Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

[Progbusters]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

On my Epiphone Les Paul, I have Pearly Gates. It does the range of styles. If I wanted to fake the middle pickup, I'd leave it but disconnect it and just take out the magnet?

http://www.seymourduncan.com/pickup/pearly-gates-set

 

[blueman335]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Hi all,

I'm back from holidays and thinking to make the move!

Based on all posts here and on advice got from Seymour Duncan customer service (Arwin), I am inclined to go for the Whole Lotta Humbucker set and I was thinking about a P-Rail Neck for the middle HB. This is all on paper, that's why I am asking your wise advise before adding them to the chart.

I wouldn't sandwich a P-Rails between two HB's, too many magnet fields overlapping, I think you'd be disappointed.

 

[giopas]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Fair point. What type of HB would you suggest then?

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

 

[Southbound Suarez]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Epi LP Customs still have the cheap PU's, even today. Ironically, they cost more than 2 HB Customs, which have the upgraded Probucker HB's.

I'd recommend a set of good PAF's for the neck and bridge, which rules out Gibson '57 Classics, which are the worst sounding PAF I've ever owned (and I have a couple dozen models of PAFs, counting bridge and neck PU's). Duncan makes some great PAF's, like Seths, WLH's, and A2P's. If you want to go Gibson, Burstbuckers (not Burstbucker pros) are a good choice.

For the middle slot, you need to know that whatever you put in there won't sound the same as it would in the bridge or neck slot. There's issues from magnetic fields and 6 coils laying next to each other like sardines, and middle HB's don't sit under the string nodes was well. I'd go with either a P-90 (bridge model), like GFS Mean 90's, or a bridge PAF. The middle slot is weaker and doesn't usually have great tones, so beefing it up with a bridge PU helps balance output.

Didn't Peter Frampton use his middle position humbucker w/no issues? I'd suggest the middle HB output to be either calibrated against the other two humbuckers, or to provide lesser output than the bridge or neck humbuckers so that some "quack" could be derived when using the neck and middle HB's or middle and bridge HB's ala the stratocaster 5 way. That is if the OP has a 5 way switch.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Didn't Peter Frampton use his middle position humbucker w/no issues? I'd suggest the middle HB output to be either calibrated against the other two humbuckers, or to provide lesser output than the bridge or neck humbuckers so that some "quack" could be derived when using the neck and middle HB's or middle and bridge HB's ala the stratocaster 5 way. That is if the OP has a 5 way switch.

Epi's/Gibson's have 3 way switches, not much 'quack' with those. The best way to wire HHH guitars is with coil cuts so that you pair:

- bridge coil with middle coil
- neck coil with middle coil
- bridge coil with neck coil

This is far more useful than trying to get something good from 3 PU's in HB mode. 6 coils packed like sardines without coil cut isn't that appealing, hence the paucity of HHH guitars on the market.

 

[Securb]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

This is far more useful than trying to get something good from 3 PU's in HB mode. 6 coils packed like sardines without coil cut isn't that appealing, hence the paucity of HHH guitars on the market.

Rick, you continuously confuse what is useful for you with The Gospel. I have been rocking three humbuckers for the past four months, and I am absolutely in love with the sound and the feel of the guitar. We get it you don't like three hum guitars; that doesn't mean they are not an option for other guitar players.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Christine agrees with Bruce.

 

[Aceman]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

In all seriousness - Two hums and P rail in the middle would be Uber-flexible.

ESPECIALLY if you tap the two buckers and get a tripleshot ring! Obviously some switch magic….but Vol, Vol, Vol, master tone with push pull on N/B buckers, the PRail would just be on with volume, standard three way switch

You could run:
- Three singles
- Any pair of singles, n-m, m-b, n-b
- A lone P-90
- Bucker + single as (from neck down) Bn/ms, sn/mB, mB/sb, ms,/Bb
etc….

 

[Demanic]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Those guitars are the reason for the Freeway Switch.

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[blueman335]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Rick, you continuously confuse what is useful for you with The Gospel. I have been rocking three humbuckers for the past four months, and I am absolutely in love with the sound and the feel of the guitar.

Never claimed that it was the gospel. But there's a reason most electric guitar makers have an assortment of HSS and HSH in their line, and almost no one has HHH (Gibson/Epi feel obligated for 'historical' reasons), even though those have been around for 60 years. Never caught on, had plenty of chances to. 'Other players' have spoken with their wallets and avoided HHH in droves. Your 4 months with one is hardly a grass roots movement or indicative of what 99.5% of players are using.

 

[giopas]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Epi's/Gibson's have 3 way switches, not much 'quack' with those. The best way to wire HHH guitars is with coil cuts so that you pair:

- bridge coil with middle coil
- neck coil with middle coil
- bridge coil with neck coil

What is "coil cut"? How to do that and which HB would you suggest for all the three positions?

In all seriousness - Two hums and P rail in the middle would be Uber-flexible.

ESPECIALLY if you tap the two buckers and get a tripleshot ring! Obviously some switch magic….but Vol, Vol, Vol, master tone with push pull on N/B buckers, the PRail would just be on with volume, standard three way switch

You could run:
- Three singles
- Any pair of singles, n-m, m-b, n-b
- A lone P-90
- Bucker + single as (from neck down) Bn/ms, sn/mB, mB/sb, ms,/Bb
etc….

