Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
- Thread starter OlinMusic
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Christobevii3
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
You can use a multimeter to make sure the output isn't too high using ohm's law. I'd say as long as the speakers aren't making any mechnical noises (snapping etc) you should be fine.
You can use a multimeter to make sure the output isn't too high using ohm's law. I'd say as long as the speakers aren't making any mechnical noises (snapping etc) you should be fine.
kmcguitars
GuitarArtologist
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
I wouldn't put that Volume knob past half way with those speakers. In all honesty the only way to be safe or O.K. would be to use speakers with the proper ratings. A 100w amp on 5 does not =50watts. It really depends on the taper of the pot. I imagine you could do as the above poster suggested and try to calculate the RMS ? But you'll always have to keep a close eye on that volume knob.
I wouldn't put that Volume knob past half way with those speakers. In all honesty the only way to be safe or O.K. would be to use speakers with the proper ratings. A 100w amp on 5 does not =50watts. It really depends on the taper of the pot. I imagine you could do as the above poster suggested and try to calculate the RMS ? But you'll always have to keep a close eye on that volume knob.
wixedmords
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
If anything OM, it will be exciting.
If anything OM, it will be exciting.
Kommerzbassist
Thunderbirdologist
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
That or add a dummy load box.
.............pull 2 tubes
That or add a dummy load box.
V!N
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
Also, nearly all quality speakers can take a bigger punch than what they're rated for and after that, you get that wonderful speaker breakup that doesn't harm your speaker (too much
). But the difference you're mentioning is too big and your amp will still be clean when the speaker starts to break up.
I've never heard anything like that, but I can't imagine it sounding any good. The breakup of the powertubes, speakers and pre amp tubes together is a bliss though.
I suggest yo shoot my main man Ted Weber a mail, explaining the situation with amp, power and the tone you're after. It's not unlikely that he already has what you're looking for with the proper powerrating.
https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/
Hey, I just saw he's making cabs now as well !
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/wccabs.htm#xcab
\m/ awsome ! \m/
Also, nearly all quality speakers can take a bigger punch than what they're rated for and after that, you get that wonderful speaker breakup that doesn't harm your speaker (too much
). But the difference you're mentioning is too big and your amp will still be clean when the speaker starts to break up.I've never heard anything like that, but I can't imagine it sounding any good. The breakup of the powertubes, speakers and pre amp tubes together is a bliss though.
I suggest yo shoot my main man Ted Weber a mail, explaining the situation with amp, power and the tone you're after. It's not unlikely that he already has what you're looking for with the proper powerrating.
https://taweber.powweb.com/weber/
Hey, I just saw he's making cabs now as well !
https://taweber.powweb.com/store/wccabs.htm#xcab
\m/ awsome ! \m/
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
I just figure NOTHING sounds like Greenbacks and Blues. I am waiting on the GOLDs but they will be EXPENSIVE AS HELL and they are like Bigfoot, no one has really seen them... lol
I am dying to do a mix with these speakers - say H30s and Blues??? YUM!
I just figure NOTHING sounds like Greenbacks and Blues. I am waiting on the GOLDs but they will be EXPENSIVE AS HELL and they are like Bigfoot, no one has really seen them... lol
I am dying to do a mix with these speakers - say H30s and Blues??? YUM!
frankfalbo
In Fluence Y'all
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
I think it's like asking if it's safe to drive 50mph in a 30mph zone. It's safe until you slam into the guy in front of you doing 30mph. You have a limit with lower wattage speakers, but as long as the load is acceptable, you will only blow them at the point which you are "driving too fast for conditions" so to speak.
You may be able to hear and feel (possibly see) when the speakers are getting overpowered. Although like driving a car without oil, overpowering speakers can overheat the coil, probably cause fusions, tears in the paper, etc. You could think everything is fine but behind the scenes you're doing damage.
I think it's like asking if it's safe to drive 50mph in a 30mph zone. It's safe until you slam into the guy in front of you doing 30mph. You have a limit with lower wattage speakers, but as long as the load is acceptable, you will only blow them at the point which you are "driving too fast for conditions" so to speak.
You may be able to hear and feel (possibly see) when the speakers are getting overpowered. Although like driving a car without oil, overpowering speakers can overheat the coil, probably cause fusions, tears in the paper, etc. You could think everything is fine but behind the scenes you're doing damage.
noth
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
I'm going to stick my neck out here and (partially?) disagree with all of you...
I say the higher powered amp is fine with lower powered speakers, within reason. When you're pushing a lower powered amp to its limit, it begins to distort and clip. When it clips, it's sending very ugly power to the speakers, because the amp's power supply has run out of steam. This will do more damage to a speaker than a higher powered amp which has more headroom and will continue to deliver clean power to the speakers. I have definitely seen more speakers blown by lower powered amps than high powered ones! Now obviously if you use a 100 Watt amp into a 25 Watt speaker and turn it way up, you may well send the cone across the room. Not withstanding that, if you know your amp and speakers well, and most of us do, it's very easy to tell how far you can push a speaker with a powerful amp.
Noth
I'm going to stick my neck out here and (partially?) disagree with all of you...
I say the higher powered amp is fine with lower powered speakers, within reason. When you're pushing a lower powered amp to its limit, it begins to distort and clip. When it clips, it's sending very ugly power to the speakers, because the amp's power supply has run out of steam. This will do more damage to a speaker than a higher powered amp which has more headroom and will continue to deliver clean power to the speakers. I have definitely seen more speakers blown by lower powered amps than high powered ones! Now obviously if you use a 100 Watt amp into a 25 Watt speaker and turn it way up, you may well send the cone across the room. Not withstanding that, if you know your amp and speakers well, and most of us do, it's very easy to tell how far you can push a speaker with a powerful amp.
