Black Winter in Mahogany

[Hsb]

As Ive stated in previous posts, I want to try a set of Black Winters, thinking of putting them in my mahogany LTD M-400.

The guitar came stock with a C5 and Jazz set, just not enough umph in either pickup. I swapped magnets previous and still just not doing it for me.

How would the BW or the BBW sound in a mahogany body, maple neck and depending on the site either jatoba or rosewod board. I think the boards were rosewood and eventually changed to jatoba.

 

[Overlord]

The Black Winter will obviously be higher output and a ceramic instead of an alnico 5 magnet.
I would say the BW and BBW are kind of like a more muscular and modern Duncan Distortion with a big focus on the mids.
Which can be either good or hard to dial out depending on your guitar and amp and your type of music.

In my opinion, I would say either the Full Shred or Parallel Axis PTB-1 would be closer to a C5 with a bit more output.

 

[Hsb]

I have a guitar with a Distortion and so far, its been my fave, kinda like the idea a more modern, muscular DD. Have the DD paired with a BW neck, running through my Marshall Jubilee mostly.

Just wasnt sure how the BW/BBW would be in a mahogny body. I def dig higher output picks, magnet doesnt matter as much, as I also dig the JB and Sentient.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

FWIW, I wouldn't say the BW is more muscular than a Distortion, personally. The BW is hotter, yes, but also, more focused in the mids. Particularly, the cutting type of mids, not the fat/stuffy low mids. A Distortion has more going on down low, and the BW is tighter and more focused. Very attacky. Mind you, it's not a thin-sounding pickup at all, but it's like a laser scalpel rather than a sledgehammer.

Honestly, I see and understand the comparison between the BW and the Distortion, but I've always thought of the BW as more of a JB on mega steroids, rather. It's more mid-focused, sorta like a JB, except not as stuffy in the low mids, and with a more modern and raspy attack. It's all relative, though. I always thought the Distortion resembles a JB in many ways as well, so take that as a grain of salt.

I think it's a perfect match for Mahogany. I used to have one in my Les Paul which sounded fantastic. Super aggressive, tight, and focused. Especially if you're playing metal. Honestly, I think the BW is kinda forgiving about what guitar you put it in. It's always sounded great in all of my guitars.

 

[Mincer]

The BW will have more body and thump than a DD. It won't cut as well, since the DD is more focused towards the treble. If you like the C5 and Jazz, but want 'more', I don't know if the BW wil be the ones to pick. Might be a candidate for active pickups.

 

[Securb]

I have the BBW set in a mahogany SG and it sounds stellar tons of grind and thump. What I love about it is the pickup responds to the volume knob very well. It is like having 2 - 3 different pickups in the guitar.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Interesting. So would you consider something with more mids more thumpy? Fot me, thump is in the lows.

I also don't think the 'Winter would have any trouble cutting either with such aggessive mids it has.

But yeah, it certainly won't have more thump than a Custom 5. That pickup is boomines incarnate. LOL

 

[Hsb]

Yeah the Custom wind does nothing for me and I like how the DD and JB are thicker than the Custom family.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Yeah, then you'll like the 'Winter.

 

[Overlord]

From my experience with both the DD and BBW in the same Mahogany guitar...
I would say the DD was much more cutting and sharp, and the BBW was thicker and rounder, but also tighter and clearer sounding if that makes sense.
The BW and BBW have a thing going on in the lower mids that I couldn't dial out with just my amps EQ.
Which is awesome for single notes, solos, and power chords. But I play all kinds of strange chords and timings, and I personally need less rounded mids.
I don't have the rounded mids, or sharp ice pick attack problem when I tried the JB in the same guitar,
The JB just had a bit too much flubiness in the low end to make it tight enough for me.

The Custom 5 is supposedly scooped in the mids, which didn't seem that scooped to me when I tried it in that same Mahogany guitar.
I really liked the DD and C5 better in that guitar than the BBW or JB.
So it really depends on what your playing, your amp, and your guitar if that suits you or not.

 

[Demanic]

Have you ever tried a Crunchlab?
Play the weirdest chords that you can think of, under the heaviest gain. Better play them well; you'll hear every mistake.

Sent from my SM-A115A using Tapatalk

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I guess I've got kind of a unique perception of pickups, but I've never found the JB loose, as everyone is saying. How can it, when it's low-end barely reaches down at all? What I will grant you is that the JB has a lot of stuffiness going on in the low-mids which can be hard to control, especially in low-mid-rich setups like 5150's and Mesa Recto cabs. But then again, I personally find the JB is a fatter-sounding pickup than most people give it credit for.

While the Black Winter does have a bit of a dirty voicing to the low-mids, I agree, it's not nearly as much as the JB. At least not in sheer quantity. I've never had a problem getting the Black Winter work with tight fast riffing. I mean, that is what it was designed to do.

But I also find it slightly oxymoronic that it has "rounded mids", but at the same time "sharp ice pick attack". IMO, its mids lean A LOT more towards the cutting, raspy edge of the spectrum. But rather than being sizzly like the Distortion, it's just bitey and attacky. So yeah, in that regard, it is very attacky. And while it does have the slightly dirty voicing to the low-mids, agreed, I think the high-mid emphasis highly overpowers it.

