Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

[Lux84]

Any owners here? yesterday i received the last of the two kits... now i only had to buy some tubes, some head house, and the thing is ready to go to amp serviceman to build/put the whole head together for me. anyway, i noticed it has the 50w/25w switch, and fx loop send/return at the back. it kinda suprised me in a really good way... and numbers all goes to 11 i didn't open the whole pack yet, because it's packed somehow the right way, but it's Revised 23 Feb 2013 CERIATONE 2204. any experiences with that amps, and what to tell the serviceman if i want a bit more gain added, because i play a lot of heavy metal early stuff... anyway i am happy that i have already purchased all the parts in about 3 months, now that monster is just waiting to be put alltogether. which speakers should i use if i want more heavy oriented sounds from it ? in the bridge positions of my guitars i have already high output pickups like Seymour Duncan Distortion and Custom, and EMG 81. would that pickups ride the amp to more high gain stuff ? and i already have Bad Monkey OD pedal, Boss NS-2 and Hardwire SC-2 Distortion pedal. what do you think, would this go well together ? how about Strat, i have Alnico V singlecoils in it... i'd like to hear some opinions of the whole thing.. thanks.

 

[DankStar]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

was it cheaper to buy the parts then pay to have someone put it together versus buying one from ceriatone already assembled?

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Why not get the Ceriatone Chupacabra instead of having the tech modify the 2204 kit? If I had any gripe about the Ceriatones is that they tend to be bright and toppy. But if that blows your skirt up then your gold. It can also be fixed with some simple changes when your tech assembles the kit. Depending on your idea of "metal" it might leave a lot to be desired though. They have to be played LOUD to deliver the goods and even then likely will need a boost pedal upfront to get the saturation you want. If your gonna do stuff like have actual gain stages added I would want someone who has a good reputation doing that stuff and not some clown that learned from youtube vids and does guitar tech at the local music store on the weekends.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

I am on really low montlhy budget.. i know a few very good specialists for tube amps in my country. i am gonna do less treble mod, and more gain mod. but first i will discuss of that with spec. i don't play only heavy music, i also like the blues and classic rock and some progressive stuff too. and it has half power mode too. i will use that amp mostly in band situations, clubs etc. i also am interested in 2x12 cabinet, with some speaker combination. i have one Celestion Vintage 30, and one G12H30 anniversary speaker to do the 2x12 combintation. i only have no 2x12 cab, but i think i'll go with Orange or Framus.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

If you want the amp more versatile I probably wouldnt look so much into getting its gain increased as much as figuring out pedals to get your high gain tones out of it then. Its easy to mod the amp for more gain but when your playing live you dont want to be turning knobs on your amp from song to song. The way I used to run my Marshall JMP was with a Tube screamer a chandler tube driver and a TC electronics line driver. I would set the preamp on the amp at about 5.5 to 6. If you hit the strings hard it would break up just a touch or if you backed the volume knob down to 7 on the guitar it was spanky clean. I would use the TC electronics as a boost that would give me my mid gain tones. I would set the chandler for moderate drive with no volume boost and use it for my metal rhythms. (both pedals on at the same time for metal) Then the tube screamer was used as a volume boost for solos. Like that you can mix and match and layer as needed.

You can figure out a similar set up using your pedals. If I was you I would have the tech build the amp as is. Then after you hear the amp and get a feel for how it sounds then have him adjust it to suit you. Seems silly to mod something you havent heard. As far as speakers go the ones your thinking of would work fine. Enjoy

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Ok, i will follow your advice, and will not mod it till it's built it's way, and i will try it unmoded first. after all, i think it's gonna sound much better than some Blackstar or Peavey Valveking or Bugera amps, and i already have the kits, so i am gonna do the whole amp, and maybe modify it later, after trying it stock.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

So, i just can't wait till the amp is gonna be put all together.. i have a few more questions: how can be JCM 800 head all cranked up and boosted, compared to Peavey 6505 head, cranked up and not boosted at all? can JCM 800 get into 6505 hi gain territory that way ? and which speakers add the JCM 800 a better heavy metal definition, G12H30Anniversary, Heritage G12-65 or Vintage 30's ? i was thinking about 2x12 box with one Vintage 30 and G12H30 Ann. combination.. should that combo be alright, or should i try something different ? i can boost the amp with Digitech Bad Monkey OD, and Digitech Hardwire Distortion, those two pedals i already have ! i somehow want to try the G12-65 speakers, but only if i can get them, they seems to harder to get there in my country... but i already own G12H30Ann. and Vintage 30 speakers.. how much higher output pickups can add to gain ? those i already have in my guitars !

