Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

[Aceman]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

I do listen acoustically to them, including putting my ear against the back of the neck.

A guitar that sounds good acoustically, will sound good plugged in, IMO.

A guitar that does not sound good - may or may not work out plugged in.

Just my opinion. But, for example, if the thing has little sustain, or a really muddy/muffled tone out of the gate, rarely does that go away plugged in. If you can hear and feel the sustain unplugged, likely a winner plugged in.

Pickup tone excepted. Epiphone a great example. And of course, does anything really sound that different with an X2N, say…

 

[DreX]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

Most, but not all, guitars that are acoustically loud are poor performers when amplified and some guitars that sound fat and sweet acoustically can sound amplified thin and edgy.

If this were true, Gretsches would not exist, the first would have been the last. ES-335's would have their chambers filled with cement, the f-holes finished over.

But more generally, when someone says "sounds good acoustically", what is "good" in this context? What does anyone expect an unplugged electric guitar to sound like, ideally?

 

[El Supremo]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

I just put my ear to the body, play some chords, harmonics, etc. If it doesn't project those acoustic qualities I like plugged in afterwards, I'll quest for the pickups that will deliver what I want to hear. Any remaining issues I usually solve with minor adjustments to setup.

 

[GuitarStv]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

But more generally, when someone says "sounds good acoustically", what is "good" in this context? What does anyone expect an unplugged electric guitar to sound like, ideally?

This is my question.


My electric guitars sound like electric guitars when played acoustically. Even my Epi Dot sounds like an electric (although it's a bit louder than my solidbodies). None of them sound remotely as good as a bargain basement acoustic . . . until they're plugged in.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

I don't play my electric guitars unplugged, so I don't care how they sound un-amplified.

+1. There's so many elements in the signal path, all of which alter the EQ to some degree. What you hear with an electric unplugged, is shaped in many different ways once it's amplified. The components of a PU, especially windings and magnets, emphasize and reduce various tonal qualities of the wood. You can't assume that any given PU will match up with a wood (all of which are unique), and not overdose on some frequencies, or both be lacking in others. It's too sweeping of a statement to say acoustic tone equates to electrical tone. There's a lot more going on.

There's been a number of posts here where members have said that guitars of theirs that sound the same unplugged, sound radically different thru an amp. Also members have said that some of their best-sounding electrics unplugged have been difficult to get to sound good amplified and have taken a variety of PU's to find one that matches well with that wood (I've had this happen with a guitar myself).

PU's don't just 'add to what's already there', they also change it. Sometimes that's good, sometimes it isn't. It's also important to have the right PU/magnet combination for a guitar, and that's going to vary with the wood's individual characteristics.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

If this were true, Gretsches would not exist, the first would have been the last. ES-335's would have their chambers filled with cement, the f-holes finished over.

But more generally, when someone says "sounds good acoustically", what is "good" in this context? What does anyone expect an unplugged electric guitar to sound like, ideally?

To me it's a just a pleasant sound. Not thin, twangy, mosquito tone. Even my Tele's produce a sound that's clear and has some depth and some resonance to it when I play them unplugged. They're not very loud of course. But that's fine for just sitting around the house practicing or writing songs.

Also, that statement you quoted was Bill's...not mine.

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

Sound ?

I'm not a scientist or a physicist. My brain cell only knows music.

And even that's not relevant ... the guitars I like resonate when i play them and i feel it where the guitar rests against my body, and in my fingers on the fretboard and even when holding one of the machine head buttons whilst tuning.

And the more a guitar makes me feel all those tingly sensations (that in some cases can feel like a pleasant version of having a few tens of volts running into me), the better the guitar is when i plug it in to an amplifier.

For me, it's not about the acoustic sound, but the resonance. If it lets me feel it live, it is a real good one.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

How about this claim of Bill's:

"Make a simple test -- take two identical low E strings, put one of them on an acoustic guitar and the other one on a Tele and tune both strings to a low E. When you play both strings with the same force, you will see that the string on the Tele has a much greater amplitude than the string on the acoustic guitar. As a result, an identical pickup would not only generate a much higher voltage but also a different harmonic spectrum on the Tele, resulting in a totally different tone"

It's true. And seems to have been Les Paul's thinking.

 

[trevorus]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

How about this claim of Bill's:

"Make a simple test -- take two identical low E strings, put one of them on an acoustic guitar and the other one on a Tele and tune both strings to a low E. When you play both strings with the same force, you will see that the string on the Tele has a much greater amplitude than the string on the acoustic guitar. As a result, an identical pickup would not only generate a much higher voltage but also a different harmonic spectrum on the Tele, resulting in a totally different tone"

It's true. And seems to have been Les Paul's thinking.

