Custom 5 and tube amps...!

R

Rhodokanakis

New member
First post here it, let's cut it to the chase:

Being the Heavy Metal - more 80s than modern stuff mind you - guitarist I am, I thought I would change the stock pickup of my Epiphone explorer to an Invader. Playing through a Randall RG, I was impressed by the bottom end and the overall aggressiveness of said pick up. High gain settings were delivering a crushing sound, and I was even able to achieve a somewhat vintage distortion - think early NWOBHM. When I upgraded to a Laney IRT 60 tube head, I found the Invader lacking... I liked the natural tube gain I could get just by cranking the volume, but when I was actually adding gain the result was very "dry" and dull. So I equipped my Epiphone SG with a '59 - Custom 5 set, and I was blown away...! Though less powerful than the Invader, the Custom 5 was amazing at high gain settings, producing HUGE chords with nice articulation, fuzzy lows and punching mids. I don't get the amount of gain I get from the Invader of course, palm muting is less powerful and pinched harmonics almost impossible, but I really love this new sound.

Question is: Is any of that making sense to the more experienced of you? Does it seem logical that a pickup like the Custom 5 would work better with a tube amp for producing old school metal distortion? If that is so and there is something there, is there any similar pickup you would expect to work even better? I'm thinking Custom Custom maybe, but I don't know... Maybe I should shut up and just keep my current set-up since I like it that much, but I couldn't resist asking...!

Thanks in advance for the input!!

Cheers!
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

Welcome to the forum! At the end of the day I really think it's a personal preference. Your ears like what you're hearing which is awesome because it inspires you to play! For other guys the Invader is their cup o' tea but you've found your workhorse with the C5. The C5 is an awesome pickup so it's no surprise to me that you like it.

I don't venture into the higher output pickups anymore myself. I have experience with the Custom Custom in a Strat but I eventually switched to a JB in that guitar. For the most part I play on lower output pickups like the Jazz, the Alnico II Pro and the Whole Lotta Humbucker set. There are plenty of guys around here who may be able to answer your question though!
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

I am not sure if this would be exactly your ideal, but a Duncan Distortion would possibly be a good choice for you. I say that because it has a big bottom end, is aggressive, and it will excel at your pinch harmonics. A Black Winter is another potential option, but with your love of the invader's low end, I suspect it might not have the lows you desire. It is a more modern, tighter pickup than the duncan distortion.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

different amps like it when pushed with different frequencies... its as simple as that.

Try boosting the front of the amp with like a graphic eq at different frequencies and you will see what i mean.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

Welcome to the forum!! it does make sense, even tho you think it wouldnt. You have to factor in a few things.. First, I higher gain pickup may push the front of the amp harder, but may not give you as pleasing of a tone. The C5 may be filling in some tonal areas where your guitar and or rig may be lacking, giving you a perceived bigger sound. Tonal curve can make alot more difference than just power rating.. Plus, by using a lower output pickup you are getting more of the tonality from the amp. Now, Id maybe try raising the pickup a tiny bit, cuz if you've got the technique, you shouldnt have any issues getting pinch harmonics. If you really like what you are hearing, leave it be.. Ive been in the trap before of if this sounds good, then this must be better... its an endless battle... I recently swapped out my custom 8 for a duncan distortion in my charvel cuz I was hoping for a more aggressive/better tone.. Im going back to the c8 as soon as I get time to fool with it. The CC will give you a more midranged focused tone and its often referred to as "buttery" here. I dont think it will give you what you are seeking. IF you MUST experiment, one of the beauties of the Custom series pickups is that you can swap the magnets to get the other versions. The CC is the same as the C5, but with an alnico 2 mag. If you still feel you need alittle more aggression, try the Custom. Its the C5 but with a ceramic magnet. My fav is a Custom 8 which uses an alnico 8 mag. Output wise, it will be the same as you are getting now, but youll have alittle less low end and highs, more mid range but no where near the mid focus of a CC.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

BloodRose said:
Custom 8 which uses an alnico 8 mag. Output wise, it will be the same as you are getting now, but youll have alittle less low end and highs, more mid range but no where near the mid focus of a CC.
Click to expand...


C8 and C5 are the same output? I think something may have been adjusted wonky... a C8 should be noticeably louder
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

I may not have worded properly. (at work and rushing ) As far as the C8/c5 you arent changing windings and such, Like going from a 59 to a custom.. same pickup. If you can term it better, be my guest..

And as far as amp, a mega drive pickup pushes/drives the amp harder and IMO can tend to color the sound a bit more. with a vintage or lower output pup, you can crank the amp more for more of the amps natural drive. still getting most of the tone from the amp, unlike juicing it with a pedal. again rushing... feel free to correct or restate.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

Quite honestly, even though I'm not huge on either, both the Invader and Custom 5 are great pickups, and both work great with both solid state and tube amps. Some amps respond better than others to different pickups, true, but I don't think it's a matter of tube vs. solid-state, personally. If you like the Custom 5, I don't see what's wrong with that. :)
 
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Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

BloodRose said:
I may not have worded properly. (at work and rushing ) As far as the C8/c5 you arent changing windings and such, Like going from a 59 to a custom.. same pickup. If you can term it better, be my guest..

And as far as amp, a mega drive pickup pushes/drives the amp harder and IMO can tend to color the sound a bit more. with a vintage or lower output pup, you can crank the amp more for more of the amps natural drive. still getting most of the tone from the amp, unlike juicing it with a pedal. again rushing... feel free to correct or restate.
Click to expand...

The '59 and Custom aren't the same pickup winding with a different magnet. They're different windings with different magnets.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

Myaccount876 said:
The '59 and Custom aren't the same pickup winding with a different magnet. They're different windings with different magnets.
Click to expand...

He's saying the C5 and C8 are the same pickup winding (just different magnets) and the difference is not like going from the C5 to the '59, two pickups that we know have different windings.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

For whatever reason 14.4K is an ideal wind for a hot pickup. It's right where it should be for all magnets, and if you go hotter with that wire, the bottom starts to mush out and the highs lose clarity.

For that reason, the Duncan Custom series as well as Gibson's 498T are 14.4K. It's no surprise that a guitarist into classic rock/metal would like that pickup, especially with mahogany and EL-34's to dictate it's midrange character. I've used C5's in a lot of guitars, and it's still one of the pickups that Marshalls and Bogners like most.

Last time I tried an Invader, I thought it sounded like a fist to the face and that's about it. I tore it out of my guitar pretty quickly and returned it.
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

BloodRose said:
I may not have worded properly. (at work and rushing ) As far as the C8/c5 you arent changing windings and such, Like going from a 59 to a custom.. same pickup. If you can term it better, be my guest..
Click to expand...

Yeah you arent changing the winding but changing the magnet definitely changes the output.

You can say "its the same coils" or its "the same wind" but for sure the mag has a big influence on the output.



BloodRose said:
And as far as amp, a mega drive pickup pushes/drives the amp harder and IMO can tend to color the sound a bit more. with a vintage or lower output pup, you can crank the amp more for more of the amps natural drive. still getting most of the tone from the amp, unlike juicing it with a pedal. again rushing... feel free to correct or restate.
Click to expand...


I get what you are saying here thats why I asked you to clarify it...
 
Re: Custom 5 and tube amps...!

As mentioned by others, tone is a very personal thing and one has to find out what works and responds best personally. If people never pushed the envelope.expereiment outside the box then we would all be playing ancient lutes or something ;) Enjoy your setup, sounds like it is working out awesome for you!
 
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