Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

[CTN]

Given my recent fascination with SGs, it dawned on me that although I can't rationalize the expenditure involved in buying a Gibson, I wouldn't mind buying an Epiphone for knocking around and for getting used to the gib-style of construction.

I'm thinking of getting a G400, the vintage or faded brown model. Most probably I'll end up replacing pickups and all electronics. I also want to perhaps replace the big heavy Grover tuners with some Kluson-style tuners, seeing as I've read lots of reviews that all the G400s are all really neck-heavy.

Also I fully plan to shop around at all the music stores in and around toronto if I have to, to find a hidden gem - a really nice, resonant one that plays nicely and sounds beautiful.

Good idea? are the Epi's any good in terms of construction quality?

 

[youngthrasher9]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

It's extremely hit and miss. I've played ones that you couldn't pay me to own, and I've played ones that compete with PRS SEs (that says a lot if you've played one with a decent set up). I say go for it and find one to mod to no end.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

+1

There are crackers and crappers. You need to search out the good examples.

The neck heavy issue with SGs is easily explained. The earliest examples came fitted with a dirty great big Maestro Vibrola. By the most amazing coincidence, the weight of this lump is exactly the right amount to balance the instrument on a strap.

YT has left a strong hint in his post. A safer place in which to invest your funds would be a PRS SE. The early Santana SE, Standard or Soapbar II are the closest to your brief.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

I have a few G-400's and love them. Nothing quite like an SG. Upgraded the PU's and they sound great. I leave it at that, and don't change the electronics and tuners (I like rotomatics). Mine are very good quality, maybe I'm just lucky. As typical with Gibsons and Epi's, neck thickness varies. In the last few years Epiphone has been putting D-shaped necks on some models, including SG's like the 1961 Special with P-90's. For me, that neck doesn't feel right: wide but thin. I like a thicker, fuller neck, which fills my (large) hand and also adds depth to the tone, which is what my G-400's have.

As someone who has owned many Epi's over the years, I prefer the current production Chinese ones. With their own factory, Epi's been able to continually tighten up the quality and consistency, which was quite variable in Korea, as it was contracted out. The new G-400's are the Pro model with push-pulls for coil cut and very good PU's. No one was more surpised than me to see Epi's come stock with clear, articulate HB's (after years of muddy, blurry ones). I've played both the new Alnico Classic Pros and Probuckers, and they don't need to be upgraded. I'm shocked and very pleased. It's a tough world economy and there's a lot of hungry competitors, and Epi keeps stepping up their game and turns out some nice guitars at competitive prices. Much better now than the 1990's Koreans I've played. By all means, look at G-400's.

 

[Kramer Guy]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

My wife bought me a G-400 over 4 years ago for my birthday, which was chinese made and it was one of the best guitars I ever played. I ended up selling it though due to financial issues a year ago, which I now regret. I didn't change a damm thing on it. The stock pups on it were just fine and the Grovers kept it in perfect tune. IMO, it was just as good as any USA made Gibson.

 

[Mr. B]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

I'm thinking of getting a G400, the vintage or faded brown model. Most probably I'll end up replacing pickups and all electronics.

I would go for the regular G-400 Standard. They seem to be better made than the faded and vintage. I would also try to find one from several years ago. The new ones with thinner necks are a BIG step down in quality from what they were 5 years ago. I've never had a problem with the tuners or the electronics in mine. I have a Gibson 498t in the bridge and a 59 in the neck and it sounds great.

They are a bit hit and miss. I've had 3. One was crap, one was ok and the one I still have is great. Play before buying if you can.

 

[Mr. B]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

I'm thinking of getting a G400, the vintage or faded brown model. Most probably I'll end up replacing pickups and all electronics.

I would go for the regular G-400 Standard. They seem to be better made than the faded and vintage. I would also try to find one from several years ago. The new ones with thinner necks are a BIG step down in quality from what they were 5 years ago. I've never had a problem with the tuners or the electronics in mine. I have a Gibson 498t in the bridge and a 59 in the neck and it sounds great.

