Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

[gilt.suspect]

I just received the 339 in the mail and the strings were old, rusty, loose and the nut was off. It had been sitting around the pawn shop for years I imagine. I got it all cleaned up, attached the Bigsby and Towner. Strung it up with .010's but come to find out; the fretboard is dead flat with the truss rod nut completely loose. The neck has no relief! I read about different measures to correct this but I'm wandering if I should just be patient and let the wood move back into the shape it was designed to be in once the proper string tension has some time on there. Should the neck recover in a week? A month? Several months?

 

[RorySquier]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

That's a good question I like to know. BTW...nice guitars.



;>)/

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Considering it most likely sat for some time, I would wait before doing anything drastic.

Just so I am clear, you are tuned to E and have zero relief or just very little?

 

[Silence Kid]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

I have an old Yamaha where the neck did a backflip; here's what NOT to do (even though it worked) : I clamped one end of the neck and was able to bend it manually; I found that it actually stuck, but it chipped major amounts of finish off the sides of the neck.

One day after some 'vigorous' playing outdoors on a hot day after being hauled around for hours in an even hotter car, the fretboard popped off. I did manage to clamp the fretboard back and repair the previous finish damage to un-recognizability and I play that cheap-ass guitar to this day.

What you should really do is take it to a luthier and get it professionally clamped/heated. I had a local luthier do this on a Strat where the neck was over-bowed and wouldn't flatten with the truss rod, and it's held up for a couple years at least.

 

[gilt.suspect]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Zero relief tuned to A 440. I tightened the strings up a bit sharp last night just to see what happens.

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

If the neck is just dead flat, string tension should bring it back (assuming it sat untuned). You can always string it up with some 12s for a few weeks.

You luckily have one of the best guitar shops around right there in Nashville. Joe Glaser can certainly correct it if the strings don't.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

I try to set my necks dead straight. I don’t like much relief. But you can try clamping the neck in an upbow for a while with the truss rod slacked and see if it fixes it.

I have dual action rods in the guitars I build to avoid this issue.


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[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Here’s the basic idea.

https://youtu.be/ZtKzL3n0fgc


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[ItsaBass]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Before you even think about doing anything: How does the guitar play? Can you set it up satisfactorily?

Don't go freaking out because it doesn't meet some ideal technical specification, if the fact that this spec is not met does not negatively affect the guitar in real world use.

Are you tuned to E standard?

Also, what measurement method did you use to determine that it has zero relief?

If you determine, after setting it up the best you can with the current strings, that you actually do need more relief, then put a set of 11's on it. If you are truly at zero relief with 10's, and you want relief, then the 11's should move it into the range of adjustability.

You could also try taking the strings off and running your palm across the bottom of the neck while pushing upward hard toward the fretboard, as your other palm presses the opposite direction, but in a fixed position a little higher up the board. This could tweak loose a truss rod that has become stuck to its interior channel, and at least get it stuck in a more favorable orientation.

 

[eclecticsynergy]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

I agree with Ayrton - give it some time at pitch and you may find it corrects itself.

 

[Adieu]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

View attachment 93484I just received the 339 in the mail and the strings were old, rusty, loose and the nut was off. It had been sitting around the pawn shop for years I imagine. I got it all cleaned up, attached the Bigsby and Towner. Strung it up with .010's but come to find out; the fretboard is dead flat with the truss rod nut completely loose. The neck has no relief! I read about different measures to correct this but I'm wandering if I should just be patient and let the wood move back into the shape it was designed to be in once the proper string tension has some time on there. Should the neck recover in a week? A month? Several months?

Neck recovers in seconds, time won't do anything unless its structural integrity is junk-grade

Put on 11s or higher tension 10's (DRs). Or raise the action if it buzzes. If not...then what do you need relief for?

 

[Silence Kid]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

A neck with no relief will likely require higher action overall. That said if you are not trying for the maximum lowest possible action and always just set it at 3mm or something then it probably doesn't matter. That is- if you were happy with it until you figured out there was no relief, you probably don't need to stress over it.

 

[DonP]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Dan Erlewine covers this in a book with a 70's LP Custom. He gave it an assist with clamping. Carefully.

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Neck recovers in seconds, time won't do anything unless its structural integrity is junk-grade

More topics in which you know nothing. Exactly how many necks have you corrected?

 

[Adieu]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

More topics in which you know nothing. Exactly how many necks have you corrected?

Dozens. None unsuccessfully, btw.

Truss rod and string tension are near-instant reactions.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Any time you need to do drastic changes in neck relief you need to first clamp the neck. Then tighten the rod (unless it’s already slack)

Don’t rely on the truss rod. It’s purpose is to keep the neck where you set it. But if you try to use the truss rod to make big moves you can cause damage. I’ve seen rods snap and fretboards become unglued.

Also it sometimes takes a few days for the beck to settle in. As Dan said in the video, a neck that has been pulled too much the wrong way sets that way. You have to coax it back.

You see this a lot when a neck needed adjustment but never got it, and the owner just left the action a mile high. Or in the other extreme a neck that sat for extended periods of time with no strings, and with tension on the rod.


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[Adieu]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Any time you need to do drastic changes in neck relief you need to first clamp the neck. Then tighten the rod (unless it’s already slack)

Don’t rely on the truss rod. It’s purpose is to keep the neck where you set it. But if you try to use the truss rod to make big moves you can cause damage. I’ve seen rods snap and fretboards become unglued.

Also it sometimes takes a few days for the beck to settle in. As Dan said in the video, a neck that has been pulled too much the wrong way sets that way. You have to coax it back.

You see this a lot when a neck needed adjustment but never got it, and the owner just left the action a mile high. Or in the other extreme a neck that sat for extended periods of time with no strings, and with tension on the rod.


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OP's got the opposite problem.

And couldnt possibly make a drastic adjustment at all, since 1) his truss rod isn't actually doing much of anything at the moment, 2) he wants to introduce the most MINISCULE bit of relief

 

[RorySquier]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

I remember a guy on another forum recommending taking the neck off the guitar and lying it down at an angle and then stand on it to correct warpage. I thought that is a little risky because the neck might break depending on how heavy you are.



;>)/

 

[Adieu]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

I remember a guy on another forum recommending taking the neck off the guitar and lying it down at an angle and then stand on it to correct warpage. I thought that is a little risky because the neck might break depending on how heavy you are.



;>)/

1) looks like a set neck
2) that "advice" is just trolling... a piece of wood will either hold you or break, to bend it by standing it you'd have to stand there till hell freezes over. And that's before taking the truss rod issue into account

 

[Silence Kid]

Re: Creating Upbow on a Backbowed Neck

Again - I found it possible to manually manipulate the 'stuck' neck to where it had the proper amount of relief. That said I probably overdid it, since I cracked the finish and lost some of the integrity of the glue. Heating/clamping seem to me a very feasible way of repairing such a neck in some cases. Standing on a neck is probably overdoing it too.