Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

[Vincent]

Hi guys,

I've been reading a couple of web pages on professional guitar players' setups. It appears to me that a lot of people prefer to run a guitar through a clean and semi (light) overdriven amplifier and use pedals for a boost to get their signature dist. sound.

My question is, why is this so, given that 90% of high-quality manufactured amps like today, i.e. DSL 2000, Boogies, 5150s already come with such a kick-a**e distortion??

Personally, I've never been a pedal man, and I've always used the amp's distortion channel for my lead sound. I've tried a few distortion pedals before; metal zone, DS-1 and a couple of other BOSS variants to name a few. Most of them sound cheesy and thin compared to my 5150's tone.


So is there something that I am missing out here sonically?

 

[FretFire]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

Were the pedals you tried stock, or modded? Keep in mind the DS-1 pedals that Satch and Vai use are NOT stock pedals. They are the Keeley Ultra Mod version.

 

[B2D]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

I do it because I prefer a nice mix of both power tube, preamp, and pedal distortion. Each of them has a different flavor and different harmonic characteristics and I found that carefully mixing them is the best way to do it for me and the tone I want.

Plus, its also a good idea to use a boutique, custom, or modded pedal as the overdrive boost to get the best tonal results. I'm getting a Keeley Phat BD2 (although the stock one sounds pretty good as well) for my work, Vai uses the modded DS1 by Keeley, Fulltones are very popular, Klons are real cool, etc etc. Tubescreamer reworks are EVERYWHERE.

I've never been happy using a pedal as a stand-alone distortion unit. There are very few pedals that can deliver the goods for me on their own. I'm a picky bastid! And yes, theres lots of amps that have killer distortion sounds on their own, but remember two things 1) Whats "kick-ass" to you might be "sufficient" for someone else... kinda like one man's "warm and full" is another persons "muddy and nasal" 2) Lots of times people use pedals in conjunction with amps to add a certain favorable (to their ears) characteristic to the sound... not really change the overall character but to add some certain overtone.

I use a BD2 set to a light overdrive/boost in conjunction with the Modern channel on my Rectoverb because the amp by itself is great, but with the pedal it just turns the tone a little bit nastier, with more sizzle, harmonics, and raw sustaining drive and gives it a distinct British vibe that sounds just right to me.

So really it's just another way of creating the sound you like and another method in the wonderful art that is Distortion.

 

[Imp]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

yeah, i use my DS-1 as almost a mix between a compression and a signal booster.. when you get a tube amp sweating, the pedal smooths out the sound, and makes hammer-ons etc more defined and punchy.. its not a bad reflection on the distortion characteristics of the amp, its just players like satch and vai need more sensitivity

tom

 

[FretFire]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

yeah, i use my DS-1 as almost a mix between a compression and a signal booster.. when you get a tube amp sweating, the pedal smooths out the sound, and makes hammer-ons etc more defined and punchy.. its not a bad reflection on the distortion characteristics of the amp, its just players like satch and vai need more sensitivity

tom

Well said!

 

[Chace]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

I think you'll find Vai uses his own signature Legacy amp series and Satch uses his JSX series head, not sure what cab he uses mind... Thats nowadays mind, were you on about the 80's?

 

[FretFire]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

I think you'll find Vai uses his own signature Legacy amp series and Satch uses his JSX series head, not sure what cab he uses mind... Thats nowadays mind, were you on about the 80's?

Yes, but they still use the pedals to add to their tonal arsenal. Neither of those guys are straight up guitar->amp players :laugh2:

 

[Vincent]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

Firstly, thanks for all your opinions. I'm beginning to see the picture now. It appears to me that guitar players can squeeze that little bit more versatility out of using both pedal and preamp distortion, as opposed to just guitar into amp type distortion.

Thing is, I'm pretty happy with my 5150 sound as it is. I don't even turn up the preamp gain past 6 as it begins to get very muddy. I prefer a bit of clarity and transparency to my sound. With that in mind, is there a pedal out there that will enhance my sound any further? I really can't imagine putting a pedal in front of a fully cranked 5150....it would just be a heap of death-metal mush and grind.

