Advantages of having NO tone pot?
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DeadSkinSlayer3
Guest
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
Add's brightness.
Add's brightness.
Curly
Moe's Bluesman
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
well ... I believe technically, it doesn't "add brightness" - it just doesn't cut anything ....
for example, Richard Thomson uses a custom Ferrington ax with a P90 neck/ strat mid/ Broadcaster bridge, with just 3 volumes - the tone is a result of the blend of those controls
a Fender tweed Champ is an amp with just a volume control, no tone pot, but the tone varies with the gain of the volume, to an extent
well ... I believe technically, it doesn't "add brightness" - it just doesn't cut anything ....
for example, Richard Thomson uses a custom Ferrington ax with a P90 neck/ strat mid/ Broadcaster bridge, with just 3 volumes - the tone is a result of the blend of those controls
a Fender tweed Champ is an amp with just a volume control, no tone pot, but the tone varies with the gain of the volume, to an extent
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Metalman_666
Well-known member
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
well I think it doesn't really make much of a difference not having a tone control. If you don't use it, then what's the point? But it's nice to have it there, just in case you decide to use it once in awhile.
well I think it doesn't really make much of a difference not having a tone control. If you don't use it, then what's the point? But it's nice to have it there, just in case you decide to use it once in awhile.
rocksoldier
New member
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
I think it "opens up" the sound of the guitar to not have a tone pot.
I disconnected mine and liked it better then original, and also: why have it there if you doensn´t use it anyway?
And imo it works great to cut some treble by just roll back the volume control a little bit.
I think it "opens up" the sound of the guitar to not have a tone pot.
I disconnected mine and liked it better then original, and also: why have it there if you doensn´t use it anyway?
And imo it works great to cut some treble by just roll back the volume control a little bit.
STRATDELUXER97
Stratoblaster Tone Meister
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
Curly is right...The tone control and cap "shunt away" highs to ground as you roll your tone control towards 0...The pickups also see some loading of the pot..The higher the pot readings,the less loading the circuit has to deal with...A 250K pot in a Les Paul in place of a 500k loads the circuit more..
The ultimate scenario is to use a 'No Load Tone Pot"....When this pot is on 10 it removes the pot's dc resistance and the cap...
We percieve no tone control as being brighter and when you remove the loads involved,in theory it is...You also gain a bit more volume from your pickups...
John
Curly said:
Curly is right...The tone control and cap "shunt away" highs to ground as you roll your tone control towards 0...The pickups also see some loading of the pot..The higher the pot readings,the less loading the circuit has to deal with...A 250K pot in a Les Paul in place of a 500k loads the circuit more..
The ultimate scenario is to use a 'No Load Tone Pot"....When this pot is on 10 it removes the pot's dc resistance and the cap...
We percieve no tone control as being brighter and when you remove the loads involved,in theory it is...You also gain a bit more volume from your pickups...
John
RG 2570
New member
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
I now like to use a no load tone pot,which when on 10 is the same as having no tone pot(no treble cut,or any output loss) but still enables you to turn it down for warmer clean tones.
if you choose not to use a tone pot you can expect the tone to be brighter(upper highs) and have more juice(output).]
the no load pot is the best of both worlds
I now like to use a no load tone pot,which when on 10 is the same as having no tone pot(no treble cut,or any output loss) but still enables you to turn it down for warmer clean tones.
if you choose not to use a tone pot you can expect the tone to be brighter(upper highs) and have more juice(output).]
the no load pot is the best of both worlds
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
In my experience the only genuine 'advantage' would be if it made it easier for you to play and maintain your composure and focus.
It gets in the way for some players, but in the end it has no bearing on your 'tone'.
When you 'dial-in' a tone that you hear, you use all of the components and parameters available to you...Guitar, Amp, effects, etc.
If you removed a tone control and somehow gained a bit more brightness or 'openess' ('openess' would be the result of added top end frequencies) all it means is that you would not have to dial that in somewhere else.
Either way (with or without tone control) you are working to achieve the tones you hear.
Maybe a tone control helps you get there with less work?
Also...