They are a bit hit and miss. I've had 3. One was crap, one was ok and the one I still have is great. Play before buying if you can.

 

[Myaccount876]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

Why is it that you don't want to deal with Gibson? Not blaming you, just wondering what your concerns are, because at the moment Gibson and their SGs are venturing into the Epiphone price range.

 

[CTN]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

I have a few G-400's and love them. Nothing quite like an SG. Upgraded the PU's and they sound great. I leave it at that, and don't change the electronics and tuners (I like rotomatics). Mine are very good quality, maybe I'm just lucky. As typical with Gibsons and Epi's, neck thickness varies. In the last few years Epiphone has been putting D-shaped necks on some models, including SG's like the 1961 Special with P-90's. For me, that neck doesn't feel right: wide but thin. I like a thicker, fuller neck, which fills my (large) hand and also adds depth to the tone, which is what my G-400's have.

As someone who has owned many Epi's over the years, I prefer the current production Chinese ones. With their own factory, Epi's been able to continually tighten up the quality and consistency, which was quite variable in Korea, as it was contracted out. The new G-400's are the Pro model with push-pulls for coil cut and very good PU's. No one was more surpised than me to see Epi's come stock with clear, articulate HB's (after years of muddy, blurry ones). I've played both the new Alnico Classic Pros and Probuckers, and they don't need to be upgraded. I'm shocked and very pleased. It's a tough world economy and there's a lot of hungry competitors, and Epi keeps stepping up their game and turns out some nice guitars at competitive prices. Much better now than the 1990's Koreans I've played. By all means, look at G-400's.

I would go for the regular G-400 Standard. They seem to be better made than the faded and vintage. I would also try to find one from several years ago. The new ones with thinner necks are a BIG step down in quality from what they were 5 years ago. I've never had a problem with the tuners or the electronics in mine. I have a Gibson 498t in the bridge and a 59 in the neck and it sounds great.

They are a bit hit and miss. I've had 3. One was crap, one was ok and the one I still have is great. Play before buying if you can.

See now I'm confused...My conclusion from both these perspectives leads me to believe that Korea vs China doesn't even matter, and that finding that hidden gem is of paramount importance, regardless of country of manufacture. Is this correct?!

Why is it that you don't want to deal with Gibson? Not blaming you, just wondering what your concerns are, because at the moment Gibson and their SGs are venturing into the Epiphone price range.

I said I didn't want to get into it...it'd derail this thread. Also, I simply can't afford a Gibson at the moment. Yeah they're close to some of the higher end Epis, but I haven't got a lot of money to throw to GAS. Sales tax where I live is 13% on top of everything that isn't an unprocessed food. Makes buying any high-dollar item quite painful.

 

[d1dsj]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

I've had a couple of Epi's, a '65 RI with vibrola and a '62 RI?? white 3 pup custom. Neither were bad by any means but the '65 was the best and with a C5 bridge/ '57 classic n sounded fantastic. The only reason I don't have it any more is because I had a close mate who was down on his luck so I gave it to him. He loves it to bits and I still get to play it from time to time!! I believe that both of mine were Korean made but as others have said there have been a lot of QC improvements in recent years and some of the guitars you can buy these days for not a lot of cash is incredible, just try as many as you can.

 

[Myaccount876]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

See now I'm confused...My conclusion from both these perspectives leads me to believe that Korea vs China doesn't even matter, and that finding that hidden gem is of paramount importance, regardless of country of manufacture. Is this correct?!

I said I didn't want to get into it...it'd derail this thread. Also, I simply can't afford a Gibson at the moment. Yeah they're close to some of the higher end Epis, but I haven't got a lot of money to throw to GAS. Sales tax where I live is 13% on top of everything that isn't an unprocessed food. Makes buying any high-dollar item quite painful.

