Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

[PierceOkken]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Unlike “plenty of people” i would rather spend 5 minutes and 100-200 dollars on a new bolt on than 600-800 dollrs on a headstock repair. I understand you can repair things, but i don’t have an infinite source of cash.

 

[Obsessive Compulsive]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

E-II horizon 2's shouldnt have existed in 2013, unless it's verrrry late in the year and one of the first thus branded

Horizon 2's should still be ESP Standard Series, possibly with the weird blocky as hell ESP logo that popped up briefly and replaced old script logos (I've only seen it on an Eclipse 2 though), possibly not

Horizon 3's, meanwhile, would still be LTD Elite....


Unless they piloted the branding for a few markets earlier?

Yeah I could be wrong. I just assume from the serial number as follows. Maybe someone can shed a light on the serial number too?

 

[Adieu]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Unlike “plenty of people” i would rather spend 5 minutes and 100-200 dollars on a new bolt on than 600-800 dollrs on a headstock repair. I understand you can repair things, but i don’t have an infinite source of cash.

Its precisely the other way around... $200 for a neck repair, $600 (used) - 1k for a neck.

And, again, I ain't seen brokeneck mij ESPs and neither has anyone else in this thread.

 

[BloodRose]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Since ordering a new neck for an japanese ESP/E-II would be pointless.

Wouldnt be pointless if you get the correct headstock!!! : )

haha Just had to say it

 

[Adieu]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Yeah I could be wrong. I just assume from the serial number as follows. Maybe someone can shed a light on the serial number too?

JDM maybe? Or an early pilot market?

By E-II dating format it'd be a *2012* out of the ESP Standard factory... but they weren't distributed to North America, where most English language info originates from, with E-II branding until 2014 if not later. If it were bought in North America, it wouldve said ESP on the headstock and have SS markings instead for that year.

Anyway this is what best matches the format and makes sense....but source onky confirms it after 2016


"--------- from 2016 ----------

8 DIGITS stamped in the back of the headstock:
BNNNNYYP
B = Brand designation prefix:
E - ESP
ES - E-II
NNNN = ????
YY = last two digits of the year
P = place of manufacture (Factory designation):
1 - ESP Custom Shop
2 - ESP Tokyo Factory
3 - ESP Standard Factory
"

"8" digits where ES is treated as a single digit lol.



Btw if you CAN see grain through that finish on the back of the neck, easiest way to 95% verify authenticity is to look for quartersawn onepiece grain (at least on boltons).... might be multipiece but very straight and parallel down the line on neckthrus?

 

[Adieu]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

How much do they want, anyway? You looking at this particular one because of low cost ($800 or less big ESP markets, $1000 or less places that you can usually only get them by buying international)?

Or because you know seller and/or can try before you buy?

 

[Jacew]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Its precisely the other way around... $200 for a neck repair, $600 (used) - 1k for a neck.

And, again, I ain't seen brokeneck mij ESPs and neither has anyone else in this thread.

Bolt on necks are not that expensive.

 

[AlexR]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

For most real players choosing a guitar merely due to a chance of a complication from a mildly possible future occurrence is utterly stupid.

Choose the guitar due to direct playing related concerns, and if you are a bit OCD then add in resale value as well.

 

[Adieu]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Bolt on necks are not that expensive.

Authentic ESP branded bolton necks are the most expensive of em all. A neck is the most expensive part of a bolton guitar, so for axes that run $2k+ msrp whaddya expect???

It's some of the best stuff around. AND it "helps" push up the used partout price that attached to a random strat, superstrat, or LTD china body, you suddenly have something that looks like an 80s custom shop oneoff and sells for $1200 on ebay

Then there's the whole "people don't take them off without reason, cuz they cost significantly more than refrets...which they rarely need anyway" thing

And new ones can only be custom ordered and only for verified owners, none of that go on Amazon press buy it now like with FMIC.

Granted, THEORETICALLY, vintage fender USA necks got even more value due to antics potential, but realistically THAT market is so infested with decals and knockoffs that nobody takes it seriously. Oh yeah that dude is TOTALLY parting out a genuine original 1950s strat with a playable clean neck, suuuuuure lol.... and, also, from a performance standpoint Fender's got nothing on em.

 

[Lake Placid Blues]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Posted by Zerb many. many, years ago:

IMPO:All things being 100% equal and in a perfect world,

The bolt on will have a faster, "snappier", more articulate attack and will be tonally "neutral". Some will consider this neutrality "bright"

The set neck will have a slightly more sluggish response due to the glue in the joint hindering the transfer of vibration slightly, and will have attenuated highs compared to the bolt on.

A neckthru will have a strong low midrange spike which will not increase sustain but will give that impression psychoacoustically. Also mildly attenuated highs (notably less than a set neck, though), and the response will be pretty much halfway between the bolt on and the set neck as a result of the larger surface area of the body wing/neck joint reducing the effects of the glue joint itself. The faster response and "amped" mids are a direct result of the neck going all the way through as one piece, causing the vibrations to hit the bridge (response improvement) and butt end of the guitar (midrance accentuation) before they spread to the wings.

