Gibson Nighthawk Wiring With Modern Superswitch

[Kwrig31]

Ah! My apologies. I read through it but didn't notice it solved the floating coil issue, I was fixed on your previous diagram at that point. As you stated, now it seems all we need to do is update the 4th position to be hum canceling. I'll do my best to come up with a solution but would love your input on the options we have.

I did have one concern though. I may be completely wrong, but after tracing out the diagram it seems the inside bridge coil is selected in the split positions. With the nighthawk, the best tone comes from the outside (south) coil and I'm not sure how to reverse it without causing other issues.

Thanks again,

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

I did have one concern though. I may be completely wrong, but after tracing out the diagram it seems the inside bridge coil is selected in the split positions. With the nighthawk, the best tone comes from the outside (south) coil and I'm not sure how to reverse it without causing other issues.

Thanks again,

Yes, i was already planning to tweak that as part of the other changes involved to add a hum-canceling bridge split/neck split position.

So, let me share what i'm thinking so far about this. I could ponder it further, but so far I don't see a way to add that hum-canceling bridge split/neck split position at Position 4 itself without losing some current features. Instead, I see it fitting in nicely at Position 3 when the 4PDT is in the Up position. When 4DPT is down, you would get Bridge HB / Neck HB. If you still really want Middle pickup alone, you could get that by converting your Master Volume to a Push-Pull and the Up position would give you that. It would override the 5 way switch, so its just one physical motion required. When you push it back down, the active pickups are whatever was selected on the 5 way before the push-pull b4 it was pulled up. How does that sound?

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[Kwrig31]

Perfect! I'm glad we're on the same page.

I honestly really never use the middle pickup alone so that would be a good compromise (in turn also making every position hum cancelling, as the only non-hum cancelling would be the middle pup alone).

 

[Kwrig31]

After playing a bit last night, I found myself constantly switching to and from the tele sound to the full bridge. Honestly it might be difficult to change that to a 2-motion movement, as it is probably my most used clean tone. If at all possible (which as you mentioned, it may not be), I'd prefer to keep the "Tele" sound on the 4pdt down position. Sorry to go back and forth here, but I had to sit down and put it to practice before I could really tell if it is a good option.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

After playing a bit last night, I found myself constantly switching to and from the tele sound to the full bridge. Honestly it might be difficult to change that to a 2-motion movement, as it is probably my most used clean tone. If at all possible (which as you mentioned, it may not be), I'd prefer to keep the "Tele" sound on the 4pdt down position. Sorry to go back and forth here, but I had to sit down and put it to practice before I could really tell if it is a good option.

No, that was good that you did a practical test. I myself am all about having options for multiple pickup combinations BUT also ensuring that I don't have to perform gymnastics to change btw those different sounds.

I am pondering and sketching as we speak to find a way to get the Tele sound and full bridge HB alone in the same mode of the 4dpt switch. Will *probably* be easier to do now that you have told me that you don't necessarily need to have Middle pickup alone reside at Position 3 (can go to a push-pull override instead).

Question: how important is it for the new scheme to retain the combination that has full Brudge HB / Middle pickup? That is not and cannot be set up as a hum-canceling combination, BTW, because there are 3 coils involved. Hum-canceling requires an even number of coils.



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[Jack_TriPpEr]

Also: how important is it for the new scheme to retain Bridge pickup split all by itself? Same question for Neck pickup split all by itself?

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[Kwrig31]

Question: how important is it for the new scheme to retain the combination that has full Brudge HB / Middle pickup? That is not and cannot be set up as a hum-canceling combination, BTW, because there are 3 coils involved. Hum-canceling requires an even number of coils.

I prefer to keep as many of the original tones as possible, even though that one isn't a commonly used tone, it definitely has a place in some songs we play live. It does have much more hum due to the middle being included but it's mostly used on low gain tones anyway.

Also: how important is it for the new scheme to retain Bridge pickup split all ny itself? Same question for Neck pickup split all by itself?

I am constantly splitting the bridge, the neck not as much but intuitively it just makes sense to have all 5 split in the up position (basically a strat). Same thing with sacrificing the middle, it's not something that I'd like to give up but if it means quieting down the other positions by opening up a spot, I just have to go with the lesser of the evils.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

While awaiting your responses to my last couple questions, I came up with the following which I really like. All pickup combinations in 4DPT Down mode are hum-canceling and without use of the "dangling coil" method).

