Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue?)

[Fuhgawz]

Hi guys! I found lots of options for fitting an ABR-1 bridge on Nashville posts, but I actually want to go the other way around on my Gibson SG. The original bridge with the annoying wire doesn't have enough range to intonate properly when downtuning to C. Also, it feels really weak.

I bought a Gotoh bridge with 4mm posts, which should fit ABR-1 posts according to different sources. However, when I put them on my SG, the holes on the bridge are a little bit bigger than the holes on the Gibson ABR-1 bridge. It's not much bigger, but enough for the bridge to be able to move around a bit when I put them on the posts. It doesn't matter that much, but I like my bridge to fit perfectly so it is not able to move around and mess with my intonation.

I started searching the web and found that USA Gibson bridges have a different size than other parts. Something about metric vs imperial. Perhaps this is the issue here? Can someone offer a solution for this issue? I really want a bridge with wider range that perfectly fits USA Gibson ABR-1 posts.

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

You need the anchors and posts for the Gotoh. I installed the large post metric Tonepro in place of the nashville, the center to center of the posts is the same, so it lines up right. The best way to do it is to dowel the original holes and re-drill for the TP anchors, otherwise if you just try to ream the holes out you might not get them centered correctly.

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

Or you could just reverse the saddle for more range.

 

[Funkfingers]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

The alternative fix is a few wraps of good ol' PTFE plumber's tape around the Gotoh posts.

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

You need the anchors and posts for the Gotoh. I installed the large post metric Tonepro in place of the nashville, the center to center of the posts is the same, so it lines up right. The best way to do it is to dowel the original holes and re-drill for the TP anchors, otherwise if you just try to ream the holes out you might not get them centered correctly.

Thanks. The Gotoh bridge did come with posts and thumb screws. The post are just a tiny bit larger than the standard Gibson ones. I don't have the equipment or skills though to do such work on the guitar myself and am afraid that it would cost me a lot to have it done. If I can't find an alternative bridge, this seems like the most logical step though.

Or you could just reverse the saddle for more range.

That might actually be a good idea! Thanks. I really don't like the ABR bridge though. It looks and feels flimsey. The wire is bent and some screws aren't 100% straight anymore so they are hard to turn. EDIT: turns out the saddles on the lowest two strings already were reversed. These strings are also the ones that I can't intonate properly.

The alternative fix is a few wraps of good ol' PTFE plumber's tape around the Gotoh posts.

I've thought of this, but thought that it might limit the movement of the thumb screws. Plus, it might be ugly. I don't know why that matters, but it does.



But to be clear, no one can think of a Nashville style bridge that fits the USA Gibson ABR posts? Perhaps ABR bridges that have wider travel than standard ones (and preferably no wire)?

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

If the holes only need slightly enlarged you should be able to pull it off with a drill, if you're careful not to let the drill wobble and make sure you go in straight. Mine had to be enlarged quite a bit for the large post TP, hence the dowel and re-drill.

You might oughtta make sure which bridge you have if you want to try another replacement, if this is a newer SG it probably isn't an ABR-1. Look on the bottom of the bridge, mine had BR-EG or something to that effect stamped into it. I think ABR's actually have ABR stamped into them.

I think the Tonepro nashville has more adjustment in it than the stock nashville unit, the Callaham probably does too, and they make conversion posts. That's the direction I recommend if you just have to change it out and don't have the skills or confidence to get rowdy on it.

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

No, it's definitely an ABR-1. It actually has it stamped on the bottom, plus it has the annoying wire and screws/saddles that are a bit loose in there. I don't like it. The guitar is a Gibson SG Iommi Signature (production model, not the super expensive custom shop).

 

[ItsaBass]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

It'll be fine once it is under tension. There won't be any ill effects.

The thing is that you won't get much more saddle movement with a Nashville bridge. Hardly worth the money, as it still won't intonate all that well in C standard. My Nashville bridges don't even intonate right on the low E with 11-54's and regular tuning.

What I would do would be to custom make a wooden bridge stand, kind of like a hollow-body bridge. Make it so it mounts on the original ABR-1 posts, but so that it places the bridge farther back. Not only will it be completely reversible, but it will give you better intonation than any bridge you can drop on to the original posts. (You'll need to top wrap if you do this.)

