Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
- Thread starter Aceman
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uOpt
Something Cool
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
Sure...
Oh you don't mean by accident when the amp clips. Oops.
In all seriousness, I still don't use it. In heavy music there is enough of a "problem" of guitars invading a quite low frequency spectrum today, and adding artificial overtones to the bass won't do anybody any good after everything is mixed together.
Sure...
Oh you don't mean by accident when the amp clips. Oops.
In all seriousness, I still don't use it. In heavy music there is enough of a "problem" of guitars invading a quite low frequency spectrum today, and adding artificial overtones to the bass won't do anybody any good after everything is mixed together.
eclecticsynergy
Well-known member
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
I prefer some overdrive, like vintage tube bass amps. They have a slightly rubbery quality that holds the mix together and adds texture, letting them be heard without taking away from the other instruments. Chris Squire on the classic Yes albums, especially Tales and Relayer. Jack Bruce on the Cream records. Felix Pappalardi with Mountain. Gary Thain with Uriah Heep. There must be plenty of more recent examples, but for me it's the classic ones that spring to mind right away.
Obviously it's pretty dependent on context- if there's a lot of depth or complexity going on guitarwise, I agree with uOpt that real distortion on the bass isn't often desirable. Yet IMO a little overdrive works well with straight-ahead rock stuff. Especially in a smaller group. I tend to use a bit more OD if there's only one guitar player. That way the sound stays meaty when there's a solo happening without any rhythm guitar behind it. Fills the mids and keeps a little razz going up top so there isn't such a noticeable gap in the treble when the power chords drop out. I've taken to keeping a dedicated behind-the-solo tone preset in my bass pedal. When there's more than one guitar this becomes less important and I concentrate on finding a basic sound that generally complements the guitar tones (a process which could be a thread by itself). I'll still use the "stand-out" preset to emphasize certain lines or sections. (That preset gooses some frequencies but doesn't boost the low end or pump up my overall level. This preserves the crucial balance with the kick drum and avoids driving soundmen crazy. Mostly.)
Some bass players use a compressor. I prefer the sustain of nice tubey overdrive. (Probably because I'm primarily a guitarist, even though I've been bassist for a lot of bands over the decades.) I got attached to the sound of my SVTs back in the 70s, and I crave tube amp tone. In recent years the bass amps provided in a backline are nearly always solid state, so I have a pedal with a couple of presets. Bringing my own tone along makes it a lot easier to be consistent from one show to another if you don't know what you'll be playing through. The preamp pedal has a post-drive output to go straight to the PA; that's best when the amps vary from one show to the next. I'll set up one channel as my primary tone with whatever drive is appropriate for the project; this is the setting I'll use for 95% of the gig. A second stand-out channel gets more OD with a little tonal emphasis, but with the low end unaltered. And a third is clean for any passages that may need a gentler treatment.
Now, given a good tube amp I could do all that simply working the knobs on my bass. But I seldom have the luxury of specifying; most of the time it's solid state. So I always bring my drive pedal.
I prefer some overdrive, like vintage tube bass amps. They have a slightly rubbery quality that holds the mix together and adds texture, letting them be heard without taking away from the other instruments. Chris Squire on the classic Yes albums, especially Tales and Relayer. Jack Bruce on the Cream records. Felix Pappalardi with Mountain. Gary Thain with Uriah Heep. There must be plenty of more recent examples, but for me it's the classic ones that spring to mind right away.
Obviously it's pretty dependent on context- if there's a lot of depth or complexity going on guitarwise, I agree with uOpt that real distortion on the bass isn't often desirable. Yet IMO a little overdrive works well with straight-ahead rock stuff. Especially in a smaller group. I tend to use a bit more OD if there's only one guitar player. That way the sound stays meaty when there's a solo happening without any rhythm guitar behind it. Fills the mids and keeps a little razz going up top so there isn't such a noticeable gap in the treble when the power chords drop out. I've taken to keeping a dedicated behind-the-solo tone preset in my bass pedal. When there's more than one guitar this becomes less important and I concentrate on finding a basic sound that generally complements the guitar tones (a process which could be a thread by itself). I'll still use the "stand-out" preset to emphasize certain lines or sections. (That preset gooses some frequencies but doesn't boost the low end or pump up my overall level. This preserves the crucial balance with the kick drum and avoids driving soundmen crazy. Mostly.)
