3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

[Aja]

Okay, here's the setup.

I have a guitar with two Seymour humbuckers, a Jazz in the neck and a Distortion in the bridge. There's one volume control and one tone control, and a 3-way pickup selector.

I've always been interested in splitting the coils, and although I can solder alright, I'm no electrician and am not sure how to go about it. I've heard of getting a 3-way switch, and wiring it to go like so: full humbucker/single coil/single coil with hum cancel. Is this a feasible thing to do? What other options are available?

If I were to go the switch way, I'd like it best if I had one for the Jazz and one for the Distortion. With the 3-way pickup selector in the middle position, could it be possible to have combinations like SC neck and HB bridge, or SC neck and SC bridge, etc? Any schematics would be extremely helpful, or else detalied instructions I would really appreciate!

Finally, do the jazz/distortion even sound good when split?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Hey Aja; Love the screen name . . . and welcome to the forum.

Could you give us a bit more info? What kind of guitar is it? Or more specifically, what kind of 3-way do you have? There's two different kinds, the LP style, and the "Alco" style. They operate completely differently and it will affect what options you have.

Also, when you say "humbucker/single-coil/single-coil with hum cancel", which 'bucker, and which sc's do you mean?

We can probaly get close to what you need, but need that extra info.

Thanks. Artie

 

[The JEM Ghost]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

I would not put my hand into the fire for it, but i think you ll need a 3-pole 3-way switch to split both humbuckers when in the middle position of the 3-way. I have that setup in a RG620QM and like it. I ve place it in other Ibanez models as well such as the SZ520QM and nice results came out of those as well. But all had a 3-pole 3-way switch standard, i guess you can't do it with a regular LP 3-way.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

The guitar's a Peavey Predator with two humbuckers and a three-way switch that controls neck in position one, both in position 2 and bridge in position 3.

Regarding the coil splitting - I was talking about installing a switch that would allow for three positions - #1 would be just the regular humbucker, #2 would be a coil split on that humbucker, and #3 would be a coil split with hum-cancel (I've been told it's doable, dunno if the source is reliable though).

If I were to install two of these switches (one for each humbucker), using the pickup selector switch I could have many combinations, like coil-split bridge and full humbucker neck and vice versa, or both coil-split neck and bridge, etc.

At first I was thinking about trying the "spin-a-split" method described on the SD website, but it is really useful to be able to adjust the amount of output?

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

What a coincidence. If you check my sig, you'll see that I have a Predator, and a Patriot - both, the same guitar, more or less, but the Predator has the Kahler bridge. The Patriot now has the pickgaurd in it,(that was in the Predator), that I installed the two coil-split switches in to do exactly what you're saying.

So I can confirm, its do-able. :laugh2:

I've never tried the spin-a-split yet, so I can't comment on that, but I'll make you up a diagram shortly. (Got a couple in front of you.)

Also, if thats the mid 80's MIA Predator, its killer with either a pair of 59's or a 59/C5 combo.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

I bought it about 2 years ago, and have never really been able to find much info on it. I think it's made of poplar, but I'm not sure.

Here's a picture, though it doesn't photograph very well

It was very inexpensive, but it plays wonderfully and sounds great with the Seymours. I've added locking tuners as well, and with a new nut (and maybe an American Strat bridge), I would have little reason to use anything else.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

That looks cool. As much as I like Peavey, it amazes me how many different guitars they put the same name on.

Here's mine:

Yours looks like it has the Wolfgang style neck on it. I don't think I've ever seen that before. Very cool.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

As I look at your pic more, I believe that you don't have a pickguard. That changes things a bit, because I assume you don't want to cut holes in your guitar to mount switches. So, if you use push/pull pots, the wiring simply becomes this:

http://www.seymourduncan.com/website/support/schematics/2hum_vol_tone_3way-w-split.html

Just do to both pups, what they show for one. I realize that that 3-way isn't like yours, but you won't need to even mess with that part. Just take the red/white wire to the center of the push/pull switch. The one other thing I would do different is, instead of taking the bottom of the switch to ground, take the top terminal instead. This will give you a split when you pull the knob, rather than have it in.

Another thing you can do is, take the top terminal to the hot of the volume control, (your pups black wire), instead of ground. That will give you the adjustable coil, instead of the stud coil when split.

And one more easy mod, half that switch is wasted. Just use the other side for the other pup, and you'll only need one push/pull pot. That also means that you'll have them both split at the same time.

And yet another mod. Use two push/pull pots, one to split both pups, the other to select inside or outside coils. If one of those options sounds better than another, let me know, and I can make a custom diagram.

Artie.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Here's one of the real simple diagrams I made that shows two push/pull pots used to:

1. Split both pups.
2. Select inside or outside coils.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

It's true that I have no pickguard, but I also have no reservations about drilling holes (the switches I'd be getting would be small ones).

