Duncan JBG vs modern JB

[CarlosG]

I have the opportunity to buy a Duncan JBG. In what years were they produced? Is it worth more than a modern JB? Does it sound better than a modern JB?

 

[Artie]

The "G" just means it was wound by Gloria Ocompo. It's still a regular JB.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I don't think they're worth much more, but people put a premium on anything vintage these days, so it wouldn't surprise me if the seller wants a premium. But it's a JB. Tonally, it's probably close to a currently made Antiquity JB, depending on how it's aged. It was wound by Gloria Ocampo, so not as sought after as a JBJ (wound my Maricela Juárez), but still probably pretty good.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I found this comparison of a few vintage JB's. Sadly no JBG, but what I found interesting is the one that I liked the least was the famous JBJ, LOL.

 

[beaubrummels]

If it's old enough to have a roughcast mag and butyrate bobbins, the difference IME is it will clean up with the volume control and it has more frequency range across the sound, something like a Custom, it has a little more high end treble to it (not the high-mid spike people always complain about) and some bottom end to work with. Also my old one sounds a bit clearer than my modern production one; string separation with chords, etc. My modern production JB just sounds like all mids, dark on top and no bottom end girth to it, and it doesn't clean up with the volume control.

 

[hamerfan]

I found this comparison of a few vintage JB's. Sadly no JBG, but what I found interesting is the one that I liked the least was the famous JBJ, LOL.

Thanx for posting this comparism. The JBJ seems to have less bass and more mids, which helps to stand out better in a mix. The Factory JB is a bit muffled like the tone pot on 8.

 

[Artie]

I'm confused. Isn't a JBJ a "factory" JB?

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I'm confused. Isn't a JBJ a "factory" JB?

No, yeah, it was when they had those labels. They don't have those labels anymore, so if you want a JB wound by MJ today, it's certainly going to have to be Custom Shop.

I think the video just calls "factory" JB regular production JB from the 2010's without any label stating who wound it.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Thanx for posting this comparism. The JBJ seems to have less bass and more mids, which helps to stand out better in a mix. The Factory JB is a bit muffled like the tone pot on 8.

I feel like the JBJ in the video almost sounded like someone swapped the magnet in it to A3. It feels kinda thin and less saturated (lower output?) than the others. Sounds a bit off to me, but that's just for my taste, personally. It's certainly the one that sounds the most different.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

If it's old enough to have a roughcast mag and butyrate bobbins,

I'm not sure about the RC magnet, but I'm pretty sure if it was old enough to have butyrate bobbins, the baseplate would be different (long legs, no logo?). I think?

 

[Masta' C]

The JBG pictured in the first post is an early '90s model. Nothing particularly special about it...standard polycarbonate bobbins, polished mag, etc.

Even a majority of so-called "JBJ" models tend to fall into this category (i.e. nothing special) and I'm a huge fan of MJ.

Personally, I wouldn't pay more for it over a newer JB unless I was restoring a guitar from that era and wanted to stick with era-specific parts.

 

[Masta' C]

I'm not sure about the RC magnet, but I'm pretty sure if it was old enough to have butyrate bobbins, the baseplate would be different (long legs, no logo?). I think?

For the most part, you are correct. I'd have to go back to my records and look at some of the pickups I've sold, but I seem to recall some transitional ones from around 1983 (the first year with the "big logo" baseplates) that still used butyrate bobbins.

Roughcast magnets became increasingly rare during that time, as well. In fact, most early "JBJ" pickups from the '83-'85 period had polished mags and pretty much everything after '86 or so was polished for certain.

 

[CarlosG]

I found this comparison of a few vintage JB's. Sadly no JBG, but what I found interesting is the one that I liked the least was the famous JBJ, LOL.

JB-J sound like damaged.
All of them (excluding the possibly damaged JBJ) sound better than the factory JB.
Factory JB sounds like it's in a fog.
The JB and Antiquity sound the best, has open sound.
JBM and JBL are between.
I wonder if JBG will sound like Factory JB or JBL/JBM.
Am I right in understanding that The JB is the oldest? Am I right in understanding that The JB and Antiquity have Roughcast A5? Maybe simply changing to roughcast 5 will bring me closest to that sound with the Factory JB, or maybe better with the JBG?

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I wonder if JBG will sound like Factory JB or JBL/JBM.
Am I right in understanding that The JB is the oldest? Am I right in understanding that The JB and Antiquity have Roughcast A5? Maybe simply changing to roughcast 5 will bring me closest to that sound with the Factory JB, or maybe better with the JBG?

Probably closer to JBL/JBM. But then again, every pickup sounds slightly different, so you're kinda taking a gamble. That's kinda part of the Fishman Fluence blurb that traditionally made wound pickups are kind of all over the place when it comes to consistency. That being said, all of them sounded like JB's in that clip to me with the exception of the JBJ which, like you said, sounded like ther's something wrong with.