Some bass players use a compressor. I prefer the sustain of nice tubey overdrive. (Probably because I'm primarily a guitarist, even though I've been bassist for a lot of bands over the decades.) I got attached to the sound of my SVTs back in the 70s, and I crave tube amp tone. In recent years the bass amps provided in a backline are nearly always solid state, so I have a pedal with a couple of presets. Bringing my own tone along makes it a lot easier to be consistent from one show to another if you don't know what you'll be playing through. The preamp pedal has a post-drive output to go straight to the PA; that's best when the amps vary from one show to the next. I'll set up one channel as my primary tone with whatever drive is appropriate for the project; this is the setting I'll use for 95% of the gig. A second stand-out channel gets more OD with a little tonal emphasis, but with the low end unaltered. And a third is clean for any passages that may need a gentler treatment.
Now, given a good tube amp I could do all that simply working the knobs on my bass. But I seldom have the luxury of specifying; most of the time it's solid state. So I always bring my drive pedal.
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dystrust
Well-known member
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
The best example I can think of is Timmy C of RATM / Audioslave; he plays with some distortion most of the time. The secret to good distorted bass tone IMO is a clean blend which really helps with loss of definition. Timmy C's setup consists of a pair of SVT IIs; one running clean and a second running moderately overdriven. He has a kill switch to shut off the dirty amp for when he wants to play completely clean, and some sort of custom distortion pedal to make the dirty amp dirtier.
My personal favorite for that sort of tone is the Wren & Cuff Pickle Pie B. It's loosely based on a Big Muff, but with a few tweaks for bass and a clean blend.
The best example I can think of is Timmy C of RATM / Audioslave; he plays with some distortion most of the time. The secret to good distorted bass tone IMO is a clean blend which really helps with loss of definition. Timmy C's setup consists of a pair of SVT IIs; one running clean and a second running moderately overdriven. He has a kill switch to shut off the dirty amp for when he wants to play completely clean, and some sort of custom distortion pedal to make the dirty amp dirtier.
My personal favorite for that sort of tone is the Wren & Cuff Pickle Pie B. It's loosely based on a Big Muff, but with a few tweaks for bass and a clean blend.
H
HiFiRebel
Guest
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
Less is more. I prefer the Ampeg sound with a little tube breakup at the most, but I have accepted that I need to modernize at times. I use my current drive pedal of choice and use very little.
Less is more. I prefer the Ampeg sound with a little tube breakup at the most, but I have accepted that I need to modernize at times. I use my current drive pedal of choice and use very little.
Johnny the Kid
Shaunofthedeadologist
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
When I play guitar, I look at distortion as a main tone, and a necessary one. When I play bass though, distortion is an effect like chorus or phaser. For the way I play bass, it's better to have a nice clean tone and add in certain things when the bass takes a more prominent role in a song.
When I play guitar, I look at distortion as a main tone, and a necessary one. When I play bass though, distortion is an effect like chorus or phaser. For the way I play bass, it's better to have a nice clean tone and add in certain things when the bass takes a more prominent role in a song.
Myaccount876
Amira-Maker
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
To me, bass distortion/overdrive is purely to fill sonic gaps between the guitar and bass - usually in the real low mids. I consider a great overdriven/heavy bass tone to be like Lemmy's tone on Overkill, Geezer Butler's tone on songs like N.I.B, or Douglass Lubahn on The Door's Five To One. It shouldn't be so overdriven that you can outright hear the distortion in the full mix, but it should be enough that you can hear the sound suffer when the distortion/OD is removed for a clean bass sound.
To me, bass distortion/overdrive is purely to fill sonic gaps between the guitar and bass - usually in the real low mids. I consider a great overdriven/heavy bass tone to be like Lemmy's tone on Overkill, Geezer Butler's tone on songs like N.I.B, or Douglass Lubahn on The Door's Five To One. It shouldn't be so overdriven that you can outright hear the distortion in the full mix, but it should be enough that you can hear the sound suffer when the distortion/OD is removed for a clean bass sound.
eclecticsynergy
Well-known member
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
For me, using a drive pedal as an "always on" effect, the clean blend knob is pretty essential. Without it I'd be using far less drive, to keep the punch and clarity. When I switch to a preset with a little more overdrive, the clean portion of the signal is unaffected.
For me, using a drive pedal as an "always on" effect, the clean blend knob is pretty essential. Without it I'd be using far less drive, to keep the punch and clarity. When I switch to a preset with a little more overdrive, the clean portion of the signal is unaffected.
Kamanda~SD
New member
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
I like overdrive going on on bass...but mainly its from turning up an RB400, not from a pedal. The whole distortion blend thing never sounds good to me.
