Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

[leevc5]

I have had the Fluence pickups installed in my Les Paul for a little over a week now and been playing them two to three hours a day along with my other guitars for comparison.
I will start with my conclusion then go through the process of arriving at it in reverse order. The Fluence Humbucker, although good pickups with the flexibility of a V1 and V2 push pull voice selection, my current opinion is that they do not sound as good as traditional coil Humbucker. They do not have the tonal shape, fullness, depth and presence.
The final test I did was an A/B test using my Les Paul. I recorded ~45 minutes of Fluence then swapped them out with my Seth Lovers and recorded ~45 minutes with them. I then listened closely switching back and forth between the two recordings comparing the pickups in various chord and solos modes.
The rest of the comparisons consisted of playing various guitars through a couple of amps and listening to them through headphones:
1. Les Paul – Fluence Modern Humbuckers
2. ES-335 – SD 59s
3. Strat - Fender Custom Shop Texas Specials
4. HSH Strat – Kent Armstrong custom bridge, Fender noiseless middle, SD SH-2n Neck, wired for 7 sounds
5. Tele – Fender Custom Shop twisted pair, 4 wired switch series/parallel
6. Fender Champ 12
7. Marshal AVT50
8. Vox Headphone amp
Again I was not listening for the sound alone, as that of course would be different, but was concentrating on how the sound was articulated: tonal shape; fullness; depth and presence. What I found was that the Fleunce Modern Humbucker came out better than the single coils but I liked the other humbuckers better.
These are just my opinions and I am certainly no expert so I definitely recommend that you try the Fishman Fluence pickups yourself they are absolutely worth every penny. I am keeping my Moderns to install in an SG project that I expect to start shortly.
So, as the subject suggests this concludes my posts regarding Fishman products. If you do not understand the basis of my evaluation ignore it and move on as I don’t intend to go into long explanations, you either get it or not.
---------------------------------------------------Fini-------------------------------------------------------

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

All opinions are equally valid - or invalid.

You prefer SD Seth Lover model humbuckers. That is all that matters. Enjoy.

 

[frankfalbo]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Did you try the Classics yet? The Moderns are definitely more linear sounding, and the Classics are in the realm of the HB's you're comparing to. They are blades like an EMG or Blackout, which react differently to the string vibrations.

 

[leevc5]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Did you try the Classics yet? The Moderns are definitely more linear sounding, and the Classics are in the realm of the HB's you're comparing to. They are blades like an EMG or Blackout, which react differently to the string vibrations.

No, I haven't tried the classics. Not sure I want to make the investment, I'm pretty happy with the Seths.

 

[darthphineas]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

I can totally get that opinion.

While checking out the Classic Humbucker set and the Modern Humbucker set, I found the Modern set to be much more in my wheelhouse for someone that's into contemporary hard rock... I made my bones with the 80s riff-rock scene after all. lol! I've dabbled into a few of the more 'vintage' and 'classic' voiced humbuckers are part of what I do on my site/FB (like my Page comparison from last year)... and while I definitely understand the appeal to many players, I don't have a consistent use for the character of the 50s/60s range of pickups. V2 on both of the Classic Humbucker set would be my starting point in my day-to-day practical applications, for example.

It sounds like our tastes might be transposed when it comes to the offerings in the Fluence line. Or who knows, when that Devin Townsend set shows up on the doorstep, it could totally become my fave Fluence set...we'll have to see.

 

[Leon Of Late]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

I'm interested in trying a set of those this year, but I will certainly be trying the Classics. I need to settle on which of my current guitars are keepers and which to let go. I bought several of the same style to pick out the best of the bunch. I want another LP, I think a Traditional Pro so I can get one without weight relief holes, and a light one at that.

Anyhow, I'm looking forward to trying these. It would be slick if there were a test drive program or something, but I've dropped $350 or more on far lesser items. These just sound so damn cool, at least to me.

 

[allstarrme]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

If your looking to unload them hit us up.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

It's funny someone ordering the "modern" version of the Fluences, to later say he doesn't like'em because he prefers "vintage" style p'ups. :werd:

 

[darthphineas]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

If your looking to unload them hit us up.

