Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

[JeffB]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I don't get the 57 classic hate around these parts (or most gibson pups, for that matter) I feel they are damned good pickups- they are a different flavor of PAF, but a good one. and do sound very similar to a set of original PAFS I played in an actual 57 Les Paul.

They need to be in a good piece of wood and some MIC/MIK guitar with faux mahogany is not the right kind of wood for them, as that stuff is muddy and lacks overtones to begin with.

Then, Gibson throws them in production level guitars with a 300K volume pot, which is also a mistake.

I had a old Tokai LS with s. american mahogany, a RS vintage wiring kit/500Kpots, and 57 classic/+ that was as righteous a creamy even wind PAf tone as one could ask for.

I can understand people wanting extreme clarity, but sometimes extreme clarity is NOT authentic to the pickup/guitar/amp, and is instead derived from studio magic.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I don't get the 57 classic hate around these parts .

Because they don't sound all that good stock and cost a lot of money?

Tom Holmes knew what he was doing with this design, as they're the only set made by Gibson that can somehow stand the suit's cheaping and lack of respect for the design's specs and still being usable.

With the right magnets can even be good sounding, but... they're just not up to stock Duncan standards, and the Duncans cost less.

I had this set (stock) in my MIJ, all-maple Gibson L-5 CES copy: I had to change the neck's magnet to an A3 to mitigate the inherent boominess, and I got an UOA5 mag in the bridge, as the original A2 didn't played along that well with the modded neck p'up. After the mod they were ok, just not great.

Today, this guitar sounds nothing short than great with a STOCK Seth Lover set.

Can you see a pattern here, Jeff? :cool2:

The question here is not that people hate'em because they're BAD, because they are NOT.

The question here is: if there are other p'ups that sound better AND cost less, why to consider'em at all in the first place, uh?

Food for thought, Jeff.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I wouldn't write them off so fast. I think it depends on what they go in. In a Les Paul.... I don't care for them too much, but I have a stock set in my 359 & that guitar sounds incredibly good!

I have definitely not written on 57s quickly! Its taken me years or working with the wretched things and playing them in various guitars to form my anti gibson 57 prejudice! lol
I have found them to suck in not only les pauls, but SGs, 335s and even hollowbodies! Ive even kept the things in a guitar for over 2 years in the vain hope that maybe it was just my ears and not the pickups. Turns out that as soon as i took them out the guitar magically improved!
Re your 359: ill bet its a superb sounding guitar.....and ill bet it would sound even better with a set of SD59s...or gibson burstbuckers....or pgs.....or seths....or wolfetones...or A2s.....etc etc etc....

of course this is just an opinion. Beauty is in the eye (or ear) of the beholder (or player).

 

[blueman335]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

Because they don't sound all that good stock and cost a lot of money?

With the right magnets can even be good sounding, but... they're just not up to stock Duncan standards, and the Duncans cost less.

+1. '57's are well-made, but A2's aren't the best magnet for the way they're wound. If you want an A2 PAF, you're better off getting a set of PG's or Seth's. They're better than '57's in every way. I've bought my '57's used, at half price, and swapped mags. Then they're a good deal. To pay full price and keep the stock mags in them is disappointing on several levels. The baffling thing is Gibson uses '57's in a lot of models of their guitars. Why? While we're at it, why do they persist in pairing up the 498T/490R, which frustrates so many players? Duncan is so much more in tune with what players want. Not much effort put into the Gibson PU line, it's like an afterthought, and this from the company that invented HB's and P-90's. Not surprising some that players feel let down.

 

[ErikH]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

In some guitars, I can hear where the '57s might be too dark and whatnot. But that is not always the case. I've run them in several different guitars and woods. They really shine in alder Strats. No need to swap mags or anything. My bandmate has a LP Classic with them and they sound fantastic there. With 500k pots and a .022uf tone cap, they sound just fine and cut through the mix great.

 

[JeffB]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

In some guitars, I can hear where the '57s might be too dark and whatnot. But that is not always the case. I've run them in several different guitars and woods. They really shine in alder Strats. No need to swap mags or anything. My bandmate has a LP Classic with them and they sound fantastic there. With 500k pots and a .022uf tone cap, they sound just fine and cut through the mix great.

I'm sorry Erik, clearly the 57s are crap pickups and are in dire need of mag swaps, or a trip to the dumpster in order to sound 1/10th as good as a Duncan :banghead:

 

[ErikH]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I'm sorry Erik, clearly the 57s are crap pickups and are in dire need of mag swaps, or a trip to the dumpster in order to sound 1/10th as good as a Duncan :banghead:

But I love my '57s. :crying: :17:

 

[Mike D]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I bought my LP Custom without knowing what model pickups were in it. When I replaced them (just to try for a different sound, not because I was displeased) I discovered that they were '57s. They sounded pretty nice in that guitar, unlike my experience with them in an R9. The A3 '57 Classics I just ordered will be going in that same Custom, so I'm looking forward to how it turns out. I'll be installing an RS Guitarworks kit at the same time, so we'll see.

