Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
- Thread starter edi_87
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texasguitarslinger
Mo Cow Bellologist
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
I prefer Marshall. But Vox & Mesa Boogie a really good too. Bad thing is to get them at a decent price you have to buy them used unless you luck out and a guitar store is going out of business (read MARS).
I prefer Marshall. But Vox & Mesa Boogie a really good too. Bad thing is to get them at a decent price you have to buy them used unless you luck out and a guitar store is going out of business (read MARS).
italic zero
New member
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
I'd get the Bogner or ENGL. They just own Marshalls IMO.
I'd get the Bogner or ENGL. They just own Marshalls IMO.
That90'sGuy
DyzaBoyzologist
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
Before you make any decisions, ask yourself want bands you like and what application you'll be using it for. That will give us somewhere to go.
First off, no Marshall TSL. If you're gonna go Marshall, get the DSL. Now ask yourself what you're looking for in an amp...
Before you make any decisions, ask yourself want bands you like and what application you'll be using it for. That will give us somewhere to go.
First off, no Marshall TSL. If you're gonna go Marshall, get the DSL. Now ask yourself what you're looking for in an amp...
BluesNRock87
New member
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
ive never played the bogner, but every engl ive ever played has totally screamed. a few marshalls have come close, but never equalled and engl ive played....to think of it i cant recall ever playing a bad engl. marshall, you could get lucky and get a real jem, but most sound the same.....dsl over tsl tho.
engl over marshall for sure, bogner, never played...?
ive never played the bogner, but every engl ive ever played has totally screamed. a few marshalls have come close, but never equalled and engl ive played....to think of it i cant recall ever playing a bad engl. marshall, you could get lucky and get a real jem, but most sound the same.....dsl over tsl tho.
engl over marshall for sure, bogner, never played...?
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
Unless you're a very rich 17 year old, the Bogner is a HUGE investment.
At $3500 plus tax for the head alone, you'll be saving for awhile.
Used, they go for $2300, if you're lucky enough to grab one before someone else does. It's the end of the road for channel switching, great toned amps.
Diezels are in the same league, but you'll have to sell your dad's car to buy one.
The ENGL Powerball, Fireball, Special Ed, Savage, and Blackmore are all
great worthy contenders. You'll be looking at around $1500, but getting
better tone than Mesa.
Soldano Hotrod 50 Plus is a great channel switching head you can score used for around $1000. If it doesn't say Plus, it's a single channel.
VHT, Egnater, DSL's, Jubilee's, 30th Ann Marshalls, Budda SD 80, Hughes & Kettner Triamp and Duotone, and Laneys are all great, versatile amps with nice high gain channels.
Unless you're a very rich 17 year old, the Bogner is a HUGE investment.
At $3500 plus tax for the head alone, you'll be saving for awhile.
Used, they go for $2300, if you're lucky enough to grab one before someone else does. It's the end of the road for channel switching, great toned amps.
Diezels are in the same league, but you'll have to sell your dad's car to buy one.
The ENGL Powerball, Fireball, Special Ed, Savage, and Blackmore are all
great worthy contenders. You'll be looking at around $1500, but getting
better tone than Mesa.
Soldano Hotrod 50 Plus is a great channel switching head you can score used for around $1000. If it doesn't say Plus, it's a single channel.
VHT, Egnater, DSL's, Jubilee's, 30th Ann Marshalls, Budda SD 80, Hughes & Kettner Triamp and Duotone, and Laneys are all great, versatile amps with nice high gain channels.
y2stevo
New member
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
There is a good few people that are happy with their TSL and prefer it to the DSL but the Majority would choose The DSL..
Also teh DSL 50 is much more than enough power than you'll ever need..
the chris has got it right on..from personal experience the DSL IMO wins countless times over the TSL.. TSL's to me sem to have no life, I would proboly choose a Mode Four over the TSL to be honest and that doesn't really say alot...the_Chris said:Before you make any decisions, ask yourself want bands you like and what application you'll be using it for. That will give us somewhere to go.
First off, no Marshall TSL. If you're gonna go Marshall, get the DSL. Now ask yourself what you're looking for in an amp...
There is a good few people that are happy with their TSL and prefer it to the DSL but the Majority would choose The DSL..
Also teh DSL 50 is much more than enough power than you'll ever need..
Stratoplayer
New member
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
Bogner Ecstasy! It's worth all the extra scratch.
Bogner Ecstasy! It's worth all the extra scratch.