These differences will be both audible and and in feel, and will be noticed. But they will not be immense as some make it out to be, but more in the direction of an extreme pickup swap or a bridge swap from their total impact. Again, audible and tangible, but not necessarily a "make or break" factor. A change of body wood or neck would have significantly more impact.

In pure theory, if truly 100% identical and built correctly, the bolt on will actually have just minimally more sustain because of the glue´s dampening effect present in both the set neck and the neckthru. In practice and our more than slightly flawed world: all 3 suck /rule just as much as each other

And the tonal difference is there, as is the difference in response, but these come down to feel and personal taste. Some people like the fast, articulate response of a bholt on, some prefer the attenuated highs and tube like "sag" of a set neck, and some prefer the effortless playability, low midrange chunk and "middle of the road" response of a neck thru (all other things being equal between the 3)

I can live with all 3, but prefer bolt on.

 

[Ascension]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Curious how set necks are more comfortable? Tough to imagine a guitar more ergonomic as far as left-hand access than my totally heel-less Soloist.

They are absolutely not. I own a number of neck through Carvins there is no downside to that construction and i prefer it over any other. They are super stable have amazing sustain and there is no neck joint to move so??

 

[Discharged]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

One huge weakness of net thru is that if the neck breaks the guitar is shot.

Given the inherent strenghth the lamination gives, the actual possibility of something like this ever happening is close to nil.

Set necks also have better sustain.

This is a blanket statement with absolutely no empirical data to support it. And, given the inherent properties of rigidity the neck-through design gives, I'd say that's exactly the opposite as what you just said… if you would consider my first-hand experience actually owning neck-through basses and guitars, that is.

/Peter

 

[formula73]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

In a drunken blackout on stage moment, probably 14 years ago, I held this thing perpendicular to a diamond plate stage and smashed it down with all my drunken rage so hard it bounced. Finish chips, busted tuner, no problem. Neckthru tank.

 

[Chistopher]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

In a drunken blackout on stage moment, probably 14 years ago, I held this thing perpendicular to a diamond plate stage and smashed it down with all my drunken rage so hard it bounced. Finish chips, busted tuner, no problem. Neckthru tank.

When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons, what the hell am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!

 

[RorySquier]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

I've had my Yamaha RGX Custom now for about 30 years and it's a neck-thru design. I've had no problems with neck breakage at all and the guitar feels very solid with the neck-thru design. The neck is a 5-piece maple/mahogany laminate for extra stability.

;>)/

 

[AlexR]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Most neckthrough guitars are built (as said already) with multiple laminations....not only with orientation of grain altered for natural stability but with different wood types most often chosen to add strength. Long glue joins will add stability over plain grain, so out of the typical offerings of the 3 types I'd call neckthrough the theoretical strongest neck.

And I'm not at all buying the 'bolt on has the most 'likely' highest sustain' if we're talking theory either. Of the neck joins it has the least area in compressed immediate contact - which is the base of the neck rout. You cannot at all count either the sides or the end as they are more likely to be a dampened connection than anything else - even with the most tight neck join seen on the planet.
That rout base also only has 4 isolated spots of real tension applied. Plus the two surfaces are raw rout + neck heel with finish on. Hardly close even to a typical glue join where the whole mortice and tenon is an intimate fit with glue which in almost all cases pulls the surfaces together as it dries. Plus in testing of the main glues used, the finished product is hard and brittle - something that is very adept at passing on energy with no losses.
Nope, nothing doing there.

I'd be putting my theoretical money on neckthrough.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Yah, most neck-through guitars have multi-piece laminated necks. This makes them so sturdy that as a practical consideration neck breakage is nearly irrelevant.

While they exhibit good natural sustain when unplugged, the extra stiffness also means they don't take off quite the same way at stage volume. IME a laminated neck tends to feel nearly the same at volume as it does when played quietly. Some may appreciate this characteristic. Myself, I love to feel a guitar come alive in my hands.

I know the OP said he isn't interested in aspects of tone or feel. But given today's much lower stage volumes, for me liveliness in a neck is even more important than it used to be.

 

[RorySquier]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

Here's a video that shows how to better connect your bolt-on or screw in neck for better reinforcement and better sustain.

;>)/

 

[ehdwuld]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

In a drunken blackout on stage moment, probably 14 years ago, I held this thing perpendicular to a diamond plate stage and smashed it down with all my drunken rage so hard it bounced. Finish chips, busted tuner, no problem. Neckthru tank.

Dangit
Now I want a neck thru VEE

Dangit

 

[formula73]

Re: Advantages/ Disadvantages of a Neck-thru

When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons, what the hell am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!

Who’s ready to make some science??