thebingopete
New member
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Some people make a good living bootlegging.
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Some people make a good living bootlegging.
Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
- Thread starter gtrwizrd567
- Start date
uOpt
Something Cool
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
This isn't a trademark issue. Paint and other layout elements made from stickers are copyright.
There is no question that the owner of that copyright (the person who made the original, unless copyright was reassigned, e.g. by selling) can make you stop offering that service. It is somewhat unlikely that this is going to happen with a guitar that has only one original. It is very likely to happen if a commercial guitar maker bought a license and is making that look commercially available.
The major risk in the case of owner-only published guitars (no commercial offerings) is that the owner, usually a musician, will get into "you are not going to make money off my creation" mode. Still, the legal consequences are unlikely to go any farther than asking you to stop.
Smart musicians will like you doing this because it creates buzz about them and buzz means more popularity and sales for them. There are always some who think in the "not off my creation" mindset even if they make overall more money by allowing you to make some of your own.
This isn't a trademark issue. Paint and other layout elements made from stickers are copyright.
There is no question that the owner of that copyright (the person who made the original, unless copyright was reassigned, e.g. by selling) can make you stop offering that service. It is somewhat unlikely that this is going to happen with a guitar that has only one original. It is very likely to happen if a commercial guitar maker bought a license and is making that look commercially available.
The major risk in the case of owner-only published guitars (no commercial offerings) is that the owner, usually a musician, will get into "you are not going to make money off my creation" mode. Still, the legal consequences are unlikely to go any farther than asking you to stop.
Smart musicians will like you doing this because it creates buzz about them and buzz means more popularity and sales for them. There are always some who think in the "not off my creation" mindset even if they make overall more money by allowing you to make some of your own.
Johnny the Kid
Shaunofthedeadologist
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Some people make a good living selling drugs. Doesn't mean it's good or legal.
Some people make a good living selling drugs. Doesn't mean it's good or legal.
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
If I was Mr. Famous Rock Star with lots of lawsuit money, and I saw someone use my 'likeness' (or what people think of when they think of my likeness), and make money off of something I created, I'd go after them. I don't know if I'd have a case, but their money would run out before mine, and that is sort of the same thing.
If I was Mr. Famous Rock Star with lots of lawsuit money, and I saw someone use my 'likeness' (or what people think of when they think of my likeness), and make money off of something I created, I'd go after them. I don't know if I'd have a case, but their money would run out before mine, and that is sort of the same thing.
thebingopete
New member
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Do any of you have experience in this? Have you actually tried to get permission to reprint an image? Or just print your own version to sell? No? Then your legalise speak is meaningless. Recognizing that his merchandise was inferior to the pirate t-shirts sold in the lot, Bob Dylan said "These bootleggers make some pretty good stuff!" The shirts I was hustling this year on Phish and Dead & Co tours this summer were better than the ones inside at the merch table. And we were selling cheaper. Sure the copyright police hassled us a few times but that's the cost of doing business.
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Do any of you have experience in this? Have you actually tried to get permission to reprint an image? Or just print your own version to sell? No? Then your legalise speak is meaningless. Recognizing that his merchandise was inferior to the pirate t-shirts sold in the lot, Bob Dylan said "These bootleggers make some pretty good stuff!" The shirts I was hustling this year on Phish and Dead & Co tours this summer were better than the ones inside at the merch table. And we were selling cheaper. Sure the copyright police hassled us a few times but that's the cost of doing business.
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thebingopete
New member
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
I've also worked for legitimate commercial art services. And we had a lot of legal leniency. Copyright didn't always apply. Where there's a law. There's a loophole.
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I've also worked for legitimate commercial art services. And we had a lot of legal leniency. Copyright didn't always apply. Where there's a law. There's a loophole.
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Johnny the Kid
Shaunofthedeadologist
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
So you openly admit that this it bootlegging? Some musicians will be pretty lenient about it. Others will be understandably pissed off.
How do you know that the shirts you were selling were better? Unless the shirts that were being sold at the merch table were disintegrating thirty seconds after purchase, you cannot say with certainty that they were better. Once again, visual designs cannot be quantized as better or worse, only different. And seeing as how you were the one selling them, I highly doubt that you would say "Yeah the other ones were better."
You state that you were harassed a few times by the copywrite police, and this is the exact type of stuff the OP wishes to avoid.
So you openly admit that this it bootlegging? Some musicians will be pretty lenient about it. Others will be understandably pissed off.
How do you know that the shirts you were selling were better? Unless the shirts that were being sold at the merch table were disintegrating thirty seconds after purchase, you cannot say with certainty that they were better. Once again, visual designs cannot be quantized as better or worse, only different. And seeing as how you were the one selling them, I highly doubt that you would say "Yeah the other ones were better."
You state that you were harassed a few times by the copywrite police, and this is the exact type of stuff the OP wishes to avoid.
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Doesn't make it legal. Also how long do they get to make a good legal before they get hit by lawyers?
I actually do. I've done graphics work and programming for a racing game where we had to get permission from various companies. I've also had to get permission on different art projects I've done. I've also talked to different lawyers on the subject.
The only thing really helping bootleggers, is in some areas they're so numerous it is hard to hit them all. Plus many are fly by night, so they're gone before lawyers can get a C&D sent. For an undertaking like this, he's not going to have that same level of projection. It is a niche market, where he would be attracting a lot of attention from people who could cause him a world of hurt. Your bootlegging shirts outside of a concert is nothing like setting up a proper business where you'd need some roots, as doing work for hire is not really a impulse purchase that can be quickly taken care of.