Stratoplayer
New member
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
Why is it better than the TSL?y2stevo said:
Jeff_H
Dean Hardtail Fanologist
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
The Bogner is the end all amp IMO. I'd love to have one. Next would be the Engl, then the DSL. The TSL I would stay away from. I'm a huge Marshall fan, but the Bogner is the ultimate rock amp...period.
The Bogner is the end all amp IMO. I'd love to have one. Next would be the Engl, then the DSL. The TSL I would stay away from. I'm a huge Marshall fan, but the Bogner is the ultimate rock amp...period.
Humphrey Bear
New member
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
Hey, hold on a sec, You all forgot about the amazing Framus Cobra head:
http://www.framus.com/cobrahead.htm
That's what I am going to get.
Hey, hold on a sec, You all forgot about the amazing Framus Cobra head:
http://www.framus.com/cobrahead.htm
That's what I am going to get.
That90'sGuy
DyzaBoyzologist
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
No offense HB, but I actually don't care for the Framus Cobra, doesn't sound as rich as the other high end amps to my ears. It's still a great amp however.
Bogner makes an amazing amp, I just wish there was more channels. My Triamp allows me to get a lot of great tones, but the quality isn't quite as good as the boutique stuff. The day Bogner allows a chimey clean channel (see the Tophat Club Deluxe...drool), a light crunch channel (responsive so that you can roll back the volume and it's crystal clear, like 2a on my Triamp), plexi channel (like the Mojave Peacemaker), high gain rhythm (basically what they have as the high gain channel on the early 101b and 100b models), and a solo channel, I will sell whatever I can to buy it. For the styles I jump around from, I need all those different tones, so 3 won't cut it. (modern/vintage switches, pentode/triode things are all cool, but if they aren't footswitchable, they aren't useful for gigs )
If it can ever get that type of versatility, or MIDI support so that you can program all the individual settings (so you are only limited channel wise by the footboard). That way you can get vintage and modern tones without having to flip switches live... that's the best way I think Bogner could keep it's high quality tone (I hear the more channels, the more tone that gets lost, which is why single channel boutique amps sound so great). I know the Bogner is capable of getting so many tones, but it's accessing them all on the fly that concerns me. Perhaps Gearjoneser can fill me in on this
No offense HB, but I actually don't care for the Framus Cobra, doesn't sound as rich as the other high end amps to my ears. It's still a great amp however.
Bogner makes an amazing amp, I just wish there was more channels. My Triamp allows me to get a lot of great tones, but the quality isn't quite as good as the boutique stuff. The day Bogner allows a chimey clean channel (see the Tophat Club Deluxe...drool), a light crunch channel (responsive so that you can roll back the volume and it's crystal clear, like 2a on my Triamp), plexi channel (like the Mojave Peacemaker), high gain rhythm (basically what they have as the high gain channel on the early 101b and 100b models), and a solo channel, I will sell whatever I can to buy it. For the styles I jump around from, I need all those different tones, so 3 won't cut it. (modern/vintage switches, pentode/triode things are all cool, but if they aren't footswitchable, they aren't useful for gigs
)If it can ever get that type of versatility, or MIDI support so that you can program all the individual settings (so you are only limited channel wise by the footboard). That way you can get vintage and modern tones without having to flip switches live... that's the best way I think Bogner could keep it's high quality tone (I hear the more channels, the more tone that gets lost, which is why single channel boutique amps sound so great). I know the Bogner is capable of getting so many tones, but it's accessing them all on the fly that concerns me. Perhaps Gearjoneser can fill me in on this
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
To be honest, I kinda feel guilty talking about my Bogner Ecstasy because
no matter what I say, it sounds like bragging, which is not the way I am in person.
:laugh2:
Several years ago, I went to Bogner's shop in North Hollywood and plugged into this revered boutique, which was the talk of the town in the mid 90's.
The guys at the shop were the biggest tone snobs you've ever talked to.
I asked them how the Bogner compares to a Mesa, and they almost threw me out of the store! :laugh2: They said "Uhh, we only carry serious tone machines, here. So, I proceeded to plug into an early metalfront Ecstasy
with a Paul and a Strat. I sh!t my pants! :32: I'm not kidding. You honestly
can't play that amp for an hour and know it's capabilities. I went through a lot of different amps in the 90's, and a couple years ago, stumbled on a seller of an original "loaded" Ecstasy. I sold two amps, and added $800, just for the head. Since then, I've gotten the 4-12 and 2-12 cabs.