I have a Classic set I can move. Shoot me a PM if interested

 

[leevc5]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

It's funny someone ordering the "modern" version of the Fluences, to later say he doesn't like'em because he prefers "vintage" style p'ups. :werd:

It's funny Fishman describes there Modern as:
"Voice 1:

Modern Active
The ideal active alnico sound. Full, round, and boosted, but with unprecedented articulation and dynamics.


Voice 2:

Crisp, clean and fluid
The clean, crisp neck humbucker tone you’ve always wanted, without the thin, plinky sound you don’t."

Sounds a lot like what someone might expect out of a Seth or a Sh-4 or Sh-2n. Don't ya think.

 

[frankfalbo]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

You are right, leevc5 based on the descriptions alone, a lot of the language crosses over. There's only so many ways you can say "bass/mid/treble/output" in the short description sections.

What's missing is the context. The Modern Alnico and Ceramic are called "Alnico" and "Ceramic" instead of Neck and Bridge models because of 35+ years of EMG selling the 85 and 81 as interchangeable between neck and bridge. The 85 is more often used as a neck pickup and the 81 more often bridge, but plenty of people flip them around or use the same model for both positions.

The phrase "modern Alnico/Ceramic sound" is a bit of a coded reference to the people who currently like EMG's or Blackouts. Kind of like British is a reference to Marshall, American, Tweed, Blackface are references to Fender or American high gain to Boogie or Soldano. Those players used to EMG's are used to the smoothness of blade poles, and a more linear response dynamically. The Fluence Moderns excel at that, while the Classics have that more traditional interaction with the strings.

 

[leevc5]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

You are right, leevc5 based on the descriptions alone, a lot of the language crosses over. There's only so many ways you can say "bass/mid/treble/output" in the short description sections.

What's missing is the context. The Modern Alnico and Ceramic are called "Alnico" and "Ceramic" instead of Neck and Bridge models because of 35+ years of EMG selling the 85 and 81 as interchangeable between neck and bridge. The 85 is more often used as a neck pickup and the 81 more often bridge, but plenty of people flip them around or use the same model for both positions.

The phrase "modern Alnico/Ceramic sound" is a bit of a coded reference to the people who currently like EMG's or Blackouts. Kind of like British is a reference to Marshall, American, Tweed, Blackface are references to Fender or American high gain to Boogie or Soldano. Those players used to EMG's are used to the smoothness of blade poles, and a more linear response dynamically. The Fluence Moderns excel at that, while the Classics have that more traditional interaction with the strings.

The Fishman description is not misleading. The Modern Alnico pickup does have those characteristics. However, as you point out terminology gets extremely difficult when trying to describe the subtleties of a pickups tone particularly when there are so many preconceptions and conflicting descriptions used within the industry.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Am I the only person who tries the Tilt switch?

To my ears, it makes all the difference in the world.

 

[darthphineas]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Am I the only person who tries the Tilt switch?

To my ears, it makes all the difference in the world.

I saw you mention it in the other thread. can you elaborate further?

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Not yet.

 

[leevc5]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern/classic Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern/classic Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

I have had the Fluence pickups installed in my Les Paul for a little over a week now and been playing them two to three hours a day along with my other guitars for comparison.
I will start with my conclusion then go through the process of arriving at it in reverse order. The Fluence Humbucker, although good pickups with the flexibility of a V1 and V2 push pull voice selection, my current opinion is that they do not sound as good as traditional coil Humbucker. They do not have the tonal shape, fullness, depth and presence.
The final test I did was an A/B test using my Les Paul. I recorded ~45 minutes of Fluence then swapped them out with my Seth Lovers and recorded ~45 minutes with them. I then listened closely switching back and forth between the two recordings comparing the pickups in various chord and solos modes.
The rest of the comparisons consisted of playing various guitars through a couple of amps and listening to them through headphones:
1. Les Paul – Fluence Modern Humbuckers
2. ES-335 – SD 59s
3. Strat - Fender Custom Shop Texas Specials
4. HSH Strat – Kent Armstrong custom bridge, Fender noiseless middle, SD SH-2n Neck, wired for 7 sounds
5. Tele – Fender Custom Shop twisted pair, 4 wired switch series/parallel
6. Fender Champ 12
7. Marshal AVT50
8. Vox Headphone amp
Again I was not listening for the sound alone, as that of course would be different, but was concentrating on how the sound was articulated: tonal shape; fullness; depth and presence. What I found was that the Fleunce Modern Humbucker came out better than the single coils but I liked the other humbuckers better.
These are just my opinions and I am certainly no expert so I definitely recommend that you try the Fishman Fluence pickups yourself they are absolutely worth every penny. I am keeping my Moderns to install in an SG project that I expect to start shortly.
So, as the subject suggests this concludes my posts regarding Fishman products. If you do not understand the basis of my evaluation ignore it and move on as I don’t intend to go into long explanations, you either get it or not.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I threatened to get back in a week and so I am, but unfortunately with the job incomplete.