I still think I'd like to go with this idea (quoted from my last post), if possible:

Regarding the coil splitting - I was talking about installing a switch that would allow for three positions - #1 would be just the regular humbucker, #2 would be a coil split on that humbucker, and #3 would be a coil split with hum-cancel (I've been told it's doable, dunno if the source is reliable though).

That is, two switches - one for each humbucker. I think switches would clearer and easier to use than push/pulls.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

It's true that I have no pickguard, but I also have no reservations about drilling holes (the switches I'd be getting would be small ones).

I still think I'd like to go with this idea (quoted from my last post), if possible:



That is, two switches - one for each humbucker. I think switches would clearer and easier to use than push/pulls.

Cool . . . I'm pretty sure that I have that somewhere in my "archives". If I can find it, I'll post it. If I can't, I'll make a new one. Probably be tomorrow.

Artie

Edit: Just noticed something. When you say:

Regarding the coil splitting - I was talking about installing a switch that would allow for three positions - #1 would be just the regular humbucker, #2 would be a coil split on that humbucker, and #3 would be a coil split with hum-cancel (I've been told it's doable, dunno if the source is reliable though).

Keep in mind, that in order for a pup to be hum-cancelling, it requires two coils. The humbucker by itself is humcancelling, but if you split it, it won't be. Unless, of course, you mix it with a coil from the other humbucker. I think I can work something up here. Let me mess with this a bit.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

This is what I was told on Harmony Central (again, not sure of the accuracy):

in the first position, it's all humbucker, in the middle it's single coil, and in the last it's single coil but with the other coil on to kill the hum. i forget what that is called. but it's very slick. pretty easy, too.

the sounds are awesome, too. i find myself using the single coil a lot, but mostly for clean stuff. it hums like a bitch with a lot of gain, but the last position takes care of that. it alters the sound though, in a way eor really can't describe. somewhere between one coil and two, i guess. one and a half?

My Ibanez S540 seems to something kinda similar to this. It has a H/S/H configuration. When its 5-way switch is in the center position, it has single coil qualities, but no hum.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

There's a couple different things they might be refering to there, but basically, with a dual humbucker guitar, you only have a choice of the following "humbucking" combinations:

The first three are, of course, the standard configuration that you have now.
#4 has both coils split to the outside, and #5 has both coils split to the inside. #6 is an oddball that gives you both 'buckers in an inside/outside array.
Not sure how useful that would actually be, but you could do it.

Then, you'ld have all the different single-coil modes that wouldn't be hum cancelling.

So, what I'll probably do is, show you two or three different variations, and the pup combo's that you'ld get with each, and you can decide from there.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

I don't quite understand the diagram. Which switches, the main pickup selector or the two new toggles are being switched here?

I'm less concerned about strange combinations of the two humbuckers than I am having the ability to play through just the bridge pickup with coil split, or just the neck pickup with the coil split. Any subsequent combinations are icing on the cake.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Sorry. Thats one of those diagrams that I've looked at so many times, I forget that others don't know what I've drawn. :smack:

In that pic, any two pups that are the same color, are connected together in "humbucking" mode. The first 3 positions are simply what you have now, with a standard 3-way switch:

1. neck
2. neck & bridge
3. bridge

Positions #4, #5, and #6, are just one possible combination that you could have if we wired up a couple of toggle switches the right way. And of course, there's a number of other ways it could be wired up also.

Tomorrow, I'll post a couple diagrams that will show the different ways you can achieve the results you want. It'll just depend on what switches you want to use, and how you want them to operate. Either way, its fairly straight-forward. Just different.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Okay, I get it now... That's actually really interesting, I would love to be able to have those combinations, or at least 4 & 5...

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Shouldn't be too much problem. I just doodled up a couple things real quick.
I'll post "neater" diagrams tomorrow.

 

[Aja]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Great. How many and what kind of switches am I gonna need? I can pick up some tomorrow afternoon, since the bus stops at the mall, where I can get to Radioshack.

 

[Boston Joe]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

ArtieToo,

I tried the spin-a-split on a middle pickup. It's effective, but I realized afterwards that I had reversed the hot wire in the mid pickup to compensate for its odd wiring and magnetic polarity (it's a Jem HS-2). As a result, the dummy coil is active in the split. But I'm sure the mod will sound much better with a hotter coil active.

 

[Artie]

Re: 3-way switch for coil-splitting: wiring help needed

Yeah . . . I really want to try that sometime. I've also wondered about doing this other idea I had. The blend-a-split. Seems like it would work great with some high-output 'buckers where it wouldn't hurt to lose a bit of output, by the resistance thats added across the pup:

You just fade from one coil split, to full 'bucker, to the other coil split.

Edit: Hmmm . . . just thinking. Use a 1 Meg pot, use another 1 Meg for the volume, and the pup will still only "see" a 500k load. Shouldn't be any loss of output at all.