Bogner succeeded at what every other company tried to do, but weren't able to pull off. There's a bunch of switches on the front and back that all effect each channel in some way. They reconfigure the EQ structure. They change the vibe of the amp, and even put the gain structures in different levels. You can assign plexi mode to the blue channel and red channel. You can make the clean channel sound like every kind of clean amp from Blackface to Tweeds to JTM 45's. You can loosen the response or tighten it. The "structure" switch changes the sound from a Marshall to a Mesa type tone. The Old/New switch emulates rectifier sag or tight solid state rectification. It's sick!
With the right tubes, that amp will utterly destroy anything you put next to it.
I spent time auditioning second guitarists for my band and heard a bunch of different rigs next to it. There wasn't one guy who didn't instantly fall in love with the amp. As far as versatility and authentic tone, there's nothing that comes a close second. With 3 channels that can sound like anything you hear in your head, plus a boost for all 3, you really can't ask for much more.
The trick is to not become addicted to channel switching. If you approach the amp like a 3 amp setup and choose the right amp for the song, you'll
look less like a tapdancer and the amp will be a tool, not a luxury of versatility. I'm learning to think of it as 3 separate amps, and not hit a different channel for every part of the song. It took me over 6 months to
sink into that amp. Now, it's a part of me, and I can hardly even look at other amps, including my Matchless, Marshall, and Fender!
I'd cry for months if it were stolen, and will never, ever sell it. When people complain about the high price, I remind them of that fact. If you only buy one amp, it's worth it, isn't it?
As a side note. If you ever plug into an Ecstasy for a few minutes, you can't judge anything on that. You basically need to own it, put the right tubes in it, and use it for about a month before you start to understand that
Reinholdt is the greatest amp builder that ever lived. Van Halen thinks so,
Satriani, Eric Johnson, G. Lynch, Cantrell, and the world's top producers agree, too. I don't think it could be topped.
To be honest, I kinda feel guilty talking about my Bogner Ecstasy because
no matter what I say, it sounds like bragging, which is not the way I am in person.
:laugh2: Several years ago, I went to Bogner's shop in North Hollywood and plugged into this revered boutique, which was the talk of the town in the mid 90's.
The guys at the shop were the biggest tone snobs you've ever talked to.
I asked them how the Bogner compares to a Mesa, and they almost threw me out of the store! :laugh2: They said "Uhh, we only carry serious tone machines, here. So, I proceeded to plug into an early metalfront Ecstasy
with a Paul and a Strat. I sh!t my pants! :32: I'm not kidding. You honestly
can't play that amp for an hour and know it's capabilities. I went through a lot of different amps in the 90's, and a couple years ago, stumbled on a seller of an original "loaded" Ecstasy. I sold two amps, and added $800, just for the head. Since then, I've gotten the 4-12 and 2-12 cabs.
Bogner succeeded at what every other company tried to do, but weren't able to pull off. There's a bunch of switches on the front and back that all effect each channel in some way. They reconfigure the EQ structure. They change the vibe of the amp, and even put the gain structures in different levels. You can assign plexi mode to the blue channel and red channel. You can make the clean channel sound like every kind of clean amp from Blackface to Tweeds to JTM 45's. You can loosen the response or tighten it. The "structure" switch changes the sound from a Marshall to a Mesa type tone. The Old/New switch emulates rectifier sag or tight solid state rectification. It's sick!
With the right tubes, that amp will utterly destroy anything you put next to it.
I spent time auditioning second guitarists for my band and heard a bunch of different rigs next to it. There wasn't one guy who didn't instantly fall in love with the amp. As far as versatility and authentic tone, there's nothing that comes a close second. With 3 channels that can sound like anything you hear in your head, plus a boost for all 3, you really can't ask for much more.
The trick is to not become addicted to channel switching. If you approach the amp like a 3 amp setup and choose the right amp for the song, you'll
look less like a tapdancer and the amp will be a tool, not a luxury of versatility. I'm learning to think of it as 3 separate amps, and not hit a different channel for every part of the song. It took me over 6 months to
sink into that amp. Now, it's a part of me, and I can hardly even look at other amps, including my Matchless, Marshall, and Fender!
I'd cry for months if it were stolen, and will never, ever sell it. When people complain about the high price, I remind them of that fact. If you only buy one amp, it's worth it, isn't it?
