Epiphone vs Gibson

Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

sosomething said:
Everyone wants to be right.

Those with more to spend want to justify the expense of their purchases so as to not appear foolish with their money.

Those with less to spend want to defend the value of their purchases so as not to appear foolish with their money.

We're all right and we're all wrong.

It's all relative, anyway.
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You'd think the nail would be sore from soso constantly hitting it on the head like this. It really is that simple, I think. We all want to justify our own choices and avoid that nasty… (say it with me…) cognitive dissonance.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

Jessie's ghost said:
You'd think the nail would be sore from soso constantly hitting it on the head like this. It really is that simple, I think. We all want to justify our own choices and avoid that nasty… (say it with me…) cognitive dissonance.
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That avatar of yours gets even hotter when she's agreeing with me. :D
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

oilpit said:
The expensive guitar argument is a not so clever deflection from the actual argument at best
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I'm aware that many guys, maybe most, with high end guitars are great players. All I try to do is provide a balance from the numerous posts here over the years that pressure guys into getting much more expensive guitars than they planned on, and have called anything less than that 'crap.' Let the guy get what he wants, and he shouldn't feel ashamed, whatever his choice. He's paying the bills at his house, he can spend what he wants. If he doesn't end up getting the high end model, he's not a leper. Whatever he does or doesn't spend; of far more importance is what he does with it. The big accomplishments are making music, the real goal, not our acquisitions. We get caught up in gear, which is to be expected in a forum like this, but it's only a first step. I just try to remind guys of priorities, at the other end of the process, and maybe I don't do that in the best way.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

Blue, I hear ya. And I agree.

As long as people are happy with their purchases it doesn't really matter. And it certainly doesn't matter to me. These arguments get dull over time.

But, when someone starts a "what should I get" thread, I feel compelled to impart my experience to them as a basis for their decisions. My experience has been that I owned many "less expensive" guitars and ultimately decided to purge and get 3 or 4 "higher end" guitars since I can only play one at a time anyway.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

blueman335 said:
I'm aware that many guys, maybe most, with high end guitars are great players. All I try to do is provide a balance from the numerous posts here over the years that pressure guys into getting much more expensive guitars than they planned on, and have called anything less than that 'crap.' Let the guy get what he wants, and he shouldn't feel ashamed, whatever his choice. He's paying the bills at his house, he can spend what he wants. If he doesn't end up getting the high end model, he's not a leper. Whatever he does or doesn't spend; of far more importance is what he does with it. The big accomplishments are making music, the real goal, not our acquisitions. We get caught up in gear, which is to be expected in a forum like this, but it's only a first step. I just try to remind guys of priorities, at the other end of the process, and maybe I don't do that in the best way.
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Kudos for this, because it's clear that you're willing to both understand the other side of the argument and admit that you may have been too rigid in your own.

Not that I have any vested interest in what you think or feel - only that my respect for someone grows any time I see them willing to admit they might have gone about something the wrong way (whether I think they did or not). Ya feel me?

And I agree with you, too.

It's been stated over and over, but I don't think there's any correlation to how much you spend and how well you play.

The only time I might advise someone to "save their money for something better," would be in cases where the gear they have their eyes on is unsuitable for their stated needs. Like "which Rok Pak guitar and amp combo should I buy as my main live rig with my metal band?" I think you can see the reasoning there. It's a PSA, not a judgement thing.

That road runs both ways, too... If someone says "Which 100-watt tube amp and 4x12 should I buy for bedroom recording?" or "What options should I get on the PRS Private Stock I'm having built for my 12-year-old?" I might advise them to go a cheaper, smaller route...

ya know? It's all common sense, cost/return, etc.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

blueman335 said:
I'm aware that many guys, maybe most, with high end guitars are great players. All I try to do is provide a balance from the numerous posts here over the years that pressure guys into getting much more expensive guitars than they planned on, and have called anything less than that 'crap.' Let the guy get what he wants, and he shouldn't feel ashamed, whatever his choice. He's paying the bills at his house, he can spend what he wants. If he doesn't end up getting the high end model, he's not a leper. Whatever he does or doesn't spend; of far more importance is what he does with it. The big accomplishments are making music, the real goal, not our acquisitions. We get caught up in gear, which is to be expected in a forum like this, but it's only a first step. I just try to remind guys of priorities, at the other end of the process, and maybe I don't do that in the best way.
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I hear ya, and would even venture to say I agree...I just think that the pendulum may have swung a bit too far.

I see very few people advocating for Gibsons saying anything bad about Epiphones, more saying that those looking to invest in a new guitar should think about saving up a few more bucks to get a Gibson because they feel that they are better instruments.

However I do see a lot of Epi guys calling Gibsons out on quality control, saying they are overpriced like it is gospel truth, saying that Epiphones sound as good and in some cases better than Gibsons. It just seems to me that to some extent the persecuted have become the persecutors, and that I don't like.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

sosomething said:
only that my respect for someone grows any time I see them willing to admit they might have gone about something the wrong way (whether I think they did or not). Ya feel me?

