Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

[Mr Wolf]

Hi all,

My band are looking to take the plunge and go for in-ear monitoring. Up until now we have always used a basic PA for vocals only with standalone bass/guitar amps without mic'ing up. Of course setting up for gigs will be a lot more involved with this change but on the whole it seems like the way to go.

When it comes to getting guitars into the PA, of course one option we are looking at is getting an SM57 and going that way, however there are quite a few DI/cab emulator options out there. In theory They seem great and convenient, but are they actually any good?

I noted the H&K Red Box which is pretty cheap, but I know you can spend a lot more on others. If you have any advice I am all ears!

Cheers

Jeff

 

[agufish]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

H&K is great, but it's not a loadbox. If you want to ditch your cab completely and just carry around the amp heads, you'd need to look into something like the Two Notes Torpedo Live. I just picked one up for clean gear demos and I love it. Massive customization options for cab type, mic type and even mic placement. It is pretty damn pricey, though.

 

[Boogie Bill]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

Mesa Cab-Clone.

You should also check out Tech 21 Character Series, Sansamp, et.al., and Radial Engineering.

Bill

 

[Mr Wolf]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

Thanks.

Agufish - I know the red box is not a load box. I was thinking about still using the amp, but wondering about these devices in place of traditional mic'ing.

Boogie Bill - I will check out the suggestions. I have seen the Radial JDX Reactor. No idea what it is like though!

Many thanks.

 

[Falloffthebonetone]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

I have a Sansamp Paradriver which is supposed to be good. I like it as an overdrive box but I have never used it in the way that you are suggesting even though that is partly its intent. I guess it's worth mentioning?

 

[Mr Wolf]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

Hi there,

Thanks! At this stage yes. It is a whole new world to me so I am getting my head around what's out there, and what's worth considering against mic'ing up a cab the usual way. With the band, I find anything that saves time that makes life a little easier is a plus, although it needs to be viable from a tonal perspective.

Cheers

 

[trevorus]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

I've used an isolated cabinet in a room, Cab emulated DI boxes... My favorite convenience rig is a Tech 21 Fly Rig 5 into a cab-tone emulated DI, no amp. This requires a competent sound man and good monitors, possibly in-ears. But it's the fastest and lightest load in/out ever.

 

[Myaccount876]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

Mesa Cab-Clone.

You should also check out Tech 21 Character Series, Sansamp, et.al., and Radial Engineering.

Bill

My personal opinion - the Mesa Cab Clone sounds like ass; like it simply applyed an extreme LPF to murder all high end, distortion through it sounds grainy, and I'd honestly rather take a Scholz Rockman from the '80s over it (and I HATE that sound). I personally think there isn't a decent cab sim out there to use with a real amp (cab sims for amp sims within a single program is a different story - they're made for each other). My very first suggestion is an isolation cabinet; they can be more portable, more consistent between nights, easier to setup, AND you can have them in your in-ear monitors. They sound the most like the "normal" amp setup, you can really customize your sound with different speakers/mics, and it doesn't have the drawback of being very directional on-stage because they come out of the PA. Decent ones can be had for fairly cheap, or you can make your own without too much effort.

Two things to consider using amp sims:

1) Hit and miss quality; there are great amp sims, and there are lots of garbage ones. Unfortunately, the ones that IMO sound better (like a Kemper or AxeFX) are expensive

2) How likely is it that the sound man will even knows how to operate sims? Most of the time, bar/club sound guys aren't actual audio engineers; they're just the owner's/manager's buddy who knows how to move faders on a board. It really sucks when you have a great amp sim, but the sound guy just ruins the whole thing and makes it sound horrible because he isn't familiar with the equipment.

 

[Mr Wolf]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

My personal opinion - the Mesa Cab Clone sounds like ass; like it simply applyed an extreme LPF to murder all high end, distortion through it sounds grainy, and I'd honestly rather take a Scholz Rockman from the '80s over it (and I HATE that sound). I personally think there isn't a decent cab sim out there to use with a real amp (cab sims for amp sims within a single program is a different story - they're made for each other). My very first suggestion is an isolation cabinet; they can be more portable, more consistent between nights, easier to setup, AND you can have them in your in-ear monitors. They sound the most like the "normal" amp setup, you can really customize your sound with different speakers/mics, and it doesn't have the drawback of being very directional on-stage because they come out of the PA. Decent ones can be had for fairly cheap, or you can make your own without too much effort.

Two things to consider using amp sims:

1) Hit and miss quality; there are great amp sims, and there are lots of garbage ones. Unfortunately, the ones that IMO sound better (like a Kemper or AxeFX) are expensive

2) How likely is it that the sound man will even knows how to operate sims? Most of the time, bar/club sound guys aren't actual audio engineers; they're just the owner's/manager's buddy who knows how to move faders on a board. It really sucks when you have a great amp sim, but the sound guy just ruins the whole thing and makes it sound horrible because he isn't familiar with the equipment.

Thanks for the update and highlighting those points. To answer point two briefly - there will be no sound guy. My band usually do weddings and other functions and we (the band) sort out all the gear, so the end result is down to us! I will look into iso-cabs. That said, for now I am curious whether just mic'ing my cab with a Shure SM57 is the way to go.

Please keep the thoughts coming in, as I have little experience when it comes to the nitty-gritty beyond my own guitar-board-amp setup!

Thanks

 

[Kamanda~SD]

Re: Guitar DI/cab sim gear for live use

Cab Clone is the worst of the solutions. Things like the torpedo are cool, but are expensive.

57 all the way. Since you doing in ear, take some time to find where you like it mic'd on the amp and put the ol tape 'L' on it.