 

[rocksoldier]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I'm sorry Erik, clearly the 57s are crap pickups and are in dire need of mag swaps, or a trip to the dumpster in order to sound 1/10th as good as a Duncan :banghead:

But a Duncan with a magnet swap must be even better, right?

Which magnet for EVH tone?:scratchch

 

[blueman335]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

In some guitars, I can hear where the '57s might be too dark and whatnot...They really shine in alder Strats. No need to swap mags or anything.

That could be one of the problems; Gibson doesn't put them in alder Strats. They can be dark in mahogany, their intended recipients, especially in the neck slot. The bridge: the best way I can describe it is thin and ribbony with a very rounded high end. Doesn't work for me.

 

[JeffB]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

But a Duncan with a magnet swap must be even better, right?

Which magnet for EVH tone?:scratchch

Unoriented AXII with a reverse polarity Flux Capacitor in a Invader re-wound with 42 gauge wire on one coil and Berkley 12 pound monofilament test on the other totally cops the EVH tone, once I've wiped my ass with it after a round of 7-11 Beef Burritos & Chili Cheese dogs from the night before.

Really. Totally frikking does that tone all day long. VH1 through 1984. If I skip the Burritos, then it does a decent 5150 tone.

Seriously.

I'm thinking of opening up a booteek ass rubbed pickup facility so I can quit my day job, and rake in the bucks from all these VH morons.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

Not much effort put into the Gibson PU line, it's like an afterthought, and this from the company that invented HB's and P-90's. Not surprising some that players feel let down.

The Gibson company that created all the instruments we love has't existed for a very long time, Rick. After they went bankrupt and the HQ got dismanteled and looted, and the good people that made the company great were let go, the suits that bought it for peanuts didn't really have a thing to even get started.

They even hired Seymour to consult for the p'up line, but hearsay is they didn't reach an agreement for a design, he just consulted in production process (looks like he jump started the p'up factory without even having a design to go after).

 

[Markk]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

Oh man, and here I was think that I really liked the sound of Classic 57's in my guitar. Now I've got to go get me some Seth Lovers.

 

[blueman335]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

Oh man, and here I was think that I really liked the sound of Classic 57's in my guitar. Now I've got to go get me some Seth Lovers.

You just may like them better. I bet almost everyone that's tried both would go with Seths.

 

[LtKojak]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

You just may like them better. I bet almost everyone that's tried both would go with Seths.

I wouldn't be so sure, as the brand's WEIGHT is enormous and, specially in countries with no historic contact with american gear, most just get some Gibson '57 Classic and think: well, that's the way it's suppose to sound. End of discussion. They just don't realize all there is out there!

In a blind test however, IME with people with ears for tone, most will just choose the Seths or even '59s over the '57 Classics every time. Specially when testing for cleans, early breakup and mild overdrive. When gain goes up, the differences become so small that aren't noticeable anymore, so... I just go with the ones that cost less, and in Italy the Duncans cost less than the Gibsons.

HTH,

 

[bigred]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

i've got conformation from the music zoo sales rep. the a3 57's was a typo.

 

[ErikH]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

After some further research, it appears that the "vintage" tag applies to the matched set, which just so happens to include the '57 Classic and '57 Classic Plus. They are the same exact A2 '57 Classics that can be purchased separately offered in a set, the Vintage Matched set, because they are made like and have the output of a vintage PAF.

On Guitar Center's site, there is a Hot Vintage Matched set with mention of A3 in there but I find no confirmation of that on Gibson's site.

 

[Gypsyblue]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

If you want the regular, go after them used. That's what I did. Saved a bunch that way. I love those pickups but they are overpriced, IMO.

The 57 Classics get an undeserved bad rap, IMO. I think it's because Gibson used the wrong values for the volume potentiometers for so long. They should have used 500K pots and not 300K. From what I've read, Gibson does use 500K pots now, but the damage has been done and many players are turned off by the dull tone that 57 Classics had with 300K volume pots and they blame the pickup.

Just my opinion. But I will say that they are a different and better pickup with 500K pots. Much more alive to my ears.

 

[stephen78]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I love the 57 classic/57 classic plus in my LP Traditional. I actually tried some boutique stuff in that guitar, but went back to the 57's. I also have an RS vintage kit with 500k pots/Luxe caps/50's wiring, so that is a big change compared to the stock pots and caps.

 

[Gypsyblue]

Re: Gibson 57 classics vintage matched set

I don't get the 57 classic hate around these parts (or most gibson pups, for that matter) I feel they are damned good pickups- they are a different flavor of PAF, but a good one. and do sound very similar to a set of original PAFS I played in an actual 57 Les Paul.

I had a old Tokai LS with s. american mahogany, a RS vintage wiring kit/500Kpots, and 57 classic/+ that was as righteous a creamy even wind PAf tone as one could ask for.

This! I read that Gibson used 300K volume pots in some guitars with 57 Classics. Leaks a lot of treble (and clarity) to ground. 500K pots make all the difference in the world. Don't blame bad tone on the pickups if you're using 250K or 300K pots that throw away all the highs. My Les Paul came with 57 Classics - sounds great. But it has 500K pots.