Any thoughts on Floyd Rose "upgrades"?

S

Seashore

New member
I'm looking at Raw Vintage springs and a brass block to replace the standard black springs and zinc block on my FR 1000 "Pro" 7 string bridge. Has anybody tried these and noticed specific changes afterwards?

I'm mostly trying to damp down an annoying midrange resonance that's been with the guitar through several pickup changes. The heavier "Pro" bridge helped - it was worse with the standard 1000 series trem that was originally in there. Smoother spring feel would be nice, too, but I can live with it how it is.
 
A larger brass block will noticeably increase sustain and also round the tone out some. Don't know about the spring changes.
 
I have a set of RV springs in a Floyded guitar; didn't really notice any difference in sound compared to what was in there before. Feel is nice though, can use all 5 springs (w/ 9s) and still not too stiff. They're also a lot easier to manipulate when servicing the guitar and needing to pop the bridge off.
 
Awesome, thanks for the input guys.

Lucius Paisley said:
Could there be sympathetic resonance? What's your tuning?
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Tuning is 7 string standard B to E. I don't know if there's a sympathetic component to it... to my ear it's a bit of a "thwonk" underneath the rest of the sound, like banging on a plastic bucket.
 
If you've already changed bridges completely and the problem is still there, I'd be looking elsewhere.

A block upgrade probably won't do much and the black springs you already have sound like the silent type, which is already an upgrade, so doubt it's those.

Maybe a groove in the bridge posts or dulled knife edges (have you ever tried to adjust the bridge height under tension)?
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Do the pickups have any movement? I'd make sure they are completely secure and free from movement/rattle, especially if direct-mounted with foam underneath, as the foam can degrade over time.
 
Masta' C said:
If you've already changed bridges completely and the problem is still there, I'd be looking elsewhere.

A block upgrade probably won't do much and the black springs you already have sound like the silent type, which is already an upgrade, so doubt it's those.

Maybe a groove in the bridge posts or dulled knife edges (have you ever tried to adjust the bridge height under tension)?
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Do the pickups have any movement? I'd make sure they are completely secure and free from movement/rattle, especially if direct-mounted with foam underneath, as the foam can degrade over time.
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Hmmm.

I sharpened the knife edges on the Pro with a round file before putting it back in this last time. I had taken it out of the guitar a year or two ago because it wouldn't return to zero unless I had it blocked, and I traced that to a ding on one of the knife edges. It sounded and felt really good blocked but I needed it floating, so I used the original 1000 for a bit. The edges feel clean after the file job and it returns to zero almost perfectly now. The posts also looked fine under a very close visual inspection. And the pickups got extra foam underneath after the last swap, and feel very well seated.

I don't discount what you're saying and I'm wondering if there could be anything else loose in there. I could swap out the posts and see if there's any change. Also, I didn't pot the pickup after the last reconstruction I did. But this is a familiar, subtle sound that's been annoying me since I got the guitar. It comes across as a boxy midrange that I can't dial out. It sounds like a mechanical resonance. Three of the black springs are the sweet spot for this guitar, and I was hoping that using more of the RV springs and a more massive block would make it less of a problem.
 
My thoughts on upgrades are I don't like them ..none of them. I don't like brass blocks..they sound "off/fake" to me and take off a whole lot of edge...in fact they often have a faint 'ringing' quality to them so I would'nt get one to solve unwanted resonance issues..

I don't care for fancy springs and especially not stuff like foam/rubber bands around them which pretty much just mucks up tone &/or sustain (again..imo)....and yeah I could'nt care less for tititanium screws/saddles or w/e. I have used and abused all kinds of trems for years on and off stage and never had a problem w/ screws & saddles, except for w/ really piss poor $10 Aliexpress Floyds on occasion.

My fave tone from a double locking tremolo is "pot metal tone" since I think it keeps most of the guitar's natural tone intact. "Pot metal" has pretty similar weight/density to wood (as opposed to brass/steel/titanium/unobtainium & w/e else) and substitutes best imo for wood that's lost during routing...

OFR's have pot metal bases & my fave trem's (Ibanez Lo-pro's/Edges/Edge Zero/Zero II's etc have dinky pot metal blocks or are completely constructed out of pot metal making them tough, durable tone machines that perform brilliantly.....ask Steve Vai, he knows his trem's :laugh2:)

If I were to guess ...your tremlo bridge probably is'nt the source of your resonance issues & i'd look elsewhere personally....
 
Ok I don't mind "normal" sized brass blocks as I don't think they have the mass/weight to interfere with a guitar's tone as much as "big brass blocks" do. But yea. I'd take pot metal over either..
 
I'll worry about upgrades when I find one that actually stays in tune in the first place. Yes I hear all about how stable they are. Not in my experience. They do OK with a Trem stop in place but when they float, they are a nightmare. I really thought my Japanese made 1993 S540 with an Edge trem would be the answer but it has the same issues.
 
I'm a hardtail player first and foremost, not a big fan of the playing feel on Floyds, but they work fine IME. The FR 1000 that came on this guitar returned to zero and stayed in tune very well. I've got a Turbo Tuner always on and it really had no deviation that I could hear or see. I only switched it out because I hate the fine tuner placement. That's where I put my hands dammit.

