Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

A

Antihero

New member
I got an Alt 8 bridge p'up for xmas and just got a chance to wire it up. I wired it up without any coil splitting.

The thing is one coil, the one nearest the neck, is way hotter than the other. If you tap the individual coils with a screwdriver thru an amp the one nearest the bridge makes a tenth of the sound as the other coil.

Does the alt 8 have unbalanced coils? Ive gone over my wiring and all looks good and i even disconnected the red wire from the white and it still sounds the same with both unconnected. I also tried grounding out the red and white and the sound doesnt change.

Did i get a bad pickup?
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

I dont believe it has unbalanced coils. I know its frustrating but 90% of the time its in the wiring. Look even closer at your connections and get some readings if you have a meter. Some times walking away for a while or coming back to it the next day with a fresh head will help figuring it out.
Just to be sure, you have black going to the switch, green and the bare wires grounded and the red and white wires soldered together and then covered with tape so they dont ground out when you put it all together? Thats another common problem. Sometimes a wire touches something it shouldnt and grounds out when you put it all back together. I know it happened to me :)
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Just to be sure, you have black going to the switch, green and the bare wires grounded and the red and white wires soldered together and then covered with tape so they dont ground out when you put it all together? Thats another common problem. Sometimes a wire touches something it shouldnt and grounds out when you put it all back together. I know it happened to me
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Yep, only i twist the red and white together and taped them to the main insulation covering all the wires and the black is going to the volume pot for that pickup.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Yoi NEED to solder white and red together. Twisting the wires together won't cut it.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Yoi NEED to solder white and red together. Twisting the wires together won't cut it.
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Ive never soldered them together before and its worked, but ill give it a go.

Also correct me if im wrong but if i dont have the red and white connected to anything shouldnt i have no output whatsover? Arent these the ends of both coils?
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Maybe there's a short from one coil to the other? It's extremely unlikely (maybe impossible, I don't know), but it'd explain the symptoms you're seeing.

I'd unsolder the pickups completely, check the DC resistances between each wire, and draw conclusions from there...
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Maybe there's a short from one coil to the other? It's extremely unlikely (maybe impossible, I don't know), but it'd explain the symptoms you're seeing.
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Thats what im thinking. I emailed SD with this, we'll see what they say.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

first do the soldering! and double checking everything! in most cases its not the fault of the pickup. I do buy pickups on fleabay and from dealers which are sold as dead or faulty. Most of them are not!
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Yes please first solder the red and white together, but it sounds like one coil is dead (or near dead). If the sound doesn't change when you ground red/white, then it's operating in single coil mode. The thing about soldering the red and white together is that if the sound isn't changing when you short the red/white to ground, then it means the red/green coil is shorted to ground somewhere. If that's the case, then soldering vs. twisting won't help you.

If you get some wires too hot it's feasible that the insulation could melt away and the red wire could be touching green or the shield somewhere inside the cable. Also sometimes when someone stips the wire back, they put a little cut into one or more of the wires' insulation. If I were you, I would strip back another inch or so to fresh cable, and have another try at it. You may find the short is happening right there at the end, inside the cable. Otherwise, internally the pigtail wiring could have been made to touch ground, but that wouldn't have passed final inspection. Each pickup is meter read one last time before it goes into the box. Good luck, I'm sure Customer Service will sort it out tomorrow. We were closed Thursday and Friday last week, so they'll arrive Monday with 4 days of email pile-ups so be patient.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Yes please first solder the red and white together, but it sounds like one coil is dead (or near dead). If the sound doesn't change when you ground red/white, then it's operating in single coil mode. The thing about soldering the red and white together is that if the sound isn't changing when you short the red/white to ground, then it means the red/green coil is shorted to ground somewhere. If that's the case, then soldering vs. twisting won't help you.

If you get some wires too hot it's feasible that the insulation could melt away and the red wire could be touching green or the shield somewhere inside the cable. Also sometimes when someone stips the wire back, they put a little cut into one or more of the wires' insulation. If I were you, I would strip back another inch or so to fresh cable, and have another try at it. You may find the short is happening right there at the end, inside the cable. Otherwise, internally the pigtail wiring could have been made to touch ground, but that wouldn't have passed final inspection. Each pickup is meter read one last time before it goes into the box. Good luck, I'm sure Customer Service will sort it out tomorrow. We were closed Thursday and Friday last week, so they'll arrive Monday with 4 days of email pile-ups so be patient.
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Thanks for responding, i didnt think the difference between twisting and soldering would make any difference.