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

You can do thrash easily with a boosted JCM800. Early Anthrax (among the living era) was a JCM800 and the same TC electronics booster I use (thats where I got the idea for it and sought it out) Getting it to 6505 levels will take a bit more than a boost with a tube screamer in front of the boost it will do 6505 levels easily. Or using more gain on your bad monkey should do it (I run my tube screamer gain around 2 or 3 on the pedal so its quite low) Even 2 tube screamers 1 into the other is a cool tone.

As far as speakers go the G12h30's are great so are the V30's the H30's are more middy and round the V30's are sharper on the highs. I think the speakers you have now will work great though the G12-65 is a fabulous speaker I would try the ones you have then look for others if they dont work for you. Side note my favorites with the JCM800's are the old G12H 80 watt speakers.

Pickups will make a difference depending on what you have now they are an option but I dont tend to choose pickups according output (anymore there was a time though...) What I do is look for pickups that feed my amp the frequencies I want to hear and the cut off those I dont want. Pay attention to the midrange texture of a pup it can highly influence the way an amp distorts.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

You can do thrash easily with a boosted JCM800. Early Anthrax (among the living era) was a JCM800 and the same TC electronics booster I use (thats where I got the idea for it and sought it out) Getting it to 6505 levels will take a bit more than a boost with a tube screamer in front of the boost it will do 6505 levels easily. Or using more gain on your bad monkey should do it (I run my tube screamer gain around 2 or 3 on the pedal so its quite low) Even 2 tube screamers 1 into the other is a cool tone.

As far as speakers go the G12h30's are great so are the V30's the H30's are more middy and round the V30's are sharper on the highs. I think the speakers you have now will work great though the G12-65 is a fabulous speaker I would try the ones you have then look for others if they dont work for you. Side note my favorites with the JCM800's are the old G12H 80 watt speakers.

Pickups will make a difference depending on what you have now they are an option but I dont tend to choose pickups according output (anymore there was a time though...) What I do is look for pickups that feed my amp the frequencies I want to hear and the cut off those I dont want. Pay attention to the midrange texture of a pup it can highly influence the way an amp distorts.

 

[jpistolas]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

was it cheaper to buy the parts then pay to have someone put it together versus buying one from ceriatone already assembled?

My question exactly. These only make sense to me if you're an electronics DIY'er IMHO.

Unless you just DO NOT want a 100w wouldn't a 2203X have been a better option? See them for $1899 free shipping I believe @ Guitar Center & from this recent post, Sweetwater. https://forum.seymourduncan.com/sho...ound-experiences-input-welcome&highlight=2204

Driving a 50w to saturation is easier in my experiences though.

Wish you much luck with the kit!

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

My question exactly. These only make sense to me if you're an electronics DIY'er IMHO.

Unless you just DO NOT want a 100w wouldn't a 2203X have been a better option? See them for $1899 free shipping I believe @ Guitar Center & from this recent post, Sweetwater. https://forum.seymourduncan.com/sho...ound-experiences-input-welcome&highlight=2204

Driving a 50w to saturation is easier in my experiences though.

Wish you much luck with the kit!

He's not in the US so the prices arent relevant. You should see what people pay for gear here in Italy, Easily 30-40% more than the US market.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Hm, i like the way to boost like you people explained. but i am worried about noise feedback.. i'd like to know, if i boost the amp into 6505 territory, would it be the same issues with noise on JCM 800, or more, or less ? i have Boss NS-2 right now, but i tell you, i unlike to use it, because it eats sustain like a dog. i am using Blackstar HT-5 through 1x12 Vintage 30 cabinet, i have the gain control on 3 o clock for modern metal riffing, and for vintage heavy/thrash on 12 o clock. i really slightly boost it with Monkey sometimes at both levels. for modern metal with gain on 3 o clock and Monkey as slight boost, level full, treble 12 o clock, bass 12 o clock and gain off i must use ns-2, but for the heavy/thrash i mostly don't use it, it is slightly feedback and i just leave fingers on fingerboard, mute them and it's ok. but for modern metal higher gain i have to use ns-2 without a choice yes or no. ****, i must check my friend's 6505 one day.. to see what can do, and on which levels is to suit my choice if gain settings. then i will now better what to do with that JCM 800 for that type of tones, how much gain i actually need, because i won't limit myself just because the amp. but i don't play only metal, so i think that amp would probably be the keeper.

Ok, now to build Ceriatone JCM 800 2204, and see what kind of speakers i could get.. for 2x12.. than i will check the amp with all the pedals and stuff, and than compare the sound to 6506 too see which stage of gain i can get on JCM 800 for my own tastes.