The majority of amps, pickups, effects and electronics were designed with guitars that used tone pots. A sweet sounding strat pickup is tested in a guitar with 250k vol pots and 250k tone pots. There is nothing wrong with 'loading' the pickup with resistance. In reality that is all part of the tone shaping. When you mod an effect it is often just changing the values of the key 'tone' components (resistors and caps) with the occasional chip swap. Same thing here. It is all just a means to an end and ultimately it is the end that means something.
If it helps for your playing style then it is a big advantage. In the end it makes no difference in your 'sound'.
For what it is worth I have modded every guitar I own to a have a single volume only. I do all my live shaping from the vol pot.
Hope to help.
In my experience the only genuine 'advantage' would be if it made it easier for you to play and maintain your composure and focus.
It gets in the way for some players, but in the end it has no bearing on your 'tone'.
When you 'dial-in' a tone that you hear, you use all of the components and parameters available to you...Guitar, Amp, effects, etc.
If you removed a tone control and somehow gained a bit more brightness or 'openess' ('openess' would be the result of added top end frequencies) all it means is that you would not have to dial that in somewhere else.
Either way (with or without tone control) you are working to achieve the tones you hear.
Maybe a tone control helps you get there with less work?
Also...
The majority of amps, pickups, effects and electronics were designed with guitars that used tone pots. A sweet sounding strat pickup is tested in a guitar with 250k vol pots and 250k tone pots. There is nothing wrong with 'loading' the pickup with resistance. In reality that is all part of the tone shaping. When you mod an effect it is often just changing the values of the key 'tone' components (resistors and caps) with the occasional chip swap. Same thing here. It is all just a means to an end and ultimately it is the end that means something.
If it helps for your playing style then it is a big advantage. In the end it makes no difference in your 'sound'.
For what it is worth I have modded every guitar I own to a have a single volume only. I do all my live shaping from the vol pot.
Hope to help.
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
I think that Rodney said it best. My personal preference is this: replace the the tone pot with a switch that allows switching in different values of cpacitors across the pup, from no capacitance, to small, up to large. This provides a far greater range of tones than the standard tone control, and, of course, no tone control is one of the options. It works best if you use a pup with a high resonant frequency, since you can only bring it down with the caps.
I think that Rodney said it best. My personal preference is this: replace the the tone pot with a switch that allows switching in different values of cpacitors across the pup, from no capacitance, to small, up to large. This provides a far greater range of tones than the standard tone control, and, of course, no tone control is one of the options. It works best if you use a pup with a high resonant frequency, since you can only bring it down with the caps.
STRATDELUXER97
Stratoblaster Tone Meister
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
I always tweak my tone caps to my liking and make my own no load tone pots...The no load tone pot is a no brainer really....
John
I always tweak my tone caps to my liking and make my own no load tone pots...The no load tone pot is a no brainer really....
John
Artie
Peaveyologist
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
John, you're too hard on yourself. I'll still think you're pretty smart even if you do use one. :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
Seriously though, most guitars come with tone controls. So I use that as the "norm". Modifying the guitar by removing that control will, in fact, "add brightness", even though you and Curly are technically correct.
I've always viewed the electronic interaction of pickup-coil/volume pot/tone circuit as a bit of a balancing act. Simply "adding highs" is not always going to be desirable. You just have to find that "sweet spot" in the whole package.
Artie
("Always" he says. . . yeah, since last November anyway.)
STRATDELUXER97 said:
John, you're too hard on yourself. I'll still think you're pretty smart even if you do use one. :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
Seriously though, most guitars come with tone controls. So I use that as the "norm". Modifying the guitar by removing that control will, in fact, "add brightness", even though you and Curly are technically correct.
I've always viewed the electronic interaction of pickup-coil/volume pot/tone circuit as a bit of a balancing act. Simply "adding highs" is not always going to be desirable. You just have to find that "sweet spot" in the whole package.
Artie
("Always" he says. . . yeah, since last November anyway.)
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WITH FULL DISTORTION
F. Hails Railsologist
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
what is that "no load tone pot"?
i have a charvel fusion deluxe and it has just one (that i believe is a volume pot?)pot.
and 2 pickups(actually, i just have the bridge, cause no money for the neck yet)
.