You said that players like Vai, Petrucci and Satriani all use pedals as a bit of a pickup booster (say 10 o clock position on the gain setting) before going into the amp (gain setting 12 o clock maybe??) Is this about right?


That said, I don't know why Vai doesn't record using his Legacy's distortion; I was quite impressed when I heard it for the first time. Even without a pedal in front of it, Vai still got his signature sound.

 

[FretFire]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

Firstly, thanks for all your opinions. I'm beginning to see the picture now. It appears to me that guitar players can squeeze that little bit more versatility out of using both pedal and preamp distortion, as opposed to just guitar into amp type distortion.

Thing is, I'm pretty happy with my 5150 sound as it is. I don't even turn up the preamp gain past 6 as it begins to get very muddy. I prefer a bit of clarity and transparency to my sound. With that in mind, is there a pedal out there that will enhance my sound any further? I really can't imagine putting a pedal in front of a fully cranked 5150....it would just be a heap of death-metal mush and grind.

You said that players like Vai, Petrucci and Satriani all use pedals as a bit of a pickup booster (say 10 o clock position on the gain setting) before going into the amp (gain setting 12 o clock maybe??) Is this about right?


That said, I don't know why Vai doesn't record using his Legacy's distortion; I was quite impressed when I heard it for the first time. Even without a pedal in front of it, Vai still got his signature sound.

I wouldn't really say they use the pedals as a "pickup booster", as much as they use them to push their amp over the edge. Hitting the front end of an amp with an OD or distortion pedal can make it go from a great ballsy rhythm tone to a thick, sustaining lead tone at the tap of a foot.

 

[Vincent]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

Just a thought: Does anyone know how EVH got his signature sound on the Balance album?? I thought he was just using a Wolfgang straight into a 5150, but obviously this whole pedal thing puts aanew spin on my understanding of generating tone!!

PS: I personally think that his tone during his Soldano and 5150 days was better than his highly acclaimed 'brown sound' / early EVH sound. Ok, now you can shoot me!!

 

[FretFire]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

One thing to keep in mind is that guys like Satriani and Vai don't just use one or two tones for all of their material. Take Satriani's "Crystal Planet" CD for example, EVERY song has a different set of tones. You can't achieve stuff like that by just plugging a guitar into an amp, you have to have some sort of third party to help you shape your tone beyond what the amp will allow (if you want to do so).

 

[FretFire]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

Just a thought: Does anyone know how EVH got his signature sound on the Balance album?? I thought he was just using a Wolfgang straight into a 5150, but obviously this whole pedal thing puts aanew spin on my understanding of generating tone!!

PS: I personally think that his tone during his Soldano and 5150 days was better than his highly acclaimed 'brown sound' / early EVH sound. Ok, now you can shoot me!!

I'm not sure what he was using on Balance. My favorite example of EVH tone, bar-none, is the song "Drop Dead Legs" .

 

[B2D]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

I think you'll find Vai uses his own signature Legacy amp series and Satch uses his JSX series head, not sure what cab he uses mind... Thats nowadays mind, were you on about the 80's?

The JSX supposedly has enough gain to stand on it's own for Satch but i recall seeing a Tubescreamer and a ZW overdrive pedal in a recent pic...

The Legacy is not as high-gain as you would think it is... and Zakk's JCM800s don't have much different from them than a regular one would.

Might wanna do a little research.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Amp Setup of Vai, Satriani

I like to get most of the gain out of the amp, but only up to the level that still has enough clarity and punch for rhythm playing, then add a clean boost or overdrive to knock it up to perfect tight sustain for soloing. Some of the pedals that are marketed as clean boosts are actually better for taking an already gainy signal and pushing it over the top. They don't get squishy or muddy like some overdrives or distortions.
Another thing you'll notice about all overdrive units is that they sound much louder on cleaner amp settings than they do on gainier ones.
I find it funny that people will pay a lot for guitars and amps, but then they get cheap when it comes to overdrives. You always get what you pay for with overdrive pedals.
Most people that think pedal gain sounds bad compared to amp gain are using $60 OD pedals, not $200 overdrives.......you gotta spend more on that vital part of your tone.