Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

[appar111]

I have an alder tele body on the way and plan on putting Watco Danish Oil or Teak Oil on it, and wondered if I can put Bullseye Shellac over top of it when it cures.

I basically want the feel & look of the body to be that of a nice piece of furniture-- I want the feel of wood and something that has a nice patina to it, something that will age nicely.

I've used Tru-Oil gunstock finish and wax on another guitar (swamp ash with no grain filler) with very good results, I just wanted to try something slightly different for this guitar.

 

[frankfalbo]

Re: Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

For a furniture style finish I don't like using Danish oil. It seems to take too long to cure, and you can't build with it. I also don't like building finish in layers when oil is the bottom layer. I prefer to do it the other way around, and with nitrocellulose underneath, then oil (linseed, tung oil, or my favorite is polymerized tung oil) then finally paste wax. If you like the way Bullseye Shellac feels, don't bother undercoating with Danish Oil. Just go with the shellac.

On Alder, assuming I want a natural look, I would use General Finishes Arm-R-Seal Satin finish. I like the Satin because it has a lot of satin texture to it. Even if you are going to rub that out with Paste Wax later, it leaves a nice silky look to the finish that you won't have with their gloss product. Then I'd follow up with Minwax Paste Wax. I like to apply that with 0000 steel wool. That way you work it into the finish as you're conditioning the surface of the Arm-R-Seal. Buff the wax out, and you've got a nice sheen on top of a silky looking finish that's harder than oil or shellac. Alder is pretty soft, so the harder the better.

 

[appar111]

Re: Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

What do you mean when you say you can't build with Danish Oil? You mean the layers don't build up? I figured they'd just keep soaking into the wood. I didn't think it was supposed to take too long to cure, though.

The only thing about the shellac is that is that it's not resistant to alcohol, so if I take this guitar out to gigs at bars and I spill a beer or shot on the guitar (which happens from time to time) it would definitely leave its mark on the finish.

I may just end up going w/ the Tru Oil gunstock finish & wax, since like you said, alder isn't the hardest wood. Plus it turned out great on the swamp ash tele-- nice hard finish, satiny, resistant to moisture, alcohol, etc. etc. Sounds like I'm talking myself into the Tru-Oil again-- heck, if it works and it would give me the finish & look that I want, than why not use it again, right?

What if I just did Danish Oil (one or two coats) and that's it? As long as I gave it plenty of time to harden up. It would basically end up still feeling like raw wood though since it hardens in the wood and not on the wood, right?

 

[butnut]

Re: Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

Basically yes. I use Danish oil in my furniture biz and love the way it brought out the color of raw Koa. Wipe on the first soak coat, wait a few hours and wipe. Apply a second coat, this time use 400 grit wet/dry sandpaper and 'burnish'/rub the oil in the grain, sand with the grain. Let dry and final wipe with lint free cloth soaked with oil and rub with the grain, this will be more like buffing, not soaking. I let this dry a few days until hard and wipe with a dry cloth, then blow with air. It is now ready for any top coat. I favored Magnalac precatalyzed lacquer for and easy and natural looking finish that is water ring proof too. Some furniture that was done 'natural' was done the same way, (NO lacquer) and later Johnsons paste wax was used to protect and shine the oil finish. Gotta keep up with the wax to maintain.

 

[appar111]

Re: Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

That seems to be the trick with the paste wax is that it needs reapplied. A little tricky once the guitar has been assembled, unless you want to disassemble it again to reapply the wax.

If I'm putting Tru Oil on it (the finish and the wax) then do I even need to put the Danish Oil on it? The Tru-Oil will protect the wood just fine, especially w/ the final coat of wax, and the Tru-Oil finish really brings out the grain.

I'm just trying to figure out if there is any sort of benefit of putting Danish Oil on first, if the top coat I'm going to be using is Tru-Oil.

 

[Curly]

Re: Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

I'm no finish expert, but I've done several necks with Tru Oil.

Tru Oil is actually a varnish. I've applied it directly to dyed wood. It builds up to a hard finish. Birchwood Casey also makes a sealer that you could apply as a base coat, or alternately, you could use shellac.

I'm not really familiar with Danish oil. However, some builders use tung oil, which remains relatively soft, then apply a finish coat of beeswax or similar product. "Briwax" is another good product for the finish coat. It's a combination of beeswax and carnauba. As mentioned, oil finishes need occasional maintenance, as do Tru Oil finishes.

I personally don't think I'd use a softer oil under Tru Oil. I would prefer to build up Tru Oil in enough layers to protect while still keeping the finish thin. This is something like 4 coats.

FWIW, there is a good tutorial on applying Tru Oil on Luthier's Mercantile's site.

 

[appar111]

Re: Can I put shellac over Danish Oil?

I think I put 2 or 3 coats of Tru-Oil finish on the swamp ash body I did-- rubbing each one in very thouroughly until there was virtually no finish sitting on top of the wood. Then I followed up w/ two coats of the Tru-Oil wax and that was 6 months ago and the guitar doesn't need any maintenance at all-- looks exactly like it did 6 months ago.

I think I'll just end up going the Tru-Oil route again because it works, its easy and it protects the wood great.