And I agree with you, too.
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I may go too far in one direction sometimes, in my attempt to balance some threads. If I come across as saying only mediocre players buy high-end guitars (in an attempt to compensate for a lack of skill,) then I haven't worded my point as well as I should have. I just want guys to feel good about what they bought. It may not excite all of us, but if it puts a sparkle in their eye, what's the point of ruining their day? They're happy, maybe they're a better player than we are, so let's encourage them. Not like any of us have all the answers and have sold millions of albums.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

oilpit said:
However I do see a lot of Epi guys calling Gibsons out on quality control, saying they are overpriced like it is gospel truth, saying that Epiphones sound as good and in some cases better than Gibsons. It just seems to me that to some extent the persecuted have become the persecutors, and that I don't like.
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As much as I like Epi's, I know they're not as good as Gibsons (not counting some of the worst examples of the faded series). Obviously you're getting better materials and workmanship. The question is how much is the additional quality is worth, and that's something each of us has to answer for ourselves. A Gibson that costs 5 times what the comparable Epi model does, isn't 5 times better; that's where the arguments start. Maybe that Gibson is two or three times better, maybe only 50% better, and again, it's a personal matter on whether that's the route you want to go.

I know a good Gibson will outclass my upgraded Epi's, but I can live with that, and try to make up for it with my playing. At gigs and jams some guys have looked down their noses at my Epi's, but by the end of the night, they're cool with me. I just want guys to know they can do the same thing, and still earn the respect of other players. If a mid-price import is all they can afford, or all they want to spend on a guitar, that's a viable option. Be proud and confident when you walk on stage, whatever your guitar is. People applaud for what you do with your fingers. Buy what you want, and not to please someone else.

Do Fender guys have the same problem, like Gibson/Epi? There's about 1,000 models each of Strats and Tele's, and who can keep track of where they're made and what they cost? They all say Fender on the headstock.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

The sanity being bandied about in this thread, 6 pages in, is alarming.

I'm worried I may be on the wrong forum.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

sosomething said:
The sanity being bandied about in this thread, 6 pages in, is alarming.

I'm worried I may be on the wrong forum.
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We're just a bunch of musicians sitting around talking, and putting the rhetoric aside, we can actually be reasonable. We ought to do it more often. :friday:
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

I'm not sure what this page 6 love fest is all about, but I assume some feathers were ruffled and I'm too lazy to go back and read what the fighting was about....

Anyway....

I have three Les Pauls; an Epi, a Gibson, and a Custom Shop. I still play the Epi because it's a good guitar. I would be lying if I were to say that the Epi was as good as a Gibson, but that doesn't mean it's crap.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

blueman335 said:
We're just a bunch of musicians sitting around talking, and putting the rhetoric aside, we can actually be reasonable. We ought to do it more often. :friday:
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It really does go to show that we live in the Golden Age of Gear. The fact that you can have lively debates about the merits of $500 guitars v. top shelf stuff demonstrates how good budget stuff has gotten, at least to older guys like me who grew up in the age where the choice was crap v. awesome. For $700 you can grab a classic vibe tele and a blues junior and have a workable small club rig. In fact, we even have the luxury to demand good necks and decent fretwork on budget guitars. And I do remember when those features were only available on top of the line stuff. And those were the things, to a large extent, that made us lust after LP's and the like.

So when someone like me says too hastily "its as good as a (blank)" I'm still thinking in terms of those characteristics of all guitars now (well, at least most) that were unobtainable in modestly priced ones in the early '80's. We're still so amazed that a cheap guitar can be in tune, that we don't even think about the more subtle differences like the effect of finishes on tone, etc.

This may be a topic for another thread, but I really feel the revolution started with the Japanese Squier line in the 80's. Those were the first guitars where people started saying they were as good as the higher end Fenders. And again, by "as good as" we were talking about things which are taken more or less for granted now in mass produced CNC'd guitars, like low action, necks that stayed on, etc. Great Gear days to live in, these.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

You guys can lay all this modern consistency on Hartley Peavey's doorstep. He's the father of CNC guitar part making.
 
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Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

Andrew Lamprecht said:
Peavey puts out some solid stuff... in fact better then most other amps in their price ranges IMO.
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Yeah, their stuff is built well, for what it is. I'm still occasionally gassing for a T-60 guitar, and a T-40 bass. Those things(T-40) are HEAVY but you can drive nails with one, and it'll still be in tune for a show. Solid tones, too.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

voggin said:
It really does go to show that we live in the Golden Age of Gear. The fact that you can have lively debates about the merits of $500 guitars v. top shelf stuff demonstrates how good budget stuff has gotten, at least to older guys like me who grew up in the age where the choice was crap v. awesome...Great Gear days to live in, these.
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+1. Absolutely! When I was growing up, imports were crap. And there's still some stigma that lingers from those days. Imports now are vastly superior to what they were a few decades ago. You can get affordable, and good quality guitars, amps, and all kinds of home recording equipment. And no end of intructional DVD's, tab, online lessons, and YouTube. Great time to be a musician.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

guitfiddle said:
Yeah, their stuff is built well, for what it is. I'm still occasionally gassing for a T-60 guitar, and a T-40 bass. Those things(T-40) are HEAVY but you can drive nails with one, and it'll still be in tune for a show. Solid tones, too.
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My brother bought a Peavey Patriot from 1977 for $100 about a year ago. It smokes most guitars that cost less than $600 new now.
 
Re: Epiphone vs Gibson

+1 on Peavey love. I have an old G Ninety, and its by far my easiest playing guitar. It has the best neck too. Is this thread starting to go in a different direction?
 
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