Since this is all very subjective let me start off with some brief definitions of what I am looking for in an ideal pickup set for my Les Paul:
First note the definitions I mentioned in the original post regarding sound articulation, tonal shape...;
The Bridge should have a bright sound with undertones of tight bass and clean mids;
The Neck should be mellow with more focused mids and treble and a nice tight underlying bass more prominent then the bridge;
When the two come together in the middle position I expect to hear a full rich expression of everything the guitar is capable of producing.
Both pickups should envelop you with their sound not be in your face but be a presence that engages you. This is difficult to explain I guess you either get it or let it go.
And so I have been playing two or three hours a day through the various equipment previously listed except with the addition of a 5F1 amp which is like a home built tweed Champ.
First of the Fluence Classics have blown the SH-2n, the Kent Armstrong hand wound custom bridge and the two Gibson pickups that came with my Les Paul out of the playing field...they just couldn't make the cut.
Now we get down to where I am right now - STUCK!
I can't make a choice between the 59s, the Seth Lovers and the Classics. They all sound great, in their own way, and fit into my definition (which I didn't realize how broad it was until I got to this point). I won't bore you with the nuances just yet. but be forewarned I intend to keep on listening to these pickups and coming up with one that I believe is truly the best and why.

 

[leevc5]

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern/classic Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

Re: Fishman Fluence Modern/classic Humbuckers - concluding unscientific postscript

I threatened to get back in a week and so I am, but unfortunately with the job incomplete.

Since this is all very subjective let me start off with some brief definitions of what I am looking for in an ideal pickup set for my Les Paul:
First note the definitions I mentioned in the original post regarding sound articulation, tonal shape...;
The Bridge should have a bright sound with undertones of tight bass and clean mids;
The Neck should be mellow with more focused mids and treble and a nice tight underlying bass more prominent then the bridge;
When the two come together in the middle position I expect to hear a full rich expression of everything the guitar is capable of producing.
Both pickups should envelop you with their sound not be in your face but be a presence that engages you. This is difficult to explain I guess you either get it or let it go.
And so I have been playing two or three hours a day through the various equipment previously listed except with the addition of a 5F1 amp which is like a home built tweed Champ.
First of the Fluence Classics have blown the SH-2n, the Kent Armstrong hand wound custom bridge and the two Gibson pickups that came with my Les Paul out of the playing field...they just couldn't make the cut.
Now we get down to where I am right now - STUCK!
I can't make a choice between the 59s, the Seth Lovers and the Classics. They all sound great, in their own way, and fit into my definition (which I didn't realize how broad it was until I got to this point). I won't bore you with the nuances just yet. but be forewarned I intend to keep on listening to these pickups and coming up with one that I believe is truly the best and why.

I spent part of today struggling with the "problem" I noted yesterday. Midday I was stuck with an epiphany (I'm sure anyone who bothers to read this would prefer it had been lightening): I have three great sets of humbuckers here the SD 59s, SD Seth Lovers and the Fishman Fluence Classics it is madness to try to cut the quality of these pickups to any finer level. I would gladly have any one of these sets in my guitar and feel confident that they would do the job I needed them to do. But in reality I have to make a choice because after all I do have only one Les Paul. And I chose the Fluence Classics because of the V1 V2 voicing option. This feature really does expand the tonal options in a very practical way it is not just another gadget it is a useful tool.