I don't know if swapping the magnet to RC in a plain standard JB will get you 100% of the way there, but I would think it ought to bring you closer. Are you unhappy with the way your stock JB sounds? Because swapping the magnet is not hard nor expensive and is easily reversible.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

Personally, I don't think the current production JB sounds any worse. It's not like people are Seymour Duncan are like "yeah, we're purposely gonna make the JB sound worse and worse as time goes on". The JB still sounds like a JB to me.

I didn't think it sounded darker either. I just thought it had more low mids and the high mids weren't as prominent by comparison.

 

[STLMTLHD79]

Yea, i watched that video a few times over the past few weeks and that JBJ does not sound healthy.

Your JBG is somewhat unique that it was in that change over time period in the early-mid 90s when they were still using the stamped sticker on the baseplate however, yours has short legs. This transition didnt seem to run for that long, maybe a couple years. Let us know how it sounds.

 

[Masta' C]

I found this comparison of a few vintage JB's. Sadly no JBG, but what I found interesting is the one that I liked the least was the famous JBJ, LOL.

I wouldn't put too much weight into comparison videos like this. The reality is that most JB's sound like JB's if they are working properly and installed correctly. There are plenty of things that can account for small differences you might hear in a recording like that.

If I had to guess why the "JBJ" in particular seems to be lacking a bit of oomph and low end in that sample, it probably comes down to height adjustment. Raising the bass side of the pickup a turn or two closer to the strings would likely have it sounding just like the others. That, or the magnet was degaussed a bit.

Side Note: The JBJ in that clip actually sounds a lot like the Thrash Factor, which is interesting since marketing hype would have us believe that Dave Mustaine's own "JBJ" pickup from ~1986 was somehow made a bit tighter and brighter than other standard production JB's at that time. Hmm...

 

[Artie]

I wouldn't put too much weight into comparison videos like this. The reality is that most JB's sound like JB's if they are working properly and installed correctly. There are plenty of things that can account for small differences you might hear in a recording like that.

If I had to guess why the "JBJ" in particular seems to be lacking a bit of oomph and low end in that sample, it probably comes down to height adjustment. Raising the bass side of the pickup a turn or two closer to the strings would likely have it sounding just like the others. That, or the magnet was degaussed a bit.

Side Note: The JBJ in that clip actually sounds a lot like the Thrash Factor, which is interesting since marketing hype would have us believe that Dave Mustaine's own "JBJ" pickup from ~1986 was somehow made a bit tighter and brighter than other standard production JB's at that time. Hmm...

You bring up a couple more interesting points: Those clips are just the guitar. In a band mix, where you don't want the guitars' low end to compete with the bass, the JBJ might be the ticket.

And the Mustaine actives are supposedly voiced after the JB/Jazz. I wonder how those, and the new "rails" versions, fit into the mix. (So to speak.)

 

[Rex_Rocker]

I wouldn't put too much weight into comparison videos like this. The reality is that most JB's sound like JB's if they are working properly and installed correctly. There are plenty of things that can account for small differences you might hear in a recording like that.

If I had to guess why the "JBJ" in particular seems to be lacking a bit of oomph and low end in that sample, it probably comes down to height adjustment. Raising the bass side of the pickup a turn or two closer to the strings would likely have it sounding just like the others. That, or the magnet was degaussed a bit.

Side Note: The JBJ in that clip actually sounds a lot like the Thrash Factor, which is interesting since marketing hype would have us believe that Dave Mustaine's own "JBJ" pickup from ~1986 was somehow made a bit tighter and brighter than other standard production JB's at that time. Hmm...

Yeah, I don't think the video is made to imply that all JBJ's sound like that. Or all JBM's. Or all JBL's. Personally, what I gather from that video is that vintage JB's do have a sound that the Antiquity JB closely resembles. But that the production JB still very much sounds like a JB, and all JB's sound like JB's just with small variations that make sense within that 10% tolerance that we know Duncans have. Then again, that "Factory JB" is 15 years old now too, LOL.

I'm pretty sure that if the dude that made a video decided to throw a Custom in there for fun, all of the JB's we hear there would sound so much closer to each other.

 

[Rex_Rocker]

You bring up a couple more interesting points: Those clips are just the guitar. In a band mix, where you don't want the guitars' low end to compete with the bass, the JBJ might be the ticket.

That is a fair (and safe) approach, but I don't think any of the tones were extremely or unusably bass heavy or would have any problem working in a mix. This is personal taste. Everyone likes different amounts of bass in their recorded tones, but there is a limit where it's still tasteful and it doesn't sound like And Justice for All, LOL. None of the tones from any of the pickups were nearing that, I feel.