The Pro is very close to returning to zero now after I filed it, definitely close enough for what I'm doing, and it stays in tune great overall. Tone is a bit fuller than the 1000 and more "even" string to string. It's not worth what I paid for it, and if I could go back in time I wouldn't have bought it, but it's a noticeable improvement nonetheless. I play on the thing enough to make it worth getting as perfect as possible.

It's also my only 26.5" scale guitar and one of two Schecters with similar construction that have a similar boxiness in the mids. The tone has never been my favorite. I don't think it's all down to the bridge, but I do think there's some mileage left to be had out of the block and springs.
 
Not on a Floyd, but in my Strat, I definitely notice a difference when changing blocks. I like brass in my Strat, but it all really depends on what you're going for. I don't find brass is "better" at all, and I do feel like the whole "heavier is better" approach is very dated. But it does sound different compared to the zinc and steel blocks I also have lying around. It's a balancing act, really. Depends on what the guitar is like. I like brass becuase I have steel bent saddles and the guitar itself is kinda wiry and stringy (Alder body and Maple fretboard), so brass is a way to offset that. But zinc has a tendency to sound drier and tighter, so maybe that's what you want.

Do they make steel blocks for Floyds? I know they make Titanium and other materials brighter than brass.
 
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I also know they make noiseless springs in different tensions. Maybe you should give those a try for the resonance issue.

Also, FWIW, I know the FU-Tone parts have a good rep, but they're also kinda spendy. I like the trem blocks that I've gotten off Musiclily, and they're more reasonably priced, so maybe look into those.
 
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Rex_Rocker said:
Not on a Floyd, but in my Strat, I definitely notice a difference when changing blocks. I like brass in my Strat, but it all really depends on what you're going for. I don't find brass is "better" at all, and I do feel like the whole "heavier is better" approach is very dated. But it does sound different compared to the zinc and steel blocks I also have lying around. It's a balancing act, really. Depends on what the guitar is like. I like brass becuase I have steel bent saddles and the guitar itself is pretty wiry and stringy, so brass is a way to offset that.

Do they make steel blocks for Floyds? I know they make Titanium and other materials brighter than brass.
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I have yet to find any other options for the 1000 "Pro" series besides the standard zinc and Fat Brass. Mounting screw placement is apparently different from the rest of their lineup. No specialty $300 titanium blocks for me. I guess this guitar could be described as "wiry" and "stringy". I wouldn't mind a deeper and less thwacky tone. It has tons of attack.

These black springs are the "noiseless" ones. I'm not having a problem with them ringing out past other notes. It's this weird plasticky thwack that gets louder if I dig in. And for what it's worth, it's subtle, it's not really an issue when I'm playing leads or clean parts, but it's the kind of thing that drives me a little nuts when I'm trying to write riffs on it in isolation. I might be better off just accepting that this guitar is for recording lead lines, instead of trying to make it into a riff machine.

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Seashore said:
I have yet to find any other options for the 1000 "Pro" series besides the standard zinc and Fat Brass. Mounting screw placement is apparently different from the rest of their lineup. No specialty $300 titanium blocks for me. I guess this guitar could be described as "wiry" and "stringy". I wouldn't mind a deeper and less thwacky tone. It has tons of attack.

These black springs are the "noiseless" ones. I'm not having a problem with them ringing out past other notes. It's this weird plasticky thwack that gets louder if I dig in. And for what it's worth, it's subtle, it's not really an issue when I'm playing leads or clean parts, but it's the kind of thing that drives me a little nuts when I'm trying to write riffs on it in isolation. I might be better off just accepting that this guitar is for recording lead lines, instead of trying to make it into a riff machine.

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I guess the reason that kicked me over wanting to go over the block material rabbit hole is that I do notice a difference in tone between bridges in my Gibson. I've had the aluminum w/zinc saddles stock bridge, the Schaller STM (zinc w/brass saddles), and the Graphtech Resomax bridge, and I did notice a difference even under tons of gain with all of them.


This video might not have the best production or tones, but I went off this shootout at first when ordering the blocks for my Strat. My experience agrees with this video, so maybe take a listen if the brass block gets you what you want over the zinc. If not, don't waste your money.
 
Rex_Rocker said:
I guess the reason that kicked me over wanting to go over the block material rabbit hole is that I do notice a difference in tone between bridges in my Gibson. I've had the aluminum w/zinc saddles stock bridge, the Schaller STM (zinc w/brass saddles), and the Graphtech Resomax bridge, and I did notice a difference even under tons of gain with all of them.


This video might not have the best production or tones, but I went off this shootout at first when ordering the blocks for my Strat. My experience agrees with this video, so maybe take a listen if the brass block gets you what you want over the zinc. If not, don't waste your money.
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Thanks for this, good guidance. It sounds like brass would be a step in the wrong direction for what I need.
 
Pot metal is some kind of Alloy...yeah...maybe zinc based, I don't know. My point was that I'm not crazy about brass blocks and a lot of Floyds (including Ibanez one's which I like best) out there I just would'nt "upgrade" in any way based purely on tone cuz w/e they are already sound great and once I put the big brass block in I don't like the difference in tone/feel at all (personally).
 
Zinc is a great, balanced material for tremolo blocks that has fallen victim to marketing hype for unnecessary "upgrades".

In terms of its physical structure, zinc alloy is closer to titanium than either brass or steel and actually behaves most similarly to titanium when used as a tremolo block.

Regardless, as long as the block has sufficient mass, the material it's made of makes such a small difference that most players would not be able to tell by ear or feel alone.
 
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