80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

C

CarlosG

Member
Hi!
I'm big fan 80s hard rock/glam metal bands. I love their guitar tone.
My favourite bands are: Ratt, Van Halen, Def Leppard, Guns n' Roses, White Lion (Vito Bratta era), Ozzy Osbourne (Jake E Lee era and Zakk Wylde era), Motley Crue e.t.c
I have Fender Stratocaster, alder body, maple neck, rosewood fingerboard with stainless stell pickguard. I tried Duncan JB, Screamin Demon, Custom Custom, Dimarzio Tone Zone.
Custom Custom is the best for me.
I have Marshall Valvestate 8280 with 2 celestions G12T.
What I need to get closer to their sounds?
I was thinking over Boss SD-1, equalizer, delay, and change one g12t to v30.
What do you think?
Sorry for my english
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

1) ditch the g12t...btw, g12t-what? T75? Although in any case...not what they used. Potential speakers include g12-80 (old vintage version), Mesa MC-90 (its closest modern relative), g12-65, g12k-85 / g12-k100. Greenbacks won't work, not enough wattage in a 2x12
2) the v30 hadnt been invented nvented yet, it's a late-80s product and part of the 90s metal sound. Ditto on the t75
3) the 3 big pickups of the era that you haven't used are: Duncan Distortion, DiMarzio Super Distortion, and Duncan Invader... the middle ground is the Duncan Distortion
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

PS looked into it and with the 8280, your safe wattage speaker choice is probably gonna be between Mesa/Celestion Black Shadow MC90 (90w) and Celestion g12k85 / k100 (same speaker they uprated it from 85 to 100w without changing the design)

V30 and g12-65 doesn't safely cut it, not reliably. And Greenbacks, definitely not and will blow up for sure.
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

I think it sounds like you have a very well-suited rig for your purposes. You don't really tell how you are dissatisfied with it at present, or what you want it to do that it isn't presently doing. This makes things a bit hard for us. This is especially so because the bands mentioned have very different sounds: Guns N' Roses in particular have guitar sounds that to me are very different from most of the other ones, which are all rather different on a smaller scale. It might be that you either need to recalibrate your amp or spend some time getting the style of those players down.

I don't think there is much reason changing speakers at this point. The speakers that are in there should be able to get you in the ballpark, and messing around with speakers quickly become expensive if you don't know what you are looking for!

What you probably will need is a chorus and a delay effect of some sort, preferably in the fx loop. For chorus, if you can afford it, I don't think you can do better than the reissued Boss DC-2W. I hate pedals and try to go rack whenever I can, so somebody else will have to suggest a delay pedal, as I don't see myself ever buying one. This leads me to the next point, which I am astonished that nobody has mentioned: Make use of the stereo capabilities of your amp. This is a big one: put the chorus and the delay in the loop (I hope the loop is well-designed), and put them on one side only. This is going to make your sound a lot bigger.

EDIT: Is there a built-in chorus in the amp? That might serve your purposes well enough, then.
 
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Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

The Metal Zone sounds, to me, like an attempt to recreate the guitar tones of ...And Justice for All through a Crate G10XL.
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

OK Serious answer....

On the Cheap, here is my suggestion:

#1 That 8020 really does not need anything juicing the front end. Just a matter of dialing the right bass/mid/treble
- However, if you must, as mentioned, try a Mooer Black Secret. Low gain, high output, etc...

#2 The key effects for basically all 80's tunes are:
- Short delay
- Long delay
- Chorus
- Reverb

While there are others, that will get you through 90% of it. More on that later....
If you could have ONLY two - get a delay and a chorus

#3 I suggest:
Mooer Reecho
Mooer Mooer Ensemble King

If two more:
Mooer Ana echo
Mooer Shimverb

#4 Why these?

1. You need two delays at a minimum. This is not an issue if all you are doing is playing a song and moving on. Live it takes more. One is for a very short metallic kind of delay. The guitar sound with a whole lot of crunch is this tone. Think Cum On Feel The Noise, Or Looks that Kill.

The other delay is a 350ms or so long delay with repeats for leads and such. Think the intro to Women by Def Lep. A crap ton of solos have that sound.

2. Chorus is another key.

Long Delay + Chorus = most of Hysteria. Short delay + chorus = Talk Dirty or I Wanna Rock/Not ZgzOnna Take It.\


You will go very very far using only those two things.

