Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

[Zerberus]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

I actually had that on my Model 6 befoer I installed the original Pickups and preamp. a volume" feeding" another volume, or rather a "sub volume" for the bridge humbucker.

Was a cool idea, but I have to admit that I can´t remember ever using it after the first week

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

The 5 way switch is actually two switches...one on each side.

You could wire the two single coils to one side of the switch and the output of that side to a 250K volume pot.

You could wire the humbucker to the other side of the switch and the output of that side to a 500K volume pot.

Then you could bridge the outputs (the middle terminals) of those two pots together and feed the output jack and a 500K (or 250K) tone control.

I think it would work...but I haven't tried it.

Lew

There would probably be the same interaction between the two volume pots as there is in a Les Paul when both pickups are combined with this method. Meaning: if the vol. control for the bridge pickup was turned to zero the neck and middle pickups would be turned off too. But That'd be OK I think. We're really looking for a way to balance the hotter output of the bridge humbucker with the single coils and I think this method would work for that. I'm un sure of the effect the two volume controls would have on each other though. As I think about it, seems like maybe both would need to be 500K or maybe even 1 Meg? Not sure. I wish Kent was here! This would require some experimenting with pot values I think. Lew

 

[Breaking the law]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Okay, let's see how gets to do the wiring first.. my test guitar should arrive in half an hour, it was borrowed to this guy who had his guitar in repair..

I'll let you now what happens..

 

[Breaking the law]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Oh, one more thing.. my guitar is H/s/H.. I think I'll change it to H/s/s for this experiment. I'll also have to locate a working 500K pot. I need better methods for storaging my experimental stuff..

 

[Artie]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

I wish Kent was here! This would require some experimenting with pot values I think. Lew

Kent is definitely the man . . . but I can handle this one. :laugh2:

When the 5-way is in the #4 position, (assuming #1 to be the "neck" position), the two volume controls add in parallel:

(R1 x R2) / (R1 + R2) = total resistance

To make that easier, any time the two resistances are the same, they half.
So, if you used two 500k's, the pups would "see" 250k.
If you use a 250k for the singles, and a 500k for the 'bucker, then at #4 they would see 166.667k.

And so on, and so forth. It would be a bit of a compromise, but no more so than in any LP style guitar. Still, you may not want that interaction.

There is another way around it.

You just eliminate the ground from the second volume control, and short it to the wiper. This makes it a "trim" pot, rather then a volume control. You'ld have to experiment with different pot values, but probably, somewhere in the area of 1k to 10k would do it. Get one of those little trim-pot screwdriver adjust things, and mount it so that you can access the adjuster through a small pickguard hole might be cool.

(btw - those two little black "stubs" on the second pot are just remnants from another drawing. Ignore them.)

 

[Artie]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

One last thing, if you're not in a huge hurry, I'll add one of those trim-pots to one of my own guitars, and get you a ballpark resistance value. (And to make certain that it works.) But it'll take me a few days, to a week, to get it together.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

When I get into the shop today at noon, I'll ask Morgan to scan a diagram I just drew up and put it in a format I can show here.

My idea is just a little differant from yours Artie (Tho yours seems just fine too!) as it would have the neck and middle pickup on one side of the switch with the output of that side of the 5 way switch going to volume pot 1.

The bridge pickup would be connected to the other side of the switch with that output going to volume pot 2.

Then the outputs of the two volume pots would be combined and that combined output would go to the output jack and a master tone control.

Lew

 

[Artie]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

That would work good too, Lew, but you still will have "LP volume interaction" thang. There's just no way to get around that . . . unless you use the "special" volume control wiring that I've developed some time ago, but haven't tested in a guitar.

I've tested it in the "lab", but not in a guitar. I just hate to publish it 'til I see it work in real life.

Anyone want to loan a guinea pig dual-volume guitar? :laugh2:

Edit: You know . . . this has been bugging me for awhile. I've already got all the parts and the pickguard gathered up to convert my Johnson Strat to HSS. I'm going to go ahead and convert it to dual-volume at the same time. Do exactly what GJ is asking about, and see how this works once and for all. I do have to order the "special" pots, but other than that, I should have this resolved in a week or so.

Stay tuna-ed. The dual-volume solution is on its way. (fingers crossed). :laugh2:

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

That would work good too, Lew, but you still will have "LP volume interaction" thang. There's just no way to get around that . . . unless you use the "special" volume control wiring that I've developed some time ago, but haven't tested in a guitar.

Yep...you will. But hey: what's wrong with that? :laugh2: Half the people here have a Les Paul and never complain about interacting volume controls. Lew

 

[Marcel]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Note that both of those drawings have the classic dual-volume control problem. Ideally, the two pots should be reversed. (Wiper for "hot" end.)

I can draw that if anyone needs.

That's important, coz with muting the bridge on your diagram you mute the singles too.. *edit* ahh theres a swithch in between :smack:

 

[Artie]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Half the people here have a Les Paul and never complain about interacting volume controls. Lew

Exactly . . . which has created a bit of a conundrum for me.
Lew, if you don't mind, I might call you up later this week. (Not today, its Sunday.)

As a business man, you might be able to advise me on something.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Exactly . . . which has created a bit of a conundrum for me.
Lew, if you don't mind, I might call you up later this week. (Not today, its Sunday.)

As a business man, you might be able to advise me on something.

Anytime Artie! My shop number is 303-443-2030. I'll be in today around noon. I'm off on monday and wednesday...but Morgan's nice to talk to also! :laugh2: And she's way better looking! :laugh2: Lew

 

[Artie]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Anytime Artie! My shop number is 303-443-2030. I'll be in today around noon. I'm off on monday and wednesday...but Morgan's nice to talk to also! :laugh2: And she's way better looking! :laugh2: Lew

Thanks Lew. Depending on how the rest of my does goes, I might just give you a ring.

 

[Breaking the law]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

I ried lew's 2 switches in a 5-way switch idea.. it didn't work.. I only got the bridge humbucker to work.. this could be because it's a standard Squier 5-way, all the terminals are lined up.. I dunno. I'll work more on it tomorrow, it's been a busy day today..

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

I ried lew's 2 switches in a 5-way switch idea.. it didn't work.. I only got the bridge humbucker to work.. this could be because it's a standard Squier 5-way, all the terminals are lined up.. I dunno. I'll work more on it tomorrow, it's been a busy day today..

I had a Switchcraft CRL style switch in mind. Like the one shown in Artie's diagram. I don't know how those other switches work inside. Lew

 

[Breaking the law]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

Well, from my experiments (I often end up being the guy who does the wiring for other people) the Squier switch works in most cases.. where can i get he switchcraft thingies, though? Now I'm really intersted in figuring this out..

 

[Gearjoneser]

Re: Brilliant Idea for HSS Guitars. Need Wiring Schematic!

I re-read my first post, and realized that if the first volume didn't effect all the pickups, globally, the guitar would mute if you went from the singles to the bridge, if the volume was off. I'm thinking that the best idea is to have the first and third pot be the master volume and bridge tone. The middle pot should simply be a way of siphoning the bridge signal to ground with a cap to keep it natural sounding, throughout it's sweep. Is this easier than my first concept?