Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

[RGN]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

That is a difficult question. At this level it isn't better, it is different. The VHT has a more dry tone and is very unforgiving. The Bogner isn't as dry as is more forgiving. Both amps have a ton of knobs to explore and tweak. Both have 1/2 power, both have gain stacking, both have foot switchable gain stages, etc... My 100CL has the class "A' option, the Bogner doesn't. There are applications I'd prefer to use the VHT and applications I'd take the Bogner. The 100CL can get a bit more nasty gain wise but isn't as organic (an overused word I know) as the Bogner. Both are great pieces of gear. It is like a Ferrari V12 vs. a Lambo V12. It I was in a death metal band I'd take the VHT. If I was in an 80s tribute hair band I'd take the Bogner. If I was in a blues band I'd flip a coin (the VHT sounds pretty awesome at lower gain levels).

 

[tone?]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

i know i am being spastic here but , i am getting the VHT Deliverance to do more of Van Halen/plexi tone.

 

[RGN]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

i know i am being spastic here but , i am getting the VHT Deliverance to do more of Van Halen/plexi tone.

That is the perfect choice. I hear there isn't an amp out there that will do early VH better. The 100CL will do more gain than the Deliverance but isn't going to be near as good at the plexi-type thing.

 

[tone?]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

Really? not even Splawn?

i tell you when i plugged into the Deliverance i was blown away. it sounded like the Green channel of the CL but wetter and more plexiish. if that makes sense.

i heard a few older marshalls but the deliverance blew them away in tone

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

RGN's right about all those amps being great but different. Once you're playing on Bogner, Diezel, VHT, Soldano, Two Rock etc, it's less about quality differences, and more about slight tonal differences.
Bogner - woody and rich in mids
Diezel - modern and glassy headroom
VHT - Dry, crunchy, and crushing
Soldano - smooth, bright, and saturated
Two Rock - dense and fusiony like highgain bassman

 

[Guitarist]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

I'm under the impression that RGN got a pretty good deal on his, but with that said, what is good price range for these amps on the used market? When is the seller over the top?

Also, how much more is a Classic gonna cost you?...and although I've read many claims of a woodier sound from the Classic, I'd appreciate an in-depth comparison of the two from one well situated with both.

Thanks.

 

[RGN]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

Used
Bogner 101B $2300 to 2700 depending on condition (New approx. $3200-3300)

Classic + $250-400

Diezel VH4 approx. $3300-3700 (new $4250 no deals)

VHT 100CL $ 1200-1550 (new $1750-2100)

I have never played or even seen a Classic before. Diezel holds its value extremely well. If you buy used you'll probably make a little cash if you take care of it well. A lot of guys love the Classic. Other will say that you can get an EL-34 101B to sound exactly like a Classic so don't waste the cash. GJ may have an opinion. I'd check Gearpage.net also..... lots of guys there with the Classic.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

I only heard a classic when someone was playing one onstage, and of course it sounded great, but I think the regular 101B has a nicer feel under the fingers. Also, I think they stripped away some tone-shaping switches on the Classic, which isn't something I'd like. Still, no matter what you buy from Bogner or Diezel, you're gonna be happy. People wouldn't pay the price of a used car for an amp head, unless these things delivered.

You can get a lot of amps to sound good on tape, but if you stand in front of one of these $3000 amps, plugging a nice guitar in, and turning the amp up to 5, it's a tone that'll make the hair stand up on your neck!!! Even vintage amps don't have the full frequencied wallop of a Bogner or Diezel. If you put a less expensive amp next to them, it makes them sound bad, even though you liked the sound before doing the comparison.
You really gotta hear one with 1 or 2 4-12 cabs!!!

 

[mr breaker]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

I have a Classic...and I love it. I got it for 2700 used.


A quick question for GJ or other ecstasy owners...

Sometimes when I'm playing, I feel like my fingers are moving faster than the amp. I plugged into my DSL the other day, and after playing the ecstasy non stop for months I really noticed that the DSL's response seemed much "faster". (But of course didn't sound nearly as good.)

