"As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

[blueslegend8]

hey guys, It's been a while since I've posted on here, but I've been around reading threads and what not. Really, I've been trying to avoid GAS which this Forum inevitably causes.

I've been into this band, "As Cities Burn," for a while and I really dig their tone. I know their guitarist uses a Bogner Shiva. From what I know about the Shiva, Bogner makes an EL34 and a 6L6 version of the amp. I've been trying to find out which one is used by the band and I have had no luck. I really just want to know for reference, but I'm thinking I might also purchase one. Just don't know yet. Here are some youtube clips of them, if any of you know or can decifer based on your tone wisdom, it would help alot. The first clip you can see the amp the other two are just better tone examples. Thanks.


Clip 1
Clip 2
Clip 3

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

I'm used to the Bogner EL-34 sound, and it sounds pretty British in those clips.....so I'd venture to say it's probably the EL-34 version on a straight 4-12 w/Vin 30's.

All the Bogner amps have sort of the signature Bogner preamp sound, so you'd probably like most of them. Check out the Alchemist head on a 4-12. It's cheaper than the Shiva, but still a good sounding amp in the same ballpark tonewise.

 

[Bludave]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

I have a 1 12" EL 34 Shiva Combo. Its a great amp..... buy it. Though if I had to do it over I would have bought a head and a 2 12" or 4 12". Bogner cabs have Vintage 30's. I prefer the Greenbacks. The combo has a Celestion 80W speaker in it and it sounds great. On occasions I plug in either my Marshall 4 12" (with greenbacks) or I have a Peavey cab that has the Shefeild 1290 speakers (which is Peaveys version of a 75W celestion). With all configurations it sounds pretty **** good.

I am not completely happy with the Drive channel. Its good, but the mids are a tad to thick for my taste. I am more of a blues player and I think the Shiva has a more modern sound to it. I use a modded TS9 in the clean channel and I get a really good blues/rock tone out of it. The other issue is the effects loop./ My Shiva is an older one, so I understand they have fixed the issue with the loop in the new ones. The Effect loops require a special cable in order for it to work properly. They have a wiring diagram on the website so you can make it yourself. I did & it works fine. The other thing that I think this amp should have is a volume control for the boost & the boost should work on both channels. Mine only works on the gain channel. These are really minor issues, but the boost really doesn't do much, so I leave it on all the time. Other than these minor issues I like the amp quite a bit. Bogners Reverb is as good as it gets. I have 2 Vintage Fenders and the reverb on my Shiva is at least as good as my Super & Deluxe Reverbs are. The EL 34 would be the way to go I think. The cleans are rivaling any Fender I have ever played through.

 

[blueslegend8]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Hey thanks guys. So basically what Ya'll are telling me is that EL34 is the way to go... I Have a '68 bandmaster Reverb that I made modded into a Vibroclone; so, I have the vintage 6L6 sound pretty much covered. I can do alot with that amp but it doesn't drive hard as I would like sometimes. I've been thinking about the shiva alot recently, and when I get home from working in California I should have the funds to purchase. I'm still only thinking about it though because it's quite a hefty price tag. I like the soundclips I'm hearing on the Bogner website and I know they're quality amps... so as long as I can talk myself into spending the money, I'm fairly set on the amp. I guess EL34 it is then, Thanks.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Money spent on a Bogner won't be money wasted. It'll actually save you from sifting through a bunch of other amps, looking for what the Bogner had all along.

It's a worthy investment because they're good amps and hold their value. At home, I've been using a blue grill Valvetronix head to model some of the Ecstasy's sounds, but it died on me. I think my next amp purchase will probably be an Alchemist head to go on my Bogner large 2-12.

The Ecstasy is an extremely loud amp, although it can be dialed down. I'd rather run an Alchemist lower for home use.

 

[Hot _Grits]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Sounds like you're hearing the EL34 version there. The 6l6 Shiva is a fantastic amp that does not get enough love but it's a different sound.

As GJ said, probably V30s for the speakers too. The overdrive ob those clips has that midrange upon midrange thing that you get with EL34 Shivas and V30s.

 

[Bludave]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Hey thanks guys. So basically what Ya'll are telling me is that EL34 is the way to go... I Have a '68 bandmaster Reverb that I made modded into a Vibroclone; so, I have the vintage 6L6 sound pretty much covered. I can do alot with that amp but it doesn't drive hard as I would like sometimes. I've been thinking about the shiva alot recently, and when I get home from working in California I should have the funds to purchase. I'm still only thinking about it though because it's quite a hefty price tag. I like the soundclips I'm hearing on the Bogner website and I know they're quality amps... so as long as I can talk myself into spending the money, I'm fairly set on the amp. I guess EL34 it is then, Thanks.

Look around for a used one. That's what I did. Just be careful with how old it is. You can identify its age by symbols on the back (Bogner does not use serial #'s) Once you have the symbol you can contact Bogner and they can tell you how old it is. As I mentioned earlier the loop & boost issues are your only concern with an older one. Great amp you won't regret it.

 

[That90'sGuy]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Some say the older ones sound better (less gain on the overdrive, warmer tone on the cleans) - what you're looking for is up to your preference.

Me? I've been an older EL-34 Shiva owner for a few years. I have my own values I use for the cable for the FX Loop and it's a non-existent problem. Want more volume to cut for solos? Just throw a clean boost in the FX Loop and you're set. At the prices these are going for these days, they're steals on the market.

After my Shiva I've pretty much said screw every other amp. It sounds good, I've got a few axes to compliment it and my guitar rig hasn't been modded in over the past year.

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Bogners in general are not my bag but I have to say after playing a few different Shivas that the EL34 non reverb Shivas are something special...the others are ok but the non reverb 34 model is a killer amp.

 

[J Moose]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Utoob clips suck for "sound" quality... and really, speaking strictly from the end of audio recording & reproduction... moving the microphone a half-inch or changing it out entirely will make a much larger difference then the overall difference between 6L6 & EL34s in the same amp.

So... go play 'em and see what you dig.

I had 6L6's in my old dual recto solo head... I recall a guitar shopping experience shortly after that purchase where I plugged into a recto that I didn't think sounded right... it had EL34s.

Interesting.

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

True but the catch with the Bogner Shiva 6L6 vs the Shiva EL34 is that the power amps are completely different from one amp to the other...it's more than just a difference of swapping power tubes...

 

[Hot _Grits]

Re: "As Cities Burn" Bogner Shiva EL34 or 6L6?

Yeah, different amps. I used the 6l6 1x12 combo for maybe five tracks on the Defendants record and it's ana mazing amp, and very different to the EL34 model. A lower gain, fender-ier sound.

The EL34 model's cleans are amazing. For overdrive I find them a bit to thick sounding in the mids with the common choice of vintage 30s, but I've heard them sound amazing with greenbacks.