Well, duh. The energy from the string on the acoustic is going into the top, and being converted into sound energy. This is much less the case on a telecaster. The voltage produced is dependent on the pickup, magnet strength, proximity, etc. In all honesty, it negates the claim that acoustic sound can't be an indicator of amplified sound. It's an indicator, not an exact correlation anyway.

Sent from my chromed robot turd, using the miserable junk code known as crapatalk.

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

Must come down to personal taste to some degree.

What do you want to hear?

To me, especially at very low, very clean volumes, Les Pauls sound flat and plinky. Ever play one in a quiet bar or some situation where you just can't turn it up?

Not much fun.

The strings might be driving the heck out of the pickups because they're not driving the guitar to any kind of acoustic volume, but the sound is a plinky sounding drag.

In those situations I'd much rather play my ES-335.

The strings might be wasting some energy making the guitar vibrate, but I get a much more usable sound from a resonant guitar when I have no alternative other than to keep the volume way, way down.

A Les Paul is designed to not resonate and it's a drag to play clean at quiet volumes.

Especially for a guy like me who uses very few pedals.

 

[DreX]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

To me it's a just a pleasant sound. Not thin, twangy, mosquito tone. Even my Tele's produce a sound that's clear and has some depth and some resonance to it when I play them unplugged. They're not very loud of course. But that's fine for just sitting around the house practicing or writing songs.

Also, that statement you quoted was Bill's...not mine.

Sorry that was a quoting mistake.

By your definition I'd think any ES-335 would sound better than any fully solid body, and any full hollow better still, but plugged in that translates into a progressively more "dry" tone, which is good for what it is. I imagine the same holds true for differences smaller degrees too. I have a hard time believing anything ever truly sounds bad.

 

[trevorus]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

I'm reminded of Penn Jilette talking about Strad violins, and how they're not the perfect violin. We could make a physically perfect violin, but it may sound terrible. A Strad is just our definition of a perfect violin.

Same goes for guitars. We can quantify everything and make the perfect guitar, but that doesn't mean that you would like it.

Sent from my chromed robot turd, using the miserable junk code known as crapatalk.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

To frankly and basically put it. Nobody is going to be listening to my solid electric guitar's acoustic sound on stage, in my room, when recording, whatever. It is an electric guitar, if it sounds good when plugged in then it sounds good. What it sounds like or behaves like unplugged is rather irrelevant. Judging an electric guitar based off the sound when not plugged in is like judging a sports car by it's acceleration while it's in neutral to me. Maybe I'm missing something?

 

[DreX]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

Judging an electric guitar based off the sound when not plugged in is like judging a sports car by it's acceleration while it's in neutral to me. Maybe I'm missing something?

I don't think so. This statement right here pretty much distills the absurdity to it's essence: "There is a way to check out the tone of a[n electric] guitar by its acoustic sound."

 

[STRATDELUXER97]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

One thing I think I do hear...Is that my older guitars that I've had for ions...seem to age and sound better to me? Is it that I'm a better player,or is this possibly something that is real and I do hear?

Maybe both?

 

[blueman335]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

One thing I think I do hear...Is that my older guitars that I've had for ions...seem to age and sound better to me? Is it that I'm a better player,or is this possibly something that is real and I do hear?

It's real. Wood changes with age.

 

[DreX]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

IMO it's entirely because the wood continues to dry out. I don't believe it's necessary for the guitar to be played either, but it would probably have to be out of it's case, meaning it's likely going to be played anyway.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

I don't think so. This statement right here pretty much distills the absurdity to it's essence: "There is a way to check out the tone of a[n electric] guitar by its acoustic sound."

Yeah. I'm not saying wood doesn't matter or anything at all, those variables are critical. I'm just saying, why do you care what it sounds like when it's not plugged in if you're going to be using it plugged in 99% of the time? Sure if it sounds good acoustically it probably sounds good plugged in providing the electronics are all functioning right, but you'll never use it professionally without an amp or something. If you wanna hear how good it sounds quit goofing around and plug it in.

 

[DreX]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

Well we know that different pickups sound better in different guitars, like a bright pickup in a mellow guitar makes for a pleasant and balanced tone, or vice versa, and the end result is often unpredictable because ears aren't pickups, so listening to any one thing in isolation doesn't serve any real purpose.

 

[Edgecrusher]

Re: Electric guitars need to sound good acoustically to sound good plugged in...

It's real. Wood changes with age.

So do your ears