I am not good in magic, yet Could you please better elaborate what you are suggesting? I am not sure I have a push pull option (where would it be by the way?)...

Those guitars are the reason for the Freeway Switch.

I am so bad at DIY that I am pretty sure I would never get a Freeway Switch working

 

[Mincer]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

For the original question, I like the Whole Lotta Humbucker set with a Phat Cat in the middle. I think it would be a nice blend.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Coil cut is also called coil split, where one coil is shut off, giving a single coil sound.

By using push-pulls for coil cut, you can 1) get those individual single coil tones, and 2) combine a bridge slug coil with a middle PU screw coil and make a 'virtual HB' like the 2 and 4 positions on a SSS Strat. Like wise, you can combine the middle PU slug coil with the middle with the neck screw coil and make an addition virtual HB. Virtual HB's give a warmer, less harsh sound than coil cut, but a softer sound than full HB.

If you use 4 push-pulls for the pots:

- each of the 3 volume pots wired for coil cut, with the coils remaining on being the ones above ^

- (optional) wire the tone pot for phase, which gives out-of-phase when the bridge PU is combined with one of the other PU's. When just the bridge PU is on, this push-pull changes which coil is on during coil cut, giving different combinations with the neck & middle PU's

- Not only do you get each PU in full HB & coil cut modes, but you can combine one PU in HB with another in coil cut. Lots of options.

The stock HHH wiring is pretty limited and uninspiring. But when you actually take advantage of what can be done with those 6 coils, you open up all kinds of tone possibilities.

 

[giopas]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Thanks Mincer, do you mean this one in particular? In your opinion combining a Whole Lotta Humbucker set ad this Phat Cat would better allow to expand the sound possibilities of the guitar (without creating too many magnet fields overlapping)?

EDIT: thanks blueman335 for the explanation. But to use 4 push-pull pots I have to replace each single pot right? I see some explanation here for example. I see that probably I would need something like this: Alpha Push-pull Pots #1213 500K-ohm,long shaft pot for Les Paul®, right. But this is something difficult to be done?

 

[Securb]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

But there's a reason most electric guitar makers have an assortment of HSS and HSH in their line, and almost no one has HHH (Gibson/Epi feel obligated for 'historical' reasons)

Yeah, no one but Gibson for purly historical reasons. Thanks for clearing that up for us.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Yeah, no one but Gibson for purly historical reasons. Thanks for clearing that up for us.

I'll clear it up for you even further, almost no one. How many times have you seen live bands and the guitarist had a HHH? How many times have you seen anyone in a band play one of the guitars you linked to?

 

[blueman335]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

EDIT: thanks blueman335 for the explanation. But to use 4 push-pull pots I have to replace each single pot right? I see some explanation ...this is something difficult to be done?

No, simple soldering, nothing hard. 4 push-pulls, the standard ones (like Stewmac's) are fine for Epi's. You don't need long shafts as the wood on Epi LP's isn't as thick as it is on Gibsons. Coil cut wiring is for the screw coil to be on in coil cut more, which for Duncan is black=hot, green=ground and red & white together. To have the slug coil on it's the opposite, with red=hot, white=ground, and black and green together.

 

[Securb]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

I'll clear it up for you even further, almost no one. How many times have you seen live bands and the guitarist had a HHH? How many times did the guitarist have a HSS or HSH?

Are you serious? I just gave you B.C. Rich, Ibanez, Dean, Schecter and Fender. I could include Gretsch, Jackson, Reverend and almost every other guitar manufacturer on the planet. What are you talking about?

 

[Rand-O-Monium]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

OMG,the things I would do to that Kelly...

 

[Southbound Suarez]

Re: Advice on new pickups for Epiphone LP

Coil cut is also called coil split, where one coil is shut off, giving a single coil sound.

By using push-pulls for coil cut, you can 1) get those individual single coil tones, and 2) combine a bridge slug coil with a middle PU screw coil and make a 'virtual HB' like the 2 and 4 positions on a SSS Strat. Like wise, you can combine the middle PU slug coil with the middle with the neck screw coil and make an addition virtual HB. Virtual HB's give a warmer, less harsh sound than coil cut, but a softer sound than full HB.

If you use 4 push-pulls for the pots:

- each of the 3 volume pots wired for coil cut, with the coils remaining on being the ones above ^

- (optional) wire the tone pot for phase, which gives out-of-phase when the bridge PU is combined with one of the other PU's. When just the bridge PU is on, this push-pull changes which coil is on during coil cut, giving different combinations with the neck & middle PU's

- Not only do you get each PU in full HB & coil cut modes, but you can combine one PU in HB with another in coil cut. Lots of options.

The stock HHH wiring is pretty limited and uninspiring. But when you actually take advantage of what can be done with those 6 coils, you open up all kinds of tone possibilities.

Rick I agree that splitting a humbucker utilizing one coil from said humbucker by itself or in combination with the other humbucker single coils would indeed be usable only insofar as the single split coil was at least 6K DCR or > like a Fender single coil. Anything less is going to sound thin and wimpy. All I know about the three humbucker configuration is that some people can make it work for them (Peter Frampton, Ace Frehley, etc.). The "Freeway 6 Way Toggle Switch" is a great idea to use for a project like this. I have a 6 way rotary switch myself.