People consider the Custom/Custom 5 tight. And for me, they're the complete opposite. They've got a HUGE low-end that's, for me, hard to control if you're downtuning. And the Custom has the fast immediate-feeling kind of low-end (to an extent) because it's running on Ceramic, but the 5 isn't.

Then again, I am used to also using actives which are all mids and Tube Screamers, so take that as I grain of salt.

Also, what I play with the Black Winter is more along the lines of chunky riffing ala Sweedish metal rather than complex cords and sizzling distortion a la Norway. But I feel the Black Winter has no problem getting its Opeth on, TBH.

Sorry to defend the Winter so passionately, LOL. It's just that I love it so much. It's my favorite Duncan.

Buuuuuuuut, also don't discount the Gibson 500T! It's a bit more old-school sounding than the Black Winter. Not as attacky and slightly fuller, and it's not as sizzly as the Distortion either. But kind of along the lines of both.

 

[beaubrummels]

My experience with my Black Winters, Distortions, Custom family and JB in my SG and LP is similar to Overlord.

It's worth noting, my Black Winter (bridge anyway) is a very different animal in poplar or basswood vs mahogany. In my mahogany guitars, my Black Winter bridge had an almost 'active pickup' quality to it where I needed to tease a little more character out of it by changing my amp settings; while the same pickup in my Jackson sounded like a Distortion with tighter bass and a soft round mid bump that made it warmer than a Distortion or Custom. So the particular guitar can cause the pickup to be perceived and respond quite differently.

 

[Overlord]

I love the JB in certain guitars. But in some, that low end is just far too loose and slow in the attack and can get muddy. Even tuned to D.
The Custom 5 I've heard people complain it has too much of a low end, but I found it fairly tight and not that big on the lows and not that scooped in the mids at all.
I consider it more of a balanced EQ type of pickup.
Sort of like a PAF Pro or Fred, but the Fred definitely has some nicer upper mids and cuts through better of the 3 in my opinion.
At least in my mahogany guitar I've been talking about.
And yes I tried the Crunch Lab. It was cool, but also had a thing going on in the lower mids that I couldn't dial out and had too much of a thump and roundness to it.
I ended up preferring the D-Sonic to the Crunch Lab, Illuminator, and Dreamcatcher I tried in that same guitar.
Also tried the original Evolution bridge. I didn't get that ice pick highs that people complain about, but it just had such a huge low end on it.
I couldn't dial it out even with my amp eq's bass all the way down.
I also tried the Breed and the Dominion, and those two just had far too much low mids going on as well and everything felt too round and not sharp enough. Honestly I tried all kinds of pickups in that guitar. The ones that sounded the best to me were the Evo2, Parallel Axis PTB-1. Duncan Distortion, Fred, Transition, and Custom 5.
I haven't the chance try any BKP''s, Wolftone, or Mojotone's I have in it yet.
Or any of the custom wound SD's I ordered last year.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Yeah, not a fan of the Crunch Lab or the Dominion either.

The Crunch Lab I found too dark, and the Dominion too vocal/honky.

To me, the Crunch lab fits that descriptio of "round mids" much more than the Black Winter.

 

[Securb]

I guess I've got kind of a unique perception of pickups,.

That is why we are here. None of us has the same signal chains or techniques. Everyone here is going to have a different experience and perception of a piece of gear. If a pickup worked the same for everyone there would be no need for this forum.

 

[Overlord]

I would agree that the BW has less rounded and thick mids than those other two.
The Dominion had the thickest and biggest rounded lower mids of the bunch.
They were all tight in the lows it was just that roundness and not enough crispy upper mids and highs to balance them out in my opinion.
Again, great for single note stuff and solos, and maybe not so technical palm muted riffing, but still too much for my taste.
I actually really like the BW a lot. Just not in that particular guitar and what I was wanting out of it.

disclaimer: I'm also a big fan of the EMG 81, So take it as you will!

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I would agree that the BW has less rounded and thick mids than those other two.
The Dominion had the thickest and biggest rounded lower mids of the bunch.
They were all tight in the lows it was just that roundness and not enough crispy upper mids and highs to balance them out in my opinion.
Again, great for single note stuff and solos, and maybe not so technical palm muted riffing, but still too much for my taste.
I actually really like the BW a lot. Just not in that particular guitar and what I was wanting out of it.

disclaimer: I'm also a big fan of the EMG 81, So take it as you will!

Same.

It honestly sounds like we don't have disimilar tastes at all. Maybe you just got unlucky with yours, and I got lucky with mine. Who knows.

 

[Aceman]

I really need to try a black winter...because heaven knows I love a Distortion and the thump of a Custom.

 

[Overlord]

Same.

It honestly sounds like we don't have disimilar tastes at all. Maybe you just got unlucky with yours, and I got lucky with mine. Who knows.

My B.C. Rich Beast has a neck through mahogany neck and mahogany wings. So it might just be that particular guitar.
It took forever to find something I liked in it, should of just stuck with the Duncan Distortion, lol.
The Evo2 is what I have in there now, and it sounds mean and fairly balanced. I really like it a lot.

Hsb and Aceman, you guys should definitely give the Black Winter a shot.
If you like Distortion, then think of it as more modern, cleaner sounding, tighter, and with more mid thump.