Thanks for now, and any other suggestions would be useful too, if anyone got some experiences..

6506 is definately the choice too, but for now i must check the JCM 800 for metal, to see what will work for me. for more classic rock, bluesy stuff i believe that Ceriatone could be the winner !

The pickups i use are: SH6 Distortion, SH5 Custom and EMG 81 on my three guitars i own now.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

So, besides anything i wrote i forgot underline my doubt about noise issues, when you boost JCM 800 with pedals.. that's the main question. is it quiet, or it will need noise supressors, and how many, would be one ns-2 in front in the amp enough ?

Cheers, and i go to sleep now !

 

[jpistolas]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Aware of being outside the US but I had no idea how outrageous prices were non US. Wow...

Lux84: Just saw your noise question. I've used the NS-2 quite a bit over the years. More than likely you will have some noise problems boosting the amp this much. I never had the pleasure of owning an 800 but I did have a JCM 900. Wish I'd had the NS-2 back then. Great pedal.

Me personally, I would have it in the FX loop. In the loop it would be after the amp's preamp so it would not only help with the pedal noise through the input but any preamp noise as well. The FX buffer seems to also quiet any hiss from noise suppressors & gates too. Just try it there and in front of the amp. See which works better for you and your situation.

I used a NS-2 back when I ran my Mesa gain on 10 with lots of pedals. Put it at the end of the FX loop chain and solved my issues live quite well.

Really curious to see how this turns out. Been looking at the Silver Jubilee 2255 kit for sometime.

 

[vinta9e]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

The 2204 isn't a 5150. They are totally different amps for different players. The Peavey's one of the most shred-friendly amps on the planet with its fast note tracking and gobs of compression/saturation. The Marshall is slower and stiffer, thus much more demanding on the player. It's very open/dynamic and delivers a fat, growly crunch like no other. It loves being driven by hot pickups as well as boost and overdrive boxes. It loves being cranked, too.

When these amps get modded, it's usually in opposite directions: Marshalls for more gain & saturation, Peaveys for more dynamics. Some guitars might show strong preference for either amp in order to sound their best. Other than that, I think these two could make a killer duo.

 

[calibre2001]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Hi I think you should really consider a 4x12 cabinet. For marshal type amps I have found those to be a key ingredient for a good rock sound. A 1X12 cab, whilst ideal in size is too bright though a 2x12 is a better improvement.

There was a thread here of some dude who complaint how he could not get thrash sounds with a JCM 800.
Turned out to be the 1X12 cabinet that was the culprit.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Well, today i finnaly get the offer for those G12-65 Heritage speakers, new. so i can get those, but: i hear those new heritage speakers are not as good as the older original one G12-65, from about eightess, is that true? i think i'll get Marshall 4x12 Angled 1960 cabinet, besides i can get it for the same money as Orange 2x12. and than, maybe i'll go X pattern, two G12-75 which are already in mixed with two Vintage 30's, i already have one laying in my closet. or 2x12 combination of G12H-30 Anniversary and one Vintage 30. or two heritage G12-65 in 2x12, but that would be more expensive :scratchch for the band practice what you think would be better my 4x12 option or 2x12 option ? thanks for all suggestions there, i am a bit newbie to those things, but anyway, i have to try those things, to see what sounds the best for me. gotta find those sweet spotes on all off amplification i own. i already did on my Blackstar HT-5. now there is to find sweet spots on my Blackheart 15, and much later on that Ceriatone JCM 800 2204. and the thing to do as well is to try out friend's 6505 amp :scratchch

It's good to hear that higher output pickups are great for work with that amp, cause i have already three guitars fitted with high otputs pickups.

 

[Hank-]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Well, today i finnaly get the offer for those G12-65 Heritage speakers, new. so i can get those, but: i hear those new heritage speakers are not as good as the older original one G12-65, from about eightess, is that true?

Age could be a contributor, a speaker that has been used from 1980 to 2013 will sound mellower than one you get made new today. I wouldn't worry about it too much. But if you are considering the G12-65 then the WGS ET-65 is a nice cheaper clone of it made in USA, if you can get one in your country.

 

[Lux84]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Well, i didn't found the WGS dealers in my country.. but i can get Eminence speakers.. anybody who reccomend some Eminence combinations for JCM 800 ? maybe some good clone of G12 -65 ?

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Ceriatone JCM 800 2204 Head

Eminence P50E... Its not a clone of a G12-65 but its a damn fine speaker.