****, i´m dizzy in this thread
Q
what is that "no load tone pot"?
i have a charvel fusion deluxe and it has just one (that i believe is a volume pot?)pot.
and 2 pickups(actually, i just have the bridge, cause no money for the neck yet)
.
****, i´m dizzy in this thread
Q
STRATDELUXER97
Stratoblaster Tone Meister
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
Artie....I Like removing the pot and the cap from my guitar circuits,especially with humbuckers,as it gives me every last bit of presence I can get from the pickup(s) The pot takes me 5 minutes to make and so I do that before getting the pot into my guitar... :wink:
John
ArtieToo said:John, you're too hard on yourself. I'll still think you're pretty smart even if you do use one. :laugh2: :laugh2: :laugh2:
Seriously though, most guitars come with tone controls. So I use that as the "norm". Modifying the guitar by removing that control will, in fact, "add brightness", even though you and Curly are technically correct.
I've always viewed the electronic interaction of pickup-coil/volume pot/tone circuit as a bit of a balancing act. Simply "adding highs" is not always going to be desirable. You just have to find that "sweet spot" in the whole package.
Artie
("Always" he says. . . yeah, since last November anyway.)
Artie....I Like removing the pot and the cap from my guitar circuits,especially with humbuckers,as it gives me every last bit of presence I can get from the pickup(s) The pot takes me 5 minutes to make and so I do that before getting the pot into my guitar... :wink:
John
Artie
Peaveyologist
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
Lets say you have a 500k tone pot. When that pot is on "10", you'll still have 500k ohms in series with your tone control capacitor. There will be a certain amount of high-frequencies shunted to ground. Even if its not much.
A "no-load" pot, is one that either has a small "cut" made in the carbon track within the pot, or, will have some nail-polish, or paint applied to the last bit of wiper travel, effectively insulating the tone control pot completely from the circuit. Its as if the tone control wasn't there at all. Thus, no electrical "load". It will give you a bit more high-end in the virtual "off" position.
WITH FULL DISTORTION said:
Lets say you have a 500k tone pot. When that pot is on "10", you'll still have 500k ohms in series with your tone control capacitor. There will be a certain amount of high-frequencies shunted to ground. Even if its not much.
A "no-load" pot, is one that either has a small "cut" made in the carbon track within the pot, or, will have some nail-polish, or paint applied to the last bit of wiper travel, effectively insulating the tone control pot completely from the circuit. Its as if the tone control wasn't there at all. Thus, no electrical "load". It will give you a bit more high-end in the virtual "off" position.
Artie
Peaveyologist
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
Yeah, I have to try this sometime. I did it once, by accident, on the guitar that had the Stag Mags in it. (I accidently left the ground off the tone control cap.) In that particular situation, it was way too bright.
But it might be interesting to try with my `59's.
STRATDELUXER97 said:
Yeah, I have to try this sometime. I did it once, by accident, on the guitar that had the Stag Mags in it. (I accidently left the ground off the tone control cap.) In that particular situation, it was way too bright.
But it might be interesting to try with my `59's.
STRATDELUXER97
Stratoblaster Tone Meister
Re: Advantages of having NO tone pot?
The No Load tone pot mod doesn't make things "way too bright" but it adds that little bit or extra presence and snap to your tone..Sometimes,especially with 500k pots that don't load the circuit much anyway,the pot is pretty subliminal...You do hear the effect of the No Load tone pot more on a strat with the 250k pots though..It's a cool mod and you lose nothing...
John
ArtieToo said:Yeah, I have to try this sometime. I did it once, by accident, on the guitar that had the Stag Mags in it. (I accidently left the ground off the tone control cap.) In that particular situation, it was way too bright.
But it might be interesting to try with my `59's.
The No Load tone pot mod doesn't make things "way too bright" but it adds that little bit or extra presence and snap to your tone..Sometimes,especially with 500k pots that don't load the circuit much anyway,the pot is pretty subliminal...You do hear the effect of the No Load tone pot more on a strat with the 250k pots though..It's a cool mod and you lose nothing...
John