S = South Coil
N = North Coil

4DPT DOWN:

1. Bridge S
2. Bridge S / Middle
3. Bridge S /Neck N (The Tele sound)
4. Neck S / Middle
5. Neck N (could also easily be Neck S instead if you want)

4PDT UP:
1. Bridge HB
2. Bridge HB / Middle
3. Bridge HB / Neck HB
4. Neck HB / Middle
5. Neck HB

Master Volume w Push-Pull pot: Push pull UP gives you Bridge HB alone, overriding the 5 way switch. This is how you could jump directly btw the Tele sound and full Bridge HB.

Tell me what you think.


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[Jack_TriPpEr]

Because i can see your question coming (lol) of "Middle pickup by itself is missing. Can that be added?" The answer is yes BUT you would need to use a Fender S1 switch for the Master Volume. An S1 is a pot with a push-push 4DPT. The 4DPT of the S1 would replace your current 4DPT switch. Then additionally, you would install into the slot of the current 4DPT, a 3 way On-Off-On switch, which would have the following functionality:

UP = Bridge HB alone overrides the 5 way switch
MIDDLE = the 5 way is active
DOWN = Middle pickup alone overrides the 5 way switch

:0)

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[Kwrig31]

If that is possible, it would be brilliant! I may not use the p/p for the bridge but I'd love to have that option down the road if I decide the transition doesn't work on stage.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

If that is possible, it would be brilliant! I may not use the p/p for the bridge but I'd love to have that option down the road if I decide the transition doesn't work on stage.

I want to make sure you noticed that the scheme does not include Middle pickup by itself.... and if you do want to add that in, then read what I wrote in Reply # 29. Let me know.

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[Kwrig31]

Absolutely. There's so much hum with the middle alone I almost consider it unusable for any amount of gain. I honestly can't remember a time I used it (on purpose) in a live setting.

Jack_TriPpEr I really appreciate you taking the time to consider my preferences and limited understanding of the subject, and offering sound advice

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Cool, you're welcome. Tomorrow i'll make a cleaned up version of my sketch of the new wiring scheme and post a pic of it here for you.

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[Jack_TriPpEr]

Cool, you're welcome. Tomorrow i'll make a cleaned up version of my sketch of the new wiring scheme and post a pic of it here for you.

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Kwrig31,

As I was cleaning up my drawing, I spotted a problem in my earlier design. I'm going to need some more time to figure things out. Won't be able to invest more time agin on it until tomorrow.

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[Benjy_26]

Am I missing something, or can all of this be accomplished with a normal 5 way and a pair of push/pulls?

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Am I missing something, or can all of this be accomplished with a normal 5 way and a pair of push/pulls?

Two push pulls still leave out Middle pup alone. The complexity comes in because you need Neck North coil at one point ro pair with Bridge split coil to get hum-canceling, but also need Neck south coil at another point to get hum-canceling with the Middle singlecoil which has a North up polarity. Then on top of the that, switch over to full Neck humbucker in the same 3 positions of the 5 way when you're not in splitcoik mode. That uses up 4 poles right there.

OP says he's fine without Middle pup alone.

I think i just resolved my most recent issue in getting this all to work (minus middle pup alone) with either 2 push pulls or a single On-On 4PDT (which is the OP's preference).

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[Jack_TriPpEr]

Kwrig31,

Here's the completed diagram.

Note how you need to swap around the 4 wires on the Bridge pickup.

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[Benjy_26]

Two push pulls still leave out Middle pup alone. The complexity comes in because you need Neck North coil at one point ro pair with Bridge split coil to get hum-canceling, but also need Neck south coil at another point to get hum-canceling with the Middle singlecoil which has a North up polarity. Then on top of the that, switch over to full Neck humbucker in the same 3 positions of the 5 way when you're not in splitcoik mode. That uses up 4 poles right there.

OP says he's fine without Middle pup alone.

I think i just resolved my most recent issue in getting this all to work (minus middle pup alone) with either 2 push pulls or a single On-On 4PDT (which is the OP's preference).

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Pos 3 on a standard switch is usually middle alone.

 

[Jack_TriPpEr]

Pos 3 on a standard switch is usually middle alone.

Read thru this thread and you'll see where we decided to use position 3 to get either both full HBs or neck & bridge split. Both of which OP prefers over middle pup alone

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[Kwrig31]

Kwrig31,

Here's the completed diagram.

Note how you need to swap around the 4 wires on the Bridge pickup.

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Thank you, thank you! Can't wait to dig deeper into this and trace out the leads. I'm even more impatient for the day I can figure this s#%! out on my own! I'll post my results shortly and let everyone know what your mastery reveals