Whatever you do, I wouldn't enlarge those original ABR-1 post holes. Most people prefer an ABR-1, and that would devalue the guitar should you ever sell it.

 

[King IzzO)))]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

Oh, yeah, on that guitar I def would not modify it like I did mine (SG special, already beat to hell). Look into the replacement ABRs, see if any of them allow more travel. I use 12-54 and tune to drop B on mine and I still have room on the 6th saddle, so I have no problem recommending the Tonepros bridge.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

Brutal solution: bend the posts. If they are high enough that works.

As Ayrton said, you are sure that you also "used up" the range from reversing them, right?

 

[Ayrton]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

While it would not surprise me at all to see Gibson screw up the post location, I have to say I have not yet seen an ABR that could not be intonated after reversing the saddle.

Now if you hate the ABR because of the wire, just get the wireless replacement.

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

It'll be fine once it is under tension. There won't be any ill effects.

The thing is that you won't get much more saddle movement with a Nashville bridge. Hardly worth the money, as it still won't intonate all that well in C standard. My Nashville bridges don't even intonate right on the low E with 11-54's and regular tuning.

What I would do would be to custom make a wooden bridge stand, kind of like a hollow-body bridge. Make it so it mounts on the original ABR-1 posts, but so that it places the bridge farther back. Not only will it be completely reversible, but it will give you better intonation than any bridge you can drop on to the original posts. (You'll need to top wrap if you do this.)

Whatever you do, I wouldn't enlarge those original ABR-1 post holes. Most people prefer an ABR-1, and that would devalue the guitar should you ever sell it.

I definitely don't agree with you here. I have to turn the saddles almost all the way back on the first and third string on the Nashville, but it surely intonates, while it did not on the ABR!! I'm sure the ABR intonates with 10-46 strings in E, but it definitely does not with thick strings in C!

The custom wooden thing sounds like a great option, but like I said, I don't have the skills or equipment to do something like this.

About your last comment: I can buy ABR-1 bridges with 4mm holes from Gotoh, Tonepros and other suppliers, but I can't buy Nashville bridges with smaller holes. If I decide to sell I can put on a Tonepros ABR-1 as an 'upgrade' instead. It wouldn't devalue at all and it would help my intonation situation right now. I really think this is the best solution.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

I notice a curious absence of information on the revere saddle issue.

Write-only poster?

 

[Fuhgawz]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

I notice a curious absence of information on the revere saddle issue.

Write-only poster?

Is that about me? I already said in my second post that the saddles that don't intonate on the original ABR-1 were already reversed. I edited it in later, so maybe that's why missed it. I checked it after someone mentioned it here and then edited my post.

So, I went to a local guitar tech about this issue. He said "welcome to the wonderful world of guitar parts, where nothing is interchangeable". He said the bridge I had on now was too loose. He also suggested replacing it with a Tonepros ABR-1 style bridge, like King Izzo said, as they have more intonation range than the regular ABR-1's and the screws can't move up and down like they can with just a wire. I pointed him to the saddles on the Nashville that were almost all the way to the back. He checked my current intonation, which was right except for slight adjustments on two strings, and he said he could probably get the Tonepros to go far enough to intonate properly in C. I told him to do it. I will pick it up on friday. I will let you know if it worked.

So thanks guys for the help, but the real lesson learned here is to go to a tech with such issues. Sorry for wasting your time.

 

[uOpt]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

Is that confirmed that the Tonepros has more range? In the metric world the Tonepros is just a Gotoh with two more holes.

Would you mind posting a picture?

I would hesitate bringing it to a tech because the proper fix is to move the post by filling the old hole in the top. On a valuable top that might not look great.

 

[Chickenwings]

Re: Gotoh bridge on Gibson ABR-1 posts: holes a bit too big (metric vs imperial issue

i dont know if this helps but..if you are not using a trem then just live with it. Gotoh's work just fine dropping them on.
I have a gotoh on my 175 and moving is not an issue cos the strings hold it in place.
I put a tonepros on my 335 tho cos i use a bigsby.