I tested each coil and got 8.51k and 8.52k. I connected the red and white and got 17.03k, so figured i just screwed up the wiring so i reconnected the green and bare and took one last reading for giggles.

I got 8.55k.

So i disconnected the bare again and took a look. I got a reading of 17.03k again. Connected the bare, 8.55k.WTF

So i just left the bare disconnected and wrapped in electrical tape, plugged it in and guess what? Sounds great and both coils are acting right. The only extra noise thats present is when i touch the coil nearest to bridge with a screwdriver, its buzzes a bit, but it goes away when i take it off.

So is there anything wrong with leaving the bare wire unconnected?
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

I think the only difference it makes is reducing your shielding and making you a bit more susceptible to RF interference (noise), but I could be wrong (I often am!) Good to hear you've got it sounding right - what a frustrating and strange fault. I'd like to hear your thoughts on the A8 now that you've got it working properly.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Not connecting the shield doesn't just mean your cable isn't shielded, it means your baseplate, pole pieces, and magnet aren't grounded either. That's not a long term solution. But it does lead me to believe that somewhere red is connected to the shield. That is very likely happening in your cable (not in the pickup itself) and I would recommend stripping back some cable and starting over. If you have a beep tester on that meter, beep test the red and shield wire. They are probably connected. Then if you strip back a bit of wire, you can try the beep again. If it's gone, so is your problem.

As a side note-the long term problems with twisting red and white together (without soldering) is that it's only a matter of time before corrosion impedes the connection. It's not stable. But you're right, it isn't the cause of your issue.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Just out of curiosity, Frank, since you're the guru, what does not having your baseplate (and your bridge and strings, for that matter) grounded mean in practical terms? Is it just that you'll get crackling as potential/charge equalises when you touch them? Thanks in advance :)
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

That, and noise because they are now antennae putting noise into the coil. That noise is mostly "cancelled" in humbucking mode, but eventually cancelling noise that doesn't need to be there in the first place can alter the perceived tone slightly.

More important it would seem that if his strings touch his pole pieces, the pickup would cut to single coil operation. That wouldn't happen with other pickups, but with his, since the red wire is shorted to the shield somewhere, it would be the case.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

Not connecting the shield doesn't just mean your cable isn't shielded, it means your baseplate, pole pieces, and magnet aren't grounded either. That's not a long term solution. But it does lead me to believe that somewhere red is connected to the shield. That is very likely happening in your cable (not in the pickup itself) and I would recommend stripping back some cable and starting over. If you have a beep tester on that meter, beep test the red and shield wire. They are probably connected. Then if you strip back a bit of wire, you can try the beep again. If it's gone, so is your problem.
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I can strip it back a little more and give it a shot, but i dont have a beep tester, at least i think i dont since i dont know what one is, all ive got is my trusty multimeter.

As a side note-the long term problems with twisting red and white together (without soldering) is that it's only a matter of time before corrosion impedes the connection. It's not stable. But you're right, it isn't the cause of your issue.
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I didnt know that, i guess ill start soldering them from now on. Thanks for the info.

I'd like to hear your thoughts on the A8 now that you've got it working properly.
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Well i really dont like it split i can tell you that. I'm not a single coil guy anyway so take that with a grain of salt.

Otherwise it sounds very open without being shrill or muddy. It can chug and leads seem to cut pretty well(i havent played this with my band though yet). Clean it seems pretty even sounding. I like the sound all around really, hopefully the snow will die down and i can practice with my band, that'll be the real test.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

SD hasnt got back to me yet, id like to return it for a totally working alt 8, kinda hoping someone from SD will notice this post.
 
Re: Alt 8 help, possible bad pickup

You can deal directly with Seymour Duncan, but one of our guys is out all week, and the other was out today. Let's see if they answer you tomorrow. Also FYI we're closed Jan 1 AND 2. Also, did you ever get to try it after stripping the wire back?
 
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