3. Every clean part ever played in the 80's is either a Chorus w/ Reverb (Coming Home, Scorps) or a Chorus plus Delay (Intro to Rock Rock Til You Drop). Wanted man = very slight Chorus + Delay

Every now and again you'll need something weird delay-wise like Welcome to the Jungle intro, the slap on Ratt You're In Love, or Ain't Talkin' Bout Love, etc. A lot of the Scorps is just distortion and Reverb, so again, a little air is never bad.

If you want get another pedal for 'just that' sound, I'll suggest the Mooer Mod Factory. Then you can add Phaser for whatever VH tune, or Flange for Down Boys, etc....

Again - if playing live, multi fx is key. The delay on Panama is not the delay on round and round is not the delay on etc. etc. But for bedroom playing, and general jamming. Two will do!


Again - all in the loop!
 
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Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

Honestly ..VH had a sound (& style) that was distinctly different from the generic "hair-metal" sound of most of the other bands mentioned (Rat pedal into anything..) and there are endless pedals & entire rigs just geared for that VH sound.
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

Aceman said:
I have used both a real/original (1980) Rat and a Mooer Black Secret into a VS100R with very satisfying results....
Click to expand...

I had a nice US small box RAT. But then I started using modeling amps, and that in front of a dirty amp equaled nothing! It was like not having it on at all. Very weird.

Sold it to a friend and it was destroyed in a house fire. [emoji853]

But they are great sounding pedals, especially when I had my ‘81 Les Paul Standard with a DiMarzio Super Distortion at the bridge. That’s the sound right there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

Phantasmagoria said:
Honestly ..VH had a sound (& style) that was distinctly different from the generic "hair-metal" sound of most of the other bands mentioned (Rat pedal into anything..) and there are endless pedals & entire rigs just geared for that VH sound.
Click to expand...

There is no such thing as a generic hair metal sound: Those bands were remarkably diverse in their approaches, and for those who actually bother to listen it isn't hard to hear it. There are certainly as large differences in approach and result between the other bands mentioned as it is between either of them and Van Halen. This may sound harsh, but I am so sick and tired that threads like these, where people are genuinely trying to help, are overrun by people who don't get the style, and have nothing but trite prejudices to add. But pray tell us which of the bands have identical "generic" tones, so that we may point our fingers and scornfully laugh at you.

EDIT: I suppose you could argue that it is possible to get a generic tone in the sense that you can find one tone that, with minor modifications such as those outlined by Aceman above, can be used for most such bands. This, of course, is not unique to 80s heavy metal, and it is still likely that the resultant tone is closer to the brown tone than to many of the outliers within 80s heavy metal. I'll skip the tone vs. sound discussion here, because that would only complicate the matter further.
 
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Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

Not possible... so many different sounds. But if you want quintessential

Super Strat with SD Invaders, JBs or Dimarzio SDs into a Tube Screamer style circuit into a high gain 80s Marshall into 65 or 75w 12s with bumped mids and reverb and chorus
 
Re: 80s Hard Rock/glam Metal Tone

Sirion said:
There is no such thing as a generic hair metal sound: Those bands were remarkably diverse in their approaches, and for those who actually bother to listen it isn't hard to hear it.
Click to expand...

Respectfully, I disagree. The sound on say Invasion of Your Privacy "What You Give" vs Dokken Back For The Attack "Kiss Of Death" with the exception of some hand 'English' is pretty dang similar....IMO.

Again - ignore the few (very few) bands with a distinctive personality and the majority are, in a very general sense, what I said: Hot Rodded Marshall, Delay, perhaps Chorus....specifics may vary, but overall, that's the genre.

NegativeEase said:
Not possible... so many different sounds. But if you want quintessential

Super Strat with SD Invaders, JBs or Dimarzio SDs into a Tube Screamer style circuit into a high gain 80s Marshall into 65 or 75w 12s with bumped mids and reverb and chorus
Click to expand...

Again - there are really very few "distinctive" personalities. The guitar players for Keel, Loudness, Roughcutt, and on and on and on....Hot rodded Marshall, delay, chorus, in some measure more or less.

As for your recommendation on a SUperD or Invader....and a TS9...that's a pretty early version if you ask me. Almost a 78-81 version or photo sound. By the time Hair bands were Hair bands...

SD's, JB's, Rats, and ADA's, JMP's, or Soldano's or a tweaked Marshall were the order of the day. If you ask me.


But as you said - no doubt a variety of approaches in the specifics. However - DEFINITELY mids! Back when even guitarists knew how to cut through the mix with razor sharp punchy tones!
 
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