I like overdrive going on on bass...but mainly its from turning up an RB400, not from a pedal. The whole distortion blend thing never sounds good to me.
blueman335
Mojo's Minions
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
I like a little distortion, just enough to make the high end aggressive, but not enough to muddy up anything else. I want the mids and low-end clean and tight. Can be a very effective tone for the right songs.
I like a little distortion, just enough to make the high end aggressive, but not enough to muddy up anything else. I want the mids and low-end clean and tight. Can be a very effective tone for the right songs.
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
Starless is a masterpiece. Brilliant song. I'd throw 'Fracture' up there with great distorted bass. I think it works in the right band. It worked well in early Sabbath, but not so much in later Sabbath.
Starless is a masterpiece. Brilliant song. I'd throw 'Fracture' up there with great distorted bass. I think it works in the right band. It worked well in early Sabbath, but not so much in later Sabbath.
Noisembryo
New member
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
One of the best bass sounds I've heard
One of the best bass sounds I've heard
JOLLY
Super Simonologist
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5Yq5E8CU_I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsVI8r6plkQ
However, I never would have thought this bass sounded like this on its own had I never heard this isolated track.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD4FVgw-2sI
Also, I never would have thought these to have a somewhat overdriven bass tone without hearing it isolated. However, I think a lot of that has to do with his attack on the strings with his fingers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD4FVgw-2sI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4ySa1dSdOA
These are somewhat similar to the bass tone that I strive for, especially now since that I have my Spector basses. They kind of have a natural growl to them, but aren't necessarily distorted.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5Yq5E8CU_I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsVI8r6plkQ
However, I never would have thought this bass sounded like this on its own had I never heard this isolated track.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD4FVgw-2sI
Also, I never would have thought these to have a somewhat overdriven bass tone without hearing it isolated. However, I think a lot of that has to do with his attack on the strings with his fingers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lD4FVgw-2sI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4ySa1dSdOA
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JOLLY
Super Simonologist
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
I watched some video with him, and it seems like he just had everything dimed except for the bass and treble. He had those on zero. He was just balls to the wall all mids!!...lol
JOLLY
Super Simonologist
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
Concept wise, I think everyone will have a different opinion of what sounds good. I've always been a fan of the big muff family of distortions with bass however I think it takes a lot of experimentation to find "that" sound. I'm not a huge fan of the ProCo Rat or it's many flavors for bass but some love it and swear by it... my advice is to try various distortions and overdrives and settle on what works for you and your sound.
As far as how prevalent it is, bass distortion lends its self more to styles where it would shine such as metal or alt rock. The big problem I've noticed is that traditional "bass" distortion pedals such as the Big Muff or Rat generally aren't EQed properly for bass and/or have poor bass response. For "Bass" versions of a guitar pedals there almost seems to be a knee jerk reaction to tweak the EQ then leave it alone, regardless of how crappy it sounds.
On that note, it's IMO a heck of a lot easier to build a good or decent sounding distortion for guitar than bass, simply due to frequency response. From a design standpoint, there is a tendency for the low end to really want to "fart" out for lack of more eloquent terminology. It's the nature of the waveform in those lower registers.
Concept wise, I think everyone will have a different opinion of what sounds good. I've always been a fan of the big muff family of distortions with bass however I think it takes a lot of experimentation to find "that" sound. I'm not a huge fan of the ProCo Rat or it's many flavors for bass but some love it and swear by it... my advice is to try various distortions and overdrives and settle on what works for you and your sound.
As far as how prevalent it is, bass distortion lends its self more to styles where it would shine such as metal or alt rock. The big problem I've noticed is that traditional "bass" distortion pedals such as the Big Muff or Rat generally aren't EQed properly for bass and/or have poor bass response. For "Bass" versions of a guitar pedals there almost seems to be a knee jerk reaction to tweak the EQ then leave it alone, regardless of how crappy it sounds.
On that note, it's IMO a heck of a lot easier to build a good or decent sounding distortion for guitar than bass, simply due to frequency response. From a design standpoint, there is a tendency for the low end to really want to "fart" out for lack of more eloquent terminology. It's the nature of the waveform in those lower registers.
Aceman
I am your doctor of love!
Re: Bass guys - tell me about Bass Distortion
This is all making me think there is really no need unless I wake up and find myself the bass player in a power trio.
I always think I'd want distortion on octaves up if I were playing like that, but clean on the bottom.
Billy Sheehan did something like that didn't he?
This is all making me think there is really no need unless I wake up and find myself the bass player in a power trio.
I always think I'd want distortion on octaves up if I were playing like that, but clean on the bottom.
Billy Sheehan did something like that didn't he?
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