Noth
Kommerzbassist
Thunderbirdologist
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
Uhm what? All a clipped signal does is being more like... rectangular... that doesn't harm anything. Power does OTOH.
Uhm what? All a clipped signal does is being more like... rectangular... that doesn't harm anything. Power does OTOH.
noth
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
You are right, IF the power supply is hefty (i.e. enough capacitive filtering).
But if it's not, and most amps are skimpy here, the filtering effect of the suppply falls short, and large scale ripple now replaces the straight rectangular form you're talking about - that's what I was referring to that can be very damaging to speakers.
Noth
You are right, IF the power supply is hefty (i.e. enough capacitive filtering).
But if it's not, and most amps are skimpy here, the filtering effect of the suppply falls short, and large scale ripple now replaces the straight rectangular form you're talking about - that's what I was referring to that can be very damaging to speakers.
Noth
aleclee
Major General GAS
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
Just keep in mind that a fairly cranked tube amp into a no-load situation is a blown output transformer waiting to happen. It would be a real drag to have to replace speakers and a tranny--that tells me all I need to know about that sort of risk.
Also, keep in mind that a lot of tube amps (especially NMV Marshalls) put out a fair bit more than their rated power since power ratings are based on clean output. If you're actually overdriving the power tubes, you could be exceeding the rated power by 50% or more.
Just keep in mind that a fairly cranked tube amp into a no-load situation is a blown output transformer waiting to happen. It would be a real drag to have to replace speakers and a tranny--that tells me all I need to know about that sort of risk.
Also, keep in mind that a lot of tube amps (especially NMV Marshalls) put out a fair bit more than their rated power since power ratings are based on clean output. If you're actually overdriving the power tubes, you could be exceeding the rated power by 50% or more.
joelap
Red&Goldologist
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
definately. iirc jeff seal says his modded marshalls were putting out over 130 watts iirc.
still, i'd kill for a quad of greenbacks, and I intend on getting weber to make me some clones I can use with my 100watt plexi clone.
definately. iirc jeff seal says his modded marshalls were putting out over 130 watts iirc.
still, i'd kill for a quad of greenbacks, and I intend on getting weber to make me some clones I can use with my 100watt plexi clone.
Christobevii3
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
Clipped signals harm speakers because the way the voice coil moves normally cools the speakers. When it is clipped it loses half the cooling power. Thus the reason the magic smoke comes out.
Clipped signals harm speakers because the way the voice coil moves normally cools the speakers. When it is clipped it loses half the cooling power. Thus the reason the magic smoke comes out.
Sludgenutz
New member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
Ahhh...I never knew that one! Also, one does not have to fry a speaker or break a cone to ruin a speaker. Too much power can also warp the voice coil to the point it starts rubbing against the magnet. It'll have that nasty scratchy/crackly sound.
Ahhh...I never knew that one! Also, one does not have to fry a speaker or break a cone to ruin a speaker. Too much power can also warp the voice coil to the point it starts rubbing against the magnet. It'll have that nasty scratchy/crackly sound.
devastone
Well-known member
Re: Any safe or ok way to run 100w amps into low power speakers
This is quite true for SS amps, when they hit their limits they start generating large voltage spikes which are alot higher than the amps are rated for short periods of time (like microseconds dude) that can damage speakers. So, for PAs, overpowering is a good thing, just don't run everything on 10 (some common sense is required), if you start pushing PA power amps to distortion, you are asking for trouble.
As far as guitar amps, if it is SS, same thing if you are pushing the power amp to clipping, it is generating some voltage spikes. A tube amp doesn't, another one of those beauty of tubes things. They naturally compress the signal nicely so they don't generate those nasty spikes. OTOH, old NMV Marshalls regularly put out more than 100W (120 - 140 wasn't uncommon) and were very commonly paired with a 4-12 cabinet loaded with Greenbacks (25W each, 100W total). So, yeah running on 10 constantly could wear them down to failure eventually. But, back to the original question, would I run a 2-12 loaded with a 30W speaker and a 25W speaker with a 100W amp, sure at reasonable levels it would be fine. Would I push the amp to 10 and expect the speakers to last forever, nope, but they would probably last longer than you think (they could also blow in a few uses and the manufacturer would say tough luck). Or, you could check out the Eminence equivalents, I have a cabinet loaded with a Wizard which is similar to a G12H but handles alot more power, and a GB12, ditto for the Greenback.
This is quite true for SS amps, when they hit their limits they start generating large voltage spikes which are alot higher than the amps are rated for short periods of time (like microseconds dude) that can damage speakers. So, for PAs, overpowering is a good thing, just don't run everything on 10 (some common sense is required), if you start pushing PA power amps to distortion, you are asking for trouble.
As far as guitar amps, if it is SS, same thing if you are pushing the power amp to clipping, it is generating some voltage spikes. A tube amp doesn't, another one of those beauty of tubes things. They naturally compress the signal nicely so they don't generate those nasty spikes. OTOH, old NMV Marshalls regularly put out more than 100W (120 - 140 wasn't uncommon) and were very commonly paired with a 4-12 cabinet loaded with Greenbacks (25W each, 100W total). So, yeah running on 10 constantly could wear them down to failure eventually. But, back to the original question, would I run a 2-12 loaded with a 30W speaker and a 25W speaker with a 100W amp, sure at reasonable levels it would be fine. Would I push the amp to 10 and expect the speakers to last forever, nope, but they would probably last longer than you think (they could also blow in a few uses and the manufacturer would say tough luck). Or, you could check out the Eminence equivalents, I have a cabinet loaded with a Wizard which is similar to a G12H but handles alot more power, and a GB12, ditto for the Greenback.
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