Doesn't make it legal. Also how long do they get to make a good legal before they get hit by lawyers?
I actually do. I've done graphics work and programming for a racing game where we had to get permission from various companies. I've also had to get permission on different art projects I've done. I've also talked to different lawyers on the subject.
The only thing really helping bootleggers, is in some areas they're so numerous it is hard to hit them all. Plus many are fly by night, so they're gone before lawyers can get a C&D sent. For an undertaking like this, he's not going to have that same level of projection. It is a niche market, where he would be attracting a lot of attention from people who could cause him a world of hurt. Your bootlegging shirts outside of a concert is nothing like setting up a proper business where you'd need some roots, as doing work for hire is not really a impulse purchase that can be quickly taken care of.
uOpt
Something Cool
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Yes that is the risk. The question is how much harm comes to the target if they instantly surrender. They would lose items they already made and then can't sell. Making them pay legal cost is in turn tricky unless they resist.
Yes that is the risk. The question is how much harm comes to the target if they instantly surrender. They would lose items they already made and then can't sell. Making them pay legal cost is in turn tricky unless they resist.
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
I am guessing the Rock Star has better lawyers, so all sorts of things can happen. I've seen tribute bands that get sued by using the logos and likenesses of the band they are giving tribute to. Doesn't mean the case goes to court, but usually something like this starts with 'stop or you are getting sued and losing everything' which stops the offenders in their tracks.
I am guessing the Rock Star has better lawyers, so all sorts of things can happen. I've seen tribute bands that get sued by using the logos and likenesses of the band they are giving tribute to. Doesn't mean the case goes to court, but usually something like this starts with 'stop or you are getting sued and losing everything' which stops the offenders in their tracks.
uOpt
Something Cool
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Actually performing music with trademarks or copyright owned by the covered artist is doing damage that you can claim with a court. Those concert goers might have wanted to go to the original artist and now the cash is spent, or they gained a negative impression not realizing this isn't the real thing and don't buy the album.
If there currently is no signature guitar commercially available then a person who offers such a guitar can be made to stop it. Claiming damage done is a couple of orders more difficult in this case.
Actually performing music with trademarks or copyright owned by the covered artist is doing damage that you can claim with a court. Those concert goers might have wanted to go to the original artist and now the cash is spent, or they gained a negative impression not realizing this isn't the real thing and don't buy the album.
If there currently is no signature guitar commercially available then a person who offers such a guitar can be made to stop it. Claiming damage done is a couple of orders more difficult in this case.
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Right, but that is the point. It doesn't matter if there is a case or not. If you are a 1 person operation and you get a C&D from a law firm, it is pretty intimidating. It is up to a judge later on to take the case, but they will threaten that producing a product that the artist doesn't have control over hurts their 'brand'. It may be hogwash, but a 1 person shop would be silly to want to take that on, unless they have unlimited funds.
Right, but that is the point. It doesn't matter if there is a case or not. If you are a 1 person operation and you get a C&D from a law firm, it is pretty intimidating. It is up to a judge later on to take the case, but they will threaten that producing a product that the artist doesn't have control over hurts their 'brand'. It may be hogwash, but a 1 person shop would be silly to want to take that on, unless they have unlimited funds.
uOpt
Something Cool
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
Well it goes without saying that if you get the cease part of the C&C you do cease, instantly. I thought I made that clear.
Well it goes without saying that if you get the cease part of the C&C you do cease, instantly. I thought I made that clear.
ginormous
Understatmentologist
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
The waters are swimming with intellectual property lawyers. Any time money's involved, there's lawyers.
Google "Monster Cable IP lawsuits"... watch your screen choke on the results.
If you intend on selling the guitars, you have to at least recoup the cost of parts and materials -- finishes, decals, paint, etc.
If you want to do them for yourself at home, as a hobby, and never sell any of them to anyone ever in your life, ever, you might be able to skate... but don't quote me.
Written disclaimers ("I am not affiliated with 'X' Guitar Co.") and waivers ("If you get caught selling this as an original, that's on you, bro... sign here") for one-off "tribute pieces" can indemnify to a degree.
However, as alluded to earlier, anything invented can be circumvented.
My opinion is to get a professional with training and experience (maybe one o' them 'blues lawyers') to look at how you can do this without being sued into oblivion.
The waters are swimming with intellectual property lawyers. Any time money's involved, there's lawyers.
Google "Monster Cable IP lawsuits"... watch your screen choke on the results.
If you intend on selling the guitars, you have to at least recoup the cost of parts and materials -- finishes, decals, paint, etc.
If you want to do them for yourself at home, as a hobby, and never sell any of them to anyone ever in your life, ever, you might be able to skate... but don't quote me.
Written disclaimers ("I am not affiliated with 'X' Guitar Co.") and waivers ("If you get caught selling this as an original, that's on you, bro... sign here") for one-off "tribute pieces" can indemnify to a degree.
However, as alluded to earlier, anything invented can be circumvented.
My opinion is to get a professional with training and experience (maybe one o' them 'blues lawyers') to look at how you can do this without being sued into oblivion.
ThisDyingSoul76
New member
Re: Can I Sell Replicated Guitars Legally?
There was a time where Ed Roman was making and selling replicas of famous guitars. He typically got his hands on whatever guitar the original was (at least the brand if not the exact model) and refinished it to match the original. Not sure if he had legal issues with it but he was doing it for years before he died.
There was a time where Ed Roman was making and selling replicas of famous guitars. He typically got his hands on whatever guitar the original was (at least the brand if not the exact model) and refinished it to match the original. Not sure if he had legal issues with it but he was doing it for years before he died.