Got it. Yeah there can be gems, just like any other company. It also depends on how willing the buyer is to make it an excellent guitar. Some just need a little work, some need a lot. All of them IME have a lot of potential to be great guitars if they aren't already. Here is a list of all the types of Epiphone SGs (excluding the Custom and the Tony Iommi model): http://www.guitarcenter.com/Epiphone,Solid-Body-Electric-Electric-Guitar.gc?src=G&ipp=100

...Some of them look really good actually...I want that goth one...

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

The current G-400 Pros go for $350 new and have much-improved PU's and push-pulls for coil cut. They come in the both the big batwing pickguard and the small angelwing one. Not sure of the current neck profiles; my G-400's are all from a few years back and have necks that are nice and full. There are good Chinese and Koreans. To me the difference is that the Chinese are more consistent, Koreans vary a lot. Also, current production Chinese have good PU's as of the last year or two; prior to that neither the Chinese or Koreans did. If I was buying a new G-400, I'd get one of the recent-production Chinese, and I wouldn't have to upgrade PU's or add push-pulls. For $350 you get a nice new guitar. You can find used ones in very good condition for $200 to $250.

 

[tubecrunch]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

My buddy put a bigsby on his Epi sg just to balance the neck. He blocked it to keep in tune so it became just an anchor. Worked perfectly.

 

[the guy who invented fire]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

By the time you drive around town and play every Epi SG you can find then put new pickups, pots, switch, wire, caps, tuners etc not to mention let's be honest...it'll need at least a slight set up, maybe some mild fret work (most Epi's do) you could have bought a nice used US made SG.

I say...why bother??

 

[CTN]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

By the time you drive around town and play every Epi SG you can find then put new pickups, pots, switch, wire, caps, tuners etc not to mention let's be honest...it'll need at least a slight set up, maybe some mild fret work (most Epi's do) you could have bought a nice used US made SG.

I say...why bother??

I already have pretty much all the electronics parts. Just need pickups and tuners really, also I am fully capable of doing my own setups.

Why bother? Because at the end of the day I will have spent a lot less than a Gibson would cost.

Also, you guys south of the border don't even realize how lucky you are. Everything is much more expensive here, and that goes double for musical instruments. I almost never see great deals on gear on CL/kijiji or for used stuff in stores. All our prices are like 10-30% higher than US prices, and then tack on another 13% sales tax if it's new.

Also, it would be kinda foolish to get a gibson and do a string of mods to it.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

are the Epi's any good in terms of construction quality?

they work fine and they are good bang for buck. You can improve the pickups and bridge and saddles, tuning heads get a fret dress and setup, but it still wont resonate they way a serious guitar would.
You just cant fake good quality wood. There is a big difference between "good for the money" and just plain "good". Save your bucks, play many instruments and when you are ready, get the instrument that really sings.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

By the time you drive around town and play every Epi SG you can find then put new pickups, pots, switch, wire, caps, tuners etc not to mention let's be honest...it'll need at least a slight set up, maybe some mild fret work (most Epi's do) you could have bought a nice used US made SG.

Maybe if he plans to hit music stores all across Canada. There's been no stortage of complaints here about lower-end Gibson SG's; he'd have to do some looking for a good one of those too.

 

[CTN]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

Thanks for the advice guys.

Gonna do some shopping around today if the weather lets up, or tomorrow, or the next day... etc etc...

 

[blueman335]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

Thanks for the advice guys.

Gonna do some shopping around today if the weather lets up, or tomorrow, or the next day... etc etc...

Yeah, good old Canada. You may be snowed in until spring.

 

[CTN]

Re: Epiphone advice needed (SGs)

I was in montreal when the record breaking snow storm hit on the 27th. I spent pretty much all day shovelling. Woke up, shoveled snow, ate brunch, dried clothes, shoveled snow, drank hot chocolate, dried clothes, took a break and ate some dinner, and then shoveled snow. The next morning, I shoveled some more snow.