As a side note. If you ever plug into an Ecstasy for a few minutes, you can't judge anything on that. You basically need to own it, put the right tubes in it, and use it for about a month before you start to understand that
Reinholdt is the greatest amp builder that ever lived. Van Halen thinks so,
Satriani, Eric Johnson, G. Lynch, Cantrell, and the world's top producers agree, too. I don't think it could be topped.
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Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
I know I rambled about the Ecstasy, but the fact is, you don't NEED an amp like that to have great tone. Some of the greatest tones in history came out of plain old Marshall, Fenders, and Vox's. It's all in how you setup you own rig. With the right guitar, pickups, amps, and pedals, the world of tone is infinite. I admit, I'm spoiled but I could just as easily plug into a 5150 next to a Hotrod Deville and get a great tone out of it. It's a simple as having a few quality components in your rig, and eliminating the weak links.
I know I rambled about the Ecstasy, but the fact is, you don't NEED an amp like that to have great tone. Some of the greatest tones in history came out of plain old Marshall, Fenders, and Vox's. It's all in how you setup you own rig. With the right guitar, pickups, amps, and pedals, the world of tone is infinite. I admit, I'm spoiled but I could just as easily plug into a 5150 next to a Hotrod Deville and get a great tone out of it. It's a simple as having a few quality components in your rig, and eliminating the weak links.
That90'sGuy
DyzaBoyzologist
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
Gearjoneser, with the boost features... can you get the type of versatility I am looking for?
Chimey Fender cleans boosted to a bluesy overdrive, a light crunch that can be boosted to something like a Marshall plexi, and a high gain channel that can be boosted to a wicked solo tone?
I have no doubt that with all the bells and whistles a Bogner has, I could nail a ton of probably the best sounds I've ever heard. However, how does all that translate live? I do use different tones for different parts and more than 3 main tones is needed. I wouldn't have time in between songs to mess with a million knobs, no matter how great the tone is. That would be my only concern. I don't tapdance with footswitches and that isn't my intent, but some songs you want to be really clean, some you want to have a thick bluesy overdriven tone, some you want a light crunch for strumming, some modern rock distortion, some heavy distortion.
Gearjoneser, with the boost features... can you get the type of versatility I am looking for?
Chimey Fender cleans boosted to a bluesy overdrive, a light crunch that can be boosted to something like a Marshall plexi, and a high gain channel that can be boosted to a wicked solo tone?
I have no doubt that with all the bells and whistles a Bogner has, I could nail a ton of probably the best sounds I've ever heard. However, how does all that translate live? I do use different tones for different parts and more than 3 main tones is needed. I wouldn't have time in between songs to mess with a million knobs, no matter how great the tone is. That would be my only concern. I don't tapdance with footswitches and that isn't my intent, but some songs you want to be really clean, some you want to have a thick bluesy overdriven tone, some you want a light crunch for strumming, some modern rock distortion, some heavy distortion.
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Can't choose an amp for me.. Help!!!! ENGL or BOGNER or MARSHAL ??
In a live situation, you pretty much need to have your 3 channels set like you're favorite 3 amps. Then, if you need more than a few db boost, you'll have to resort to pedals. If the clean can be set from anything from punchy power section clean to a JMP Marshall, the blue ch. can be anything from a clean plexi to G. Lynch, and the red channel can be anything from Gibbons, Zakk, and Paul Gilbert, you've pretty much covered it all. The hard part, for me, is deciding if the blue channel should be a plexi or modded JCM 800 type tone. 4 channels would be ideal, but if you have a good OD, you can make the clean, edgy...the blue hotrodded, and the red channel into infinite liquid sustain. I'm sure you could do that on your Triamp. If you just set the channels where you like them, and get a killer OD, you should be able to cover everything. Your rig is perfectly capable of what you need,
just add an OD or two.
In a live situation, you pretty much need to have your 3 channels set like you're favorite 3 amps. Then, if you need more than a few db boost, you'll have to resort to pedals. If the clean can be set from anything from punchy power section clean to a JMP Marshall, the blue ch. can be anything from a clean plexi to G. Lynch, and the red channel can be anything from Gibbons, Zakk, and Paul Gilbert, you've pretty much covered it all. The hard part, for me, is deciding if the blue channel should be a plexi or modded JCM 800 type tone. 4 channels would be ideal, but if you have a good OD, you can make the clean, edgy...the blue hotrodded, and the red channel into infinite liquid sustain. I'm sure you could do that on your Triamp. If you just set the channels where you like them, and get a killer OD, you should be able to cover everything. Your rig is perfectly capable of what you need,
just add an OD or two.