Are there any settings that will make the response of the ecstasy faster, or is this just the nature of the amp?

 

[Nightburst]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

If you put a less expensive amp next to them, it makes them sound bad, even though you liked the sound before doing the comparison.

True!!! :banana: Couldn't have said it better.

btw. I got my 1010B for E1500... Just plain luck. The guy who sold it liked his Soldano better.

 

[tone?]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

I need to hear a Bogner after all this talk!


so RGN what does your dealer say about the Deliverance compared to the Pitbull series?

 

[Nightburst]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

I have a Classic...and I love it. I got it for 2700 used.


A quick question for GJ or other ecstasy owners...

Sometimes when I'm playing, I feel like my fingers are moving faster than the amp. I plugged into my DSL the other day, and after playing the ecstasy non stop for months I really noticed that the DSL's response seemed much "faster". (But of course didn't sound nearly as good.)

Are there any settings that will make the response of the ecstasy faster, or is this just the nature of the amp?

Maybe because it's a classic?
I have no delay issues like you described, maybe you want to set it for a less spongy feel? I can dial in any feel from ultra flabby to super tight.
Like Gearjoneser said the classic doesn't feature some of the tone shaping control switches.

 

[RGN]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

so RGN what does your dealer say about the Deliverance compared to the Pitbull series?

I haven't had a chance to ask him yet. Maybe this weekend if I run by there.... i'll let you know bro

 

[tone?]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

cool, a weekend run to the local boutique amp store.

the best way to start the weekend!

 

[mr breaker]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

Maybe because it's a classic?
I have no delay issues like you described, maybe you want to set it for a less spongy feel? I can dial in any feel from ultra flabby to super tight.
Like Gearjoneser said the classic doesn't feature some of the tone shaping control switches.

I don't think it's a tone thing...more of the response of it. And it's also not really noticeable until I play a different amp. Nor is it a big issue...just curious if it's something that can be changed through the settings.

 

[Nightburst]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

I don't think it's a tone thing...more of the response of it. And it's also not really noticeable until I play a different amp. Nor is it a big issue...just curious if it's something that can be changed through the settings.

The tone shaping controls (little switches above the eq section) also change the feel and response of the amp other than tone.
I prefer it quite loose actually because of the deeper bass you get.

 

[RGN]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

so RGN what does your dealer say about the Deliverance compared to the Pitbull series?

Here is a Deliverance clip that says it all IMO http://www.vhtamp.com/Toshi_Deliverance.mp3

He said the Deliverance is much more into a vintage type vibe, and gets to the first Van Halen album gain wise (not much more). Because it is lower gain, it has much more front-end headroom compared to the CL series. He says it is quite different than the green channel on the CL series. Sounds like it is going to be perfect for you man.

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

As far as the feel under the fingers and the speed of the attack.....I know most stuff can be dialed on the Ecstasy pretty exact. I don't really have much experience with the Ecstacy Classic. I think they stripped away a few switches, and the amp has a more wide open sound.

Mr. Breaker, you may want to play with the settings more, but also address whatever pickups you use and cabinets. I find that the amp is the most open sounding when it has JJ power tubes, rather than Svetlana, and the best pre tubes for it are GT12AX7C's. If you want a more immediate attack, stay with A5 pickups. The Bogner sounds good with most pickups, but C-5's, 59's, and vintage A5 singles sound best to me......that's just my taste though.

 

[mr breaker]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

Cool...next time I retube, I'll give those a shot.


My only real complaint about the amp is that the power cord does not detatch!

Anyone know if this is possible to mod?

 

[That90'sGuy]

Re: Bogner XTC... should I buy it?

RGN's right about all those amps being great but different. Once you're playing on Bogner, Diezel, VHT, Soldano, Two Rock etc, it's less about quality differences, and more about slight tonal differences.
Bogner - woody and rich in mids
Diezel - modern and glassy headroom
VHT - Dry, crunchy, and crushing
Soldano - smooth, bright, and saturated
Two Rock - dense and fusiony like highgain bassman

Wow, good job Joe! You just completely defined those amps to a tee :beerchug: