H/S Tele wiring questions

[alex1fly]

I have a few questions about best practices for Tele wiring. I know this has been covered, but I'm not finding any quick answers using the search and other forums are generally all over the place.

I have a S/S Tele with 250k volume and 250k no-load tone, and want to try my Seth Lover in the neck position. Conventional wisdom says I need a 500k pot somewhere in there, but do I since the tone is already no-load?

The below wiring diagram is what comes up on the main SD page for HS Telecaster. What is the push/pull doing in this case - split, serial/parallel, other?

If I wanted to put something like the Little 59 in the bridge, could I use the push/pull for both pickups?


Thanks, Alex

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

You don’t need the 500k pot. Just try it with the 250 k pot. I use a 250k pot in my guitar with humbuckers. It’s a bright guitar so that warms it up. Plus it’s your neck pickup.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jeremy]

you can try the seth with 250k but for my taste it would be too dark most likely so id rewire so the tone control is only on the bridge pup.

as far as the p/p in the diagram, its splitting the coils and you can do that to two pups on one p/p pot

 

[Mincer]

I didn't think a Seth with 250k was too dark. But I like darker tones. It isn't as dark as some regular Tele pickups, or wiring schemes.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

Whether you use a 250K, 500K plain, or 500K no-load for the tone is a matter or personal taste IMHO. Some even advocate using a 1meg tone pot. Just remember, the more ohms you put between the volume pot and the tone capacitor, the brighter it will sound, but the roll-off will be quicker.

The push-pull in the S-D schematic is for coil splitting the humbucker. It's optional. If you use it wire the two "middle" humbucker wires to eachother then follow the diagram. If you don't want a coil split, just use a regular volume pot and solder the two "middle" wires to each other and insulate the ends, ideally with heat shrink, although electrical tape will do.

If your own humbucker only has two wires, just ignore the push-pull entirely. Use a regular pot, job done.

Oh. The bare wire goes to a pot back regardless.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

PS If you want you can use a push-pull tone instead. Wire the pickups and switch the same way, but the push-pull part just gets moved to the tone pot position.

 

[alex1fly]

Thanks all. I know this is basic stuff, but I have a tendency to rush in and screw things up before asking for help... trying a new approach this time

If both pickups are going to use the push/pull, do you put both red/white combos on the same tab of the push/pull? So 4 wires total on the same tab?

 

[jeremy]

no. the p/p is a double pole, double throw switch (dpdt for short) so think of each set of three contacts as independent for splitting purposes. youd connect the other pups red/white wires (assuming duncan pup) to the other middle contact and also ground the corresponding contact.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

Bear in mind that some Tele bodies have a step in the bottom of the control cavity,, right under the volume pot IIRC. This makes the volume pot location too shallow for a push-pull. It has to go in the tone position.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

It's worth considering doing the 4-way blade mod (neck and bridge in series as well as parallel) while you're at it.

A couple more S-D wiring diagrams to consider with the 4-way blade below..

Points to consider:

1. To fit the 4-way blade switch and make it work properly you'll need to elongate the switch slot 1-2 mm at either end. The standard slot stops the switch swinging the full distances needed.. Use a flat needle file with a serrated edge and it's easy.
2. Any 5-wire (4 colors plus bare) humbucker can be coil split.
3. On S-D pickups just wire the red and white wires from one pickup to the same single middle tab on a push-pull, or if you prefer, a separate DPDT mini-switch. Of the three tabs on the push-pull side you select, ground the tab nearest the potentiometer body ONLY. That gives push = full humbucker, pull = coil split. Ground the other tab ONLY for push = coil split, pull = full humbucker.
4. The push-pull function is entirely separate from the rotary potentiometer function so it doesn't matter, electronically, which pot you replace with a push-pull.
5. Alternatively you can use a DPDT mini switch located between the pots, but you'll need to drill a hole for it. I used these: DIYhz 10Pcs AC 250V/1.5A 120V/3A... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075RDYMQQ?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
6. The wiring diagrams work for any 4 plus bare wire humbuckers.
7. If you're not using S-D pickups you'll have to change the colors you wire up accordingly.
8. If you're mixing, say, an S-D humbucker with a Fender single coil, you'll have to reverse the wiring on one, as S-D and Fender (and possibly other) brand pickups are wound in opposite directions. If you reverse the S-D just use the green wire where the black is shown, the black where the green is shown, or better still swap the wires on the single coil over.

 

[alex1fly]

It's worth considering doing the 4-way blade mod (neck and bridge in series as well as parallel) while you're at it.

A couple more S-D wiring diagrams to consider with the 4-way blade below..

Points to consider:

1. To fit the 4-way blade switch and make it work properly you'll need to elongate the switch slot 1-2 mm at either end. The standard slot stops the switch swinging the full distances needed.. Use a flat needle file with a serrated edge and it's easy.
2. Any 5-wire (4 colors plus bare) humbucker can be coil split.
3. On S-D pickups just wire the red and white wires from one pickup to the same single middle tab on a push-pull, or if you prefer, a separate DPDT mini-switch. Of the three tabs on the push-pull side you select, ground the tab nearest the potentiometer body ONLY. That gives push = full humbucker, pull = coil split. Ground the other tab ONLY for push = coil split, pull = full humbucker.
4. The push-pull function is entirely separate from the rotary potentiometer function so it doesn't matter, electronically, which pot you replace with a push-pull.
5. Alternatively you can use a DPDT mini switch located between the pots, but you'll need to drill a hole for it. I used these: DIYhz 10Pcs AC 250V/1.5A 120V/3A... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B075RDYMQQ?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
6. The wiring diagrams work for any 4 plus bare wire humbuckers.
7. If you're not using S-D pickups you'll have to change the colors you wire up accordingly.
8. If you're mixing, say, an S-D humbucker with a Fender single coil, you'll have to reverse the wiring on one, as S-D and Fender (and possibly other) brand pickups are wound in opposite directions. If you reverse the S-D just use the green wire where the black is shown, the black where the green is shown, or better still swap the wires on the single coil over.

Thanks! Easy as pie

Is it possible to do the 4 way switch and the push/pull for splitting the HB? Looks like red/white is what enables the split, and those are still shown as taped together on the 4-way switch diagram.

What exactly gets reversed when mixing pickup brands? Planning to keep the Fender bridge single coil for now.... whoops never mind, you specified which one to do.

 

[alex1fly]

Bear in mind that some Tele bodies have a step in the bottom of the control cavity,, right under the volume pot IIRC. This makes the volume pot location too shallow for a push-pull. It has to go in the tone position.

Good catch. This one does have the step. So I thought hey, maybe I'll just reverse the control plate... nope, the switch area is slightly longer and deeper than the area under the tone pot.

 

[alex1fly]

Well the Seth Lover is way dark compared to the bridge single coil even with the tone removed. Maybe because of the 250k volume pot? I suppose it shouldn't be a surprise. We'll see...

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

Thanks! Easy as pie

Is it possible to do the 4 way switch and the push/pull for splitting the HB? Looks like red/white is what enables the split, and those are still shown as taped together on the 4-way switch diagram.

Yes, absolutely.

Just fit a push-pull of your desired ohms, I recommend in the tone position, and wire up the potentiometer part as normal.

Now solder the ends of the humbucker red and white to each other and then solder the tip of the paired wires to the middle lug on one side of the push-pull. The lugs are arranged in two groups of three. - pick a middle on one set of three and wire BOTH the red and white to it.

Now ground the push-pull lug nearest the potentiometer part on the same set of three to the pot casing.

Job done.

Push = full humbucker, pull = coil split.

What exactly gets reversed when mixing pickup brands? Planning to keep the Fender bridge single coil for now.... whoops never mind, you specified which one to do.

You'll know if you've got mixed polarities because on the usual position 2 (neck and bridge in parallel) the sound will be weak and asthmatic, not the full roar you're used to, even with two single coils.

Assuming you have, say, a Seymour Duncan humbucker and a Fender single coil, the best thing to do is to wire up the Seymour Duncan humbucker using the S-D wiring diagram, then reverse the wire connections on the single coil. The normal hot (usually white or yellow) becomes the ground (normally black), and the black goes where the white or yellow should.

One other thing:

Remember you will certainly need a third wire soldered to the chrome cover of a single coil neck pickup. The existing connection between the ground wire and the chrome cover needs to be cut. File away some of the chrome from an inconspicuous area and solder the wire to the copper/ brass you will expose, not the chrome. The new wire gets grounded directly and independently to the back of a pot. Humbuckers usually have bare wire which does this job already.

The same applies to any metal baseplate on a single coil bridge pickup.


Finally... the SD Little 59 bridge humbucker and Vintage Stack neck combo is great.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

I also recommend the Fleor type push pulls over the Mojotone ones. They're smaller, and so fit inside the control cavity easier.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

OH SHOOT. WAIT!!

I don't think a push-pull will work as I said with a neck humbucker.

You'll need to wire the red to the lug furthest from the pot, the white to the middle lug, and an extra wire from the bottom lug to where the green connects onto the switch. Solder the green there too.

In push, red and white are connected just like a not coil split humbucker.

In pull the extra wire takes over from the green, providing a ground through the white wire.

In other words in full humbcker the wiring goes switch > green > south coil > red > white (joined on the push-pull) > north coil > black > switch.

In coil split you deactivate the south coil (red and green) by disconnecting the red. The circuit is now switch > black > north coil > white > extra wire (connected to red by the third lug on the push-pull) > switch.

 

[ThreeChordWonder]

One final trick....

You can wire all this up on your bench and test it before fitting inside the guitar, but avoid messing with the joints on the pickups themselves. It's far too easy to break one of the VERY thin coil wires.