I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

[SJ318]

Hey folks,
Newbie question from an old guy. I love mids with highs. Tell me, why would anyone want a pickup with the mids cut. It seems to me that is where the guitar should live, IMHO. With highs + tight lows. But mids right up there, next to highs in importance.
Steve Buffington.

[AlexR]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

What pickups have mids cut from them??

And guitars that are already mids heavy due to their construction don't need the pickup to add more. You get congestion then.

[koshikas]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

i think all mid-cut(mid-scoop) is a relative gesture, meaning to say that when a pickup is said to be scooped, what is really implied is that relative to the bass and treble content in the sound generated, the mids are subdued. There is still some mids left, just that it is not as prominent. like u I hate mids being taken out. I feel that every time when there is a mid-scoop, it ends up sounding how the pickup wants to sing and not how the guitar is singing. however i ve come to a resolution that certain amount of mid-scoop in pickups is beneficial with certain scenarios:

1) with the medium to high output pickups, with all the compression and the relative treble roll-off inherited by the pickup with all the excess wire, i think a bit of mid-scoop helps in clearing the congested mids to improve the clarity and definition of sounds generated. whether it is really clearing of the congested mids OR mids being heard less (in volume) is something i cant comprehend yet.

2) if the guitar inherently sounds mid-rangy (with its construction: neck joint, body woods, neck wood, bridge type) and the pickups also happen to be mid-heavy, there is a chance, together it might endup sounding bloated. (PS: I am using mid-heavy PAF-like pickups on a mid-rangy guitar having very clear singing sounds, so i guess what i m meaning here are the over-wound pickups) Then too, using pickups with certain amount of mid-scoop might help the clarity.

[GuitarStv]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

Very mid-rangey amp + mid cut pickups = reasonably balanced tone.

[TNTales]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

There are also particular musical styles that that is better suited for. You probably would try and play death metal with Jazz neck and you probably wouldn't want to play Jazz with a Black Winter. It's really a matter of style and taste.

[SJ318]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

To AlexR
In the tone chart going B/M/T the Seth Lover says 6/4/8, the '59 says 6/3/8, the Pearly G. says
6/5/9 and the Jazz says 5/3/9. These are all popular pups. My fav is the Seth & the Jazz. With my Fender Blues jr., or my Hot rod deluxe, any bass from the amp sounds "congested" to use a good word from this thread. So I have to crank the mid control full up and it still could use more, at least for my ears (maybe my ears are shot) but turning down the treble does not help much as I like the crunch it gives me. I have one cab open, one closed.
I leave the presence off as it sounds "fizzie" or buzzy to me. And all my guitars use these pickups in the bridge- 2 HSS Strats, one basswood the other alder, my mahogany Les Paul jr., '61 SG RI, my mahogony/maple '66 Les Paul Custom, and a cheap bullet Tele that came /w a humbucker I swapped out for a Seth L. w/A5 mag. I use Celestions- Vint.30, and a Celestion Greenback in combo with each amp.
Thinking next chance I get to play live I might try a Duncan Pick up Booster I never used and set to boost single coils to humbucker land, use it with my HB's and see if that helps.
Steve Buffington Thanks to all who chimed in.

[uOpt]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

It isn't just musical style, it is also where you want to position the guitar in the mix, which in turn depends on who else is in the mix. And everybody needs to retrain themselves to invade the vocal range too much which is also mids.

A scooped sound from an electric guitar can be useful for cleans such as funky rhythms from a Strat or fingerpicking, so that you don't interfere with the voice, or so that you don't clash with the keyboarder.

I never heard the term "mid-cut" with guitar pickups, though. It exists as a concept in bass land where you use it when you want to go slapping extensively (as in slap the play style, not what you do to your keyboarder when his left hand is permanently pushing up the volume slider in regular rock music).

[AlexR]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

Why have you started this topic again btw.....

https://forum.seymourduncan.com/showthread.php?273316-Question-on-mids-and-magnets&highlight=scooped+pickups

[SJ318]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

AlexR, you are right.
I am sorry. I re-read the post. What an idiot. I think I was reading another post and thought about the long tone chart where those pickups I mentioned all list the mids as being low in the frequency list, i.e. 6/4/8, that kind of thing and I just forgot. I meant to say mid-scoop by the way.
So after rereading and looking at this, maybe an A3 or A4 is what I need. Many folks say A4's are "flat", so that would give me neutral pallette to start with. A3 also.
But tell me, why are the mid freq. mostly listed as being low in relation to the others. I have bought mags from addictionfx I think, it's in my phone book, I am sure you know which one I mean. They are nice. Are they just as reputable as any other?
As a last word, just let me say I am forgetful and make mistakes sometimes, but when I was married, according to my ex wife I was forgetful and made mistakes 100% of the time. So I am at least improving. Again, I apologize.
Steve B.

[GuitarDoc]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

As a last word, just let me say I am forgetful and make mistakes sometimes, but when I was married, according to my ex wife I was forgetful and made mistakes 100% of the time. So I am at least improving. Again, I apologize.
Steve B.

Ex-wives never really know who we are.

[AlexR]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

Many of the pickups come with with A2 anyhow (Seth Lover, AII pro and PG)......and quite frankly I think some of the tone chart numbers are wrong. A lot of PAF type pickups are bright, but they cut in the upper mids like a p90 does. And I've never really come across a low output pickup apart from the 59 that is really bass heavy like the tone chart says.

[jimijames]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

So, I feel like some clarity is needed.

It seems like you're talking about mid cut as in reduced mids.

But mid cut can also speak to the nature of the mids - for example when your guitar with lots of mids "cuts through" really well, and so the mids have cut.

You know, "mids-cut" vs. "mid-cuts"

And that's my contribution for the night haha.

[SJ318]

Re: I hear a lot about mid-cut, as in desireable. Why?

Thanks, everyone.
Also thanks AlexR for your take on the tonechart. As stated, in most of my posts, I stick w/A5 as A2 is to soft for me, UOA5 seemed to bloom in all directions, "diffuse". A4-still waiting for a chance to try that out, will get an A3 for the near future. O.K., well any other comments? If not, I'll sign off and SEARCH MYSELF OUT before I start any thing I've already done.
Steve B.