CITES changes in the works?

[Chris Pile]

https://www.npr.org/2019/08/27/7545...om-restrictions-on-heavily-trafficked-rosewoo

So, the travel ban may be lifted soon. What about the makers ban?

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

Saw this. Encouraging.

But the fires raging in the Amazon are REALLY terrifying, and not just from the issue of tonewoods.

Bill

 

[Mincer]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

One thing about the whole ban that was good was that it forced some makers to consider other woods- which isn't really a bad thing. Guitarists are stuck on just a handful of woods to use in building, mostly due to tradition.

 

[Chris Pile]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

But the fires raging in the Amazon are REALLY terrifying

A little research or even paying close attention to recent stories show pictures or videos of burning in scrubland or prairie, NOT a rain forest (I hate that term. When I think Amazon, I think a fricking JUNGLE). These fires are actually normal and numbers show they are at a low period historically.

If anyone actually READS THE ARTICLE, it explains that CITES regs came about because Chinese furniture makers were using up rosewood and other fine woods (exotics to us, domestics to them) like water. Musical instruments makers only use about 7 percent of the world's woods for instruments. The CITES stuff was a kneejerk reaction to a perceived problem by very dim bureaucrats who didn't grasp the real problem, and slapped something together quickly to get the screamers off their backs.

SO, to sum up. The planet's not on fire, and guitar makers are not the problem. In fact, guitar makers are the ones actually doing something about it (like Bob Taylor replanting ebony trees in Africa and Asia).

 

[nexion218]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

In fact, guitar makers are the ones actually doing something about it (like Bob Taylor replanting ebony trees in Africa and Asia).

I once saw a video interview with him where he explained that whole re-planting thing. His approach was quite fascinating I must say. If I recall well, he even has some exclusive trading rights on African ebony. I am not much of an environmentalist myself, but it was really a sad sight where he showed that up until recently complete trees knocked down were left to rot just because a lighter stripe was in the ebony. It was refreshing to hear when he said that woods used for making instruments are produced by nature and right now nature gives us striped ebony, so we should adapt our ways.

 

[Chris Pile]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

We can blame Martin for not using all those trees with stripes in them. They've been logging trees since World War I, and wanted only the blackest ebony. Only in the last 25 years or so did Martin finally start staining fingerboards jet black... Chris Martin should have done re-planting before Bob Taylor ever burst on the scene.

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

We can blame Martin for not using all those trees with stripes in them. They've been logging trees since World War I, and wanted only the blackest ebony. Only in the last 25 years or so did Martin finally start staining fingerboards jet black... Chris Martin should have done re-planting before Bob Taylor ever burst on the scene.

Be careful... otherwise people might get the idea that they can't just endlessly consume things without their being some consequence. God knows we can't have that.

I'll echo Mincer's statement about pushing the idea for alternative woods. Though the discerning player knows only the blackest ebony is worth playing on, some others might just figure out a way to make music with other materials. Who knows... their instruments might even sound AND look good in the process.

 

[GuitarStv]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

I don't get it. Couldn't they just stain the white stripe in the ebony black if that's a problem?

 

[Chris Pile]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

I don't get it. Couldn't they just stain the white stripe in the ebony black if that's a problem?

Yes. Most guitar makers I know (and guitar repairman) have a bottle of ebonizing stain made from vinegar and steel wool. And we use it for covering mineral stains in wood that we or a client want to look darker. It will even stain maple dark gray.

I should add that there are several kinds of ebony, most have gray or white streaks. There is even pink ebony, which is highly prized and seldom used on guitars.

Ebony became popular for fingerboards because of its hardness and smooth look when sanded. But dumb people thought that the color was the important feature. Harmony guitars used pearwood stained black way back before WWII. It worked fine, but as the fingers abraded the wood - it got light spots.

 

[Archer250]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

Interesting, but the guys I know will likely stick to Pau Ferro

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Tapatalk

 

[GuitarStv]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

Harmony guitars used pearwood stained black way back before WWII. It worked fine, but as the fingers abraded the wood - it got light spots.

They were definitely still doing the staining thing in the 60s. I've got a Stella H922 where the black stain has started to come out of the fretboard in the most played areas. Thought it was stained maple or something though.

 

[Chris Pile]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

Interesting, but the guys I know will likely stick to Pau Ferro

Fast becoming one of my favorites for fingerboards.

 

[Archer250]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

Fast becoming one of my favorites for fingerboards.

I know right?

The grain looks great and it sounds so snappy.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Tapatalk

 

[Chris Pile]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

I know right?
The grain looks great and it sounds so snappy.

Plus it's less expensive and works very well. Also, the sawdust doesn't make me sneeze like ebony dust will.

 

[JMP/HBE]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

I doubt there will be any drastic policy shift.

 

[PFDarkside]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

The finished goods for musical instruments portion was ridiculous. I get it though, as if only raw logs/lumber were controlled, they’d just find a way to build all the furniture where it’s harvested.

Plus it's less expensive and works very well. Also, the sawdust doesn't make me sneeze like ebony dust will.

I’ve heard exotic wood dust can be rather harmful to your lungs. (From my woodworker friend)

 

[JMP/HBE]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

The finished goods for musical instruments portion was ridiculous. I get it though, as if only raw logs/lumber were controlled, they’d just find a way to build all the furniture where it’s harvested.



I’ve heard exotic wood dust can be rather harmful to your lungs. (From my woodworker friend)

Black Limba dust can kill you.

 

[Mincer]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

Black Limba dust can kill you.

I know wenge and padouk can cause rashes.

 

[Jacew]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

I couldn't find a picture what white streaked ebony looks like, but it does sound actually better for looks than usual dull jet black ebony boards.

 

[nexion218]

Re: CITES changes in the works?

I couldn't find a picture what white streaked ebony looks like, but it does sound actually better for looks than usual dull jet black ebony boards.

I wouldn't call it white, but lighter/brownish. On one of my guitars I have an ebony board white a light stripe - hiding exactly under the A string. I actually kinda like it - the "imperfection" makes it looks less designed and more natural.