Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

[Legion216]

I have two questions that have been bugging the crap out of me...

1) Most of Duncan's neck pickups are EQ'd to have a mid scoop, and YET they're paired with mid heavy bridge pickups: The JB with the Jazz, the Distortion with the '59, The Pegasus with the Sentient, etc. So in a dense mix situation, when you switch your pickup from bridge to neck to play a solo, won't you get lost in the mix? The Sentient, Jazz and the '59 neck pups all have a pretty crazy mid scoop! Logically, shouldn't both bridge and neck pups have a similar EQ curve?

2) The Sentient is supposed to work well with bright woods. HOW does a pickup with B/M/T=4/3/8 work well in a bright wood guitar? Doesn't is become super shrill?

Thank you!
Cheers!

[idsnowdog]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

It comes down to Duncan's design philosophy of creating matched sets of pickups. Many manufacturers don't make matched sets. The idea is that the pickup is EQ'd based upon its position. Neck pickups are going to be louder and have more bass/midrange than the bridge position, so having a pickup that is a few K less resistance compensates for the volume mismatch, while the mid/bass scoop is meant to keep the tone consistent from position to position. The opposite can be said for the bridge position because it is weaker and brighter, so the pickup is a few K hotter and EQ'd to have more bass/midrange. Honestly you can use whatever pickup you like in whatever position you like, but you might experience volume mismatches and clarity problems.

[p4vl]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

Those EQ ratings can be counter-intuitive. Who would guess that the Duncan Distortion (released in 1980, when even metal bands were in E) is one of the best bridge pickups for low tunings, based upon it's lack of bass and abundance of mids and treble? Pickups aren't EQ pedals.

[vinta9e]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

Pickups aren't EQ pedals.

You're right.

1) Most of Duncan's neck pickups are EQ'd to have a mid scoop, and YET they're paired with mid heavy bridge pickups: The JB with the Jazz, the Distortion with the '59, The Pegasus with the Sentient, etc. So in a dense mix situation, when you switch your pickup from bridge to neck to play a solo, won't you get lost in the mix? The Sentient, Jazz and the '59 neck pups all have a pretty crazy mid scoop! Logically, shouldn't both bridge and neck pups have a similar EQ curve?

The vibration of the string in the neck pickup's magnetic window is different than right over the bridge pickup. Go figure how blueman335 talks about neck pickups being overly muddy and bridge pickups being shrill most of the time. Long, open strings produce a lot of bass over the neck pickup. Short strings (eg. fretted in higher positions) sound fatter because they lose upper harmonics. That's especially true of wound strings - just play the Smoke On The Water intro riff starting from the 10th fret and you'll hear for yourself.
The 'scooped' neck pickup voicing is what gives it that sweet, slightly hollow tonality. Thanks to how the strings behave and what happens later in the signal chain, there is still plenty of midrange coming out of the speakers.

2) The Sentient is supposed to work well with bright woods. HOW does a pickup with B/M/T=4/3/8 work well in a bright wood guitar? Doesn't is become super shrill?

Being a neck pickup, it's unlikely to be shrill, as I've just explained. The B/M/T ratings are arbitrary and not worth getting overexcited about, in my experience. The accentuated contour (low and high end of the spectrum) make Duncans sound "big, rich and sparkly" like they do in most cases. The pickups' extended high end can be tamed by means of a lower resistance volume pot, a tone control, long cable runs, pedals, amp and speaker voicing. Removing the excess is easy, but it's nice to have it there when you need the articulation.

[blueman335]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

Being a neck pickup, it's unlikely to be shrill, as I've just explained. The B/M/T ratings are arbitrary and not worth getting overexcited about, in my experience. The pickups' extended high end can be tamed by means of a lower resistance volume pot, a tone control, long cable runs, pedals, amp and speaker voicing. Removing the excess is easy, but it's nice to have it there when you need the articulation.

+1. A lot of people disagree with published EQ ratings for all brands of PU's. Makes you wonder when the same EQ rating is used for both the bridge and neck PU of a set. One of the most popular ways here to tame the high-end of bridge PU's is to use warmer magents.

[Legion216]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

I see. Thank you so much for the informative replies, people!
The reason I ask is that I'm trying to decide between a D-Activator 7/Liquifire 7 and a Pegasus/Sentient for my ash-maple-maple seven string. They're ENTIRELY different beasts!
Instead of asking "hai wht pckup 2 bai 4 my gtr" I'm trying to understand what makes pickups tick so I can make a better informed choice, haha.

Now, consider one of the most loved neck pickups of recent times, the DiMarzio Liquifire. MIDDY AS FUQ. At least that's what the EQ says on their website. Yet it has that sweet and slightly hollow sound that vinta9e speaks of (assuming my definition of sweet and slightly hollow is the same as his) . I'm confused.

[chris effect]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

The mid scoop on the sentient is noticeable, but it pairs well with the nazgul which is super middy. I think the mid scoop and the extra high end balance well in the neck. It sounds pristine and a little 'woody' when played clean and it really cuts through with leads and handles gain well without getting muddy. I do have to set it almost as close to the strings as the nazgul to match volume.

I can't speak for the pegasus, but from what I've heard I dig it. It's not quite hot enough for my needs. I've also used a D-activator bridge- and while it's a good pickup, the EQ is too flat and it lacks character IMO. It is a good passive alternative to an active if you're going for that sound tho. no experience with the liquifire. good luck deciding!

[MacBradley]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

I wouldn't get to hung up on the B/M/T charts. The human ear can hear like 13 octaves, so its kinda hard to get a good idea of an EQ curve from just 3 points on a 1-10 scale. Resonance peak is more useful IMO, although I think calling Seymour Duncan and trying a pickup for yourself is probably the best way to find out how a pickup sounds in a given position.

[Legion216]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

Ah, thanks for the replies guys. Let's see what I get.

[uOpt]

Re: Questions regarding the way certain pickups are EQ'd

You can't give a neck pickup in a Les Paul a low mids push, it will become too boomy.

It is true, however, that the A5 crowd of neck pickups is relatively more popular with regular guitar center customers and OEM builds and that A2 neck pickups (Seth, PG, APH, Ant) are relatively more popular with the forum crowd who has experimented more.

In general, when casually "testing" a guitar a scooped sound is more attractive because of the loudness effect. Scooped stuff makes it out of guitar center more often because of that. In a band context when the mad keyboarder hits the fan the more even EQs and singing mids become a lot more important.