Expensive Pickups that should song great but don't

Seth's are my favorite Duncan HB's for various reasons (including the generosity of Seymour with Seth Lover and his family) but to me, they're less P.A.F. clones than a unique model, where a vintage design meets that always musical "Duncan voicing" that we all love here.

The old Vintage Guitar Shoot-Out about P.A.F. replicas did include spot on comments about that, IMHO. Here it is:

www.vintageguitar.com

VG PAF Shoot-Out 2005

Given the unwavering popularity of the humbucker pickup, the constant injection of new builders, and the popuarlity of our 1998 comparison feature, we thought we’d note the anniversary of the…
www.vintageguitar.com www.vintageguitar.com
 
freefrog said:
Seth's are my favorite Duncan HB's for various reasons (including the generosity of Seymour with Seth Lover and his family) but to me, they're less P.A.F. clones than a unique model, where a vintage design meets that always musical "Duncan voicing" that we all love here.

The old Vintage Guitar Shoot-Out about P.A.F. replicas did include spot on comments about that, IMHO. Here it is:

www.vintageguitar.com

VG PAF Shoot-Out 2005

Given the unwavering popularity of the humbucker pickup, the constant injection of new builders, and the popuarlity of our 1998 comparison feature, we thought we’d note the anniversary of the…
www.vintageguitar.com www.vintageguitar.com
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Interesting article, I don't remember reading that before.
 
I find it very interesting on that review of PAF models that they call some of them "medium output".

The other day I was discussing output levels with a friend. I told him I considered the JB "medium-high output", and he told me I'm an output junkie, that the JB is clearly high output. My argument, though, is that all of the rest of the Duncan roster that they classify as "high output" on the site is higher output, in my experience. Even the Custom which they classify as "medium output" is higher output than the JB, in my experience. But I guess I'm used to "high output" pickups being more along the lines of the Distortion or Black Winter.

I suppose context is everything.
 
I don't worry about terms like 'medium' or 'high' as everyone has different definitions and those terms are hardly scientific. Show me the numbers.
 
Mincer said:
I don't worry about terms like 'medium' or 'high' as everyone has different definitions and those terms are hardly scientific. Show me the numbers.
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No, yeah. I think the terms are very ambiguous... and not really that relevant, to be completely honest.

Then again, even the numbers can be disputed, I feel. Duncan came up with that experiment, and I find some of those numbers don't agree with my experience at all. I think many people feel like that too.
 
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Mincer said:
I don't worry about terms like 'medium' or 'high' as everyone has different definitions and those terms are hardly scientific. Show me the numbers.
Click to expand...
Where can output numbers be found? Never seen them and not sure how they could consistently be measured.
 
justFred said:
Where can output numbers be found? Never seen them and not sure how they could consistently be measured.
Click to expand...
Mincer

Thread 'Seymour Duncan Pickup Output Experiment'

Several years ago, experiments were done to get mV output values from many pickups available at that time. I don't know if this list will help anyone, as the output numbers never stay constant, but it might be interesting if you are comparing one pickup next to another. Since it was originally posted on this forum by an SD employee, it is at least somewhat official.
The only time tests were done were about 5-6 years ago. I found this list from the thread I remember. I don't know how scientific this was but I think they really worked hard to provide consistent picking. At least it gives...
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Rio Grandes are expensive and I never really got anything special from them. The Muy Grande Tele bridge pickup was decent, but not all that, IMHO.
 
I don't think I've played any expensive pickups that were bad exactly . . . but definitely found a few that were bad for the guitar I put 'em in.
 
T-tops and Tim Shaw Gibson humbuckers. Expensive now, but i guess not so much when they were new. Cant stand either one. I dont mind vintage output pickups for certain applications, but 59's, Seths, AP1's, or even Antiquities all sound better to me.
 
Mincer said:
I agree that the Seths/Deluxe combo is glorious. No pedals needed.
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no pedals. guitar->21' cord->'66 dr, volume on 6. if only every gig could be that way :D

i think duncans paf type pups are very good. the neck version is usually more true to a paf than the bridge most of the time, but that typically suits modern players better. if you want a more true vintage paf experience, get two neck pups.
 
freefrog said:
IME, such pickups need a vintage context to shine: vintage braided shielded wiring in the guitar, vintage long and/or coily cables from instrument to first host
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BTW, @freefrog, since you told me months ago, in another thread, about adding a cap in parallel to the output to shift the pickup peak resonance, simulating a coil cable, I actually started using coil cables only for the first segment, from guitar to the first pedal, and now I can't stop using them, the sound of ALL my single coils equipped guitars improved , telecasters above all, so thank you very much
 
marcello252 said:
BTW, @freefrog, since you told me months ago, in another thread, about adding a cap in parallel to the output to shift the pickup peak resonance, simulating a coil cable, I actually started using coil cables only for the first segment, from guitar to the first pedal, and now I can't stop using them, the sound of ALL my single coils equipped guitars improved , telecasters above all, so thank you very much
Click to expand...
Glad you like it.

Enjoy!
 
justFred said:
What cap value? Assume it’s placed across output .
Click to expand...
Cap value depends on the effect wanted. Count 40 or 45 pF per foot of cable to emulate. Has to be wired between hot and ground of the guitar or of pickups themselves.

Albeit I had found it by myself when I was young, it's an old recipe. It was allusively evoked in Duncan FAQ decades ago - or by Bill Lawrence on his site. See the 3d paragraph from the bottom there: https://www.wildepickups.com/pages/instrument-cable-and-sound

...and on some "Silver Sky" pickups, PRS mounted a cap parallel to a resistor from hot to ground of each single coil (the resistor mimicing a slightly lowered tone pot for a fatter sound, less nasal)...

There's a video named "the G.O.A.T mod" on YT, showing a concret example of this principle that I apply for ages to "tune" some guitars.
 
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