's or really low output strat pickups)?

[Empty Pockets]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Strats and their pickups were designed to produce a very clean sound with bigass strings... using them for rock and metal can be difficult.

My advice is to try not to force it and use the tool that works for the job. Don't modify your hammer... go get a shovel

That said, I get a good rocknroll tone out of my Phat Cat Fat Strat but its a 60's-70's kinda tone.. most guys who want "hard rock / metal" are doing an 80s/90s thing...

[appar111]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Yeah, I'd like the Yngwie strat tone, but without the earbleeding marshall volume. Hard to do without that latter half!

Current pickups on my radar for this one are either some Dimarzio HS-3's or some Duncan SSL-1's. Neither type are high output, and the HS-3's are actually lower output than stock strat pickups. One of the guys on the boards here a while back recommended really low output strat pickups for a swamp ash/maple combo.

I've tried the HS-3 before, but in the neck of a tele (where it sounded really, really good), and the bridge of a strat (not a swamp ash one, I don't think?) and it didn't overwhelm me.

[Empty Pockets]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

SSL-1s are a classic Strat sound for sure so that might work. If you want Yngwie tone then you need an amp or pedal with a good Plexi sound and i think he used either MXR or DOD drive pedals... in my opinion the amps and pedals play a much bigger part in the overall formula.

[appar111]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

I've got the YJM308 from DOD (the Yngwie signature one) that I may have to dig out and try. If I'm mainly going to use this for playing high gain rock, I may have to opt for the hum-cancelling stuff.

Dimarzio Area 58's are also on the list, as are the Duncan STK-S4's if I go the noiseless route again.

I'm also going to try raising the action on the strat this time around and going a little lighter on string gauge (I'm usually a 10 or 11 gauge guy nowadays). That might help restore some strattiness to the setup.

[Shadow1psc]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Hot Rails. Hot Rails, Hot Rails, Hot Rails. Hot Rails.

No seriously, I can't praise these enough.

[idsnowdog]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Dimarzio Fastrack II bridge, SD Duckbucker middle and SD JB Jr neck.

[appar111]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Tried the hot rails in the bridge, tried the Fast Track 2 in the bridge. They're both super high output, all mids and not much else, at least not in my current setup. I think my ears are favoring things that are less compressed nowadays, otherwise those 2 choices should rock balls in a strat for me.

[ErikH]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

If you're going for the Yngwie thing with this Strat, just get the YJM Duncans and call it a day. You definitely need some sort of OD, the YJM one is perfect for that, in front of a Marshall type amp.

Since rock/metal is usually associated with gobs of saturation, I suggest noiseless, and the YJM Duncans fit the bill for what you're going for.

[Shadow1psc]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Very high output, very middy, so if you're going for a scooped tone, then it's probably not what you want, sure. Hard Rock/Metal is such a broad category, but like, when I hear most people say it, I figure they're talking Iron Maiden, Van Halen, that type of era stuff. If you're talking like, really heavy Djenty type stuff, I think it's going to come down to the right amp, cab and EQ.

[DonP]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Strats and their pickups were designed to produce a very clean sound with bigass strings... using them for rock and metal can be difficult.

My advice is to try not to force it and use the tool that works for the job. Don't modify your hammer... go get a shovel

I agree to this. If you feel you must stick to the SSS, try a JB Jr. in the bridge, or a lil 59.

The MIJ Iron Maiden strat used a JB Jr. in the bridge and two hot rails for neck and middle.

I've never had a JB Jr., but if it worked in this guitar, I'm guessing it might work for you.

[Myaccount876]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

If you're going for the Yngwie thing with this Strat, just get the YJM Duncans and call it a day. You definitely need some sort of OD, the YJM one is perfect for that, in front of a Marshall type amp.

Since rock/metal is usually associated with gobs of saturation, I suggest noiseless, and the YJM Duncans fit the bill for what you're going for.

This. It would probably work the most for you by far. They even keep the strat sound.

[sosomething]

I'd say pickups matter the most, followed closely by bridge and saddle construction.

The traditional strat bridge with six screws and stamped saddles goes a very long way to producing the typical "plinky" sound from the bridge position.

All the other stuff matters too, but in most cases you can get a Strat to handle heavier tones just fine with hotter pickups and a swap for higher-mass milled or graphtech saddles.

[appar111]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Well, shift of direction. I decided I'm going to take the easy way out-- bypassing single coils and the like and just going for a single, rippin' humbucker in the bridge position. Single volume knob.

I know, I know... unoriginal, but if the hammer works, right? Just need to track down a Distortion, 500T, Super D... something in that big, angry, raw category of humbucker, slap it in a single-humbucker pickguard and rock the f out...

[Gypsyblue]

Re: the perfect rock/metal strat - more about pickups, body/neck wood or amp?

Pickups matter most. A Strat with stock pickups through a Marshall sounds like a Stratocaster.

A Strat with paf style humbucking pickups through a Marshall sounds like Edward Van Halen - if it's Eddie doing the playing. Maybe THAT'S most important: the guy doing the playing.

I'm not into metal but it seems to me that with few exceptions, full size humbuckers are sort of a must have - although they don't have to be hot overwound humbuckers.

50's and 60's Gibson paf's through a cranked Marshall, sometimes with a booster pedal but most often without, were what was used to kick the genre off in it's earliest days.