HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

[St_Genesius]

I went to GC yesterday with a buddy to buy his first electric (he's been playing acoustic for about 10 years). He writes and plays mostly alt-country stuff, so I, of course, started out by putting several Teles in his hands. He liked the sound, but really felt himself gravitating towards the looks of the Ibanez Artcore stuff on the wall. After warning him of the potential muddy pitfalls of humbuckers for the sort of music he plays, we set about the task of finding the brightest, liveliest Jazzbox in the joint. And I think we did. But he's already wondering about swapping out the pups and was asking which ones he should get.

My first thought was perhaps a Jazz-JB or Jazz-59 combination, but perhaps there are better ones? We really want to bring out the sparkle, the air and the graininess and to do it in a low-medium output pickup because that seems to allow for teetering just on the edge of dirty a bit more easily than a high output pup that wants to go automatically to full scream.

 

[jeremy]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

i think a jazz neck, 59 bridge would be a cool combo for what you say he wants

 

[Lewguitar]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

i think a jazz neck, 59 bridge would be a cool combo for what you say he wants

I do too. Or even a set of Jazz N and Jazz B humbuckers. The Jazz is similar to the 59 but has a litle more upper harmonics and a very slightly clearer and "zingier" tone...but the Jazz will rock too! Just listen to any of Jolly's clips.

Since the 59B is just about my favorite bridge humbucker and I definately prefer the Jazz N to the 59N, the Jazz N and 59B seems like a great suggestion.

Lew

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

I hadn't thought about two jazzes...clear and zingy is exactly what he's looking for -- like I said, he loved the sound of even the very cheapest Teles, but just couldn't get excited by the looks (I LOOOVE Teles, so I don't quite get that) so anything that gets him closer to a SC sound is going to be a good choice. Both the Jazz and 59 can come with 4-wire conductors, no? Having splitting as an option would seem to be worth the effort in this case.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

I vote for a couple of underwound Phat Cats.

Put a regular neck model (8.0k) in the bridge position, and then take another neck model and unwind it by about 1,200 turns (1.0k) to bring it down to 7.0k.

You won't be sorry...

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

The reason he and I went yesterday was because they had one of those Squier Telecaster Custom IIs on clearance for $153, which is about $80 less than the MF price and I was thinking that it might make a good choice for him. But after actually playing it for bit, I really wasn't impressed with its ability to do what he'd want it to do. It sounded GREAT under heavy gain (as P90s almost always do, imo) but it was pretty unsatisfying clean, no matter how many different amps I plugged it into or how much I played with the EQ settings on those amps. I was surprised, as I really wanted to like it and had thought that P90s might really work for that style of music. But I really found myself having to fight their P90ness in order to get useful tones for his music, so I'm not sure that Phat Cats, even if they were underwound, would really fit the bill. I think a splittable HB will offer more versatility.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

But a Telecaster -- even a semi-hollow Tele -- is a completely different animal from a 335 or a true jazzbox (archtop). They have a lot of low mids and bass that need taming (especially archtops), especially if he is looking for twang, like a Duane Eddy tone.

On top of that, I wouldn't judge the effectiveness of P90's in a semi-hollow by the P90 imposters they put in a Squier. They probably have ceramic magnets, are probably overwound, and probably wound poorly at that. And besides...it's a SQUIER! It's not gonna sound like an L5!

I stand by my Phat Cat recommendation...

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

I didn't mean to suggest that a Tele and a jazzbox are the same, but it seems to me that if, for a given application, the Duncan Designed P90s in a guitar that has a tendency to sound bright and brittle came out sounding much too dark and muddy (when clean) that putting a P90 into a guitar design that already tends to sound bassy and boomy (though the all-maple construction of the Artcore 75 helps a lot with that) then the result would likely not be satisfactory.

I've loved pretty much every P90 guitar I've ever touched, including the lowly Squier I played yesterday, for playing the sort of music that *I* play. But when I began to evaluate that familiar sound in the terms of of the sort of music that my friend plays, I realized that they just weren't a good choice. As much as I like P90s, I just can't see them as the way to add chime, sparkle, rasp, spank, or the afforementioned airiness and twang to a hollowbody.

The underwinding is an unknown variable for me, though. I admit that. What you suggest might actually work to add the charateristics I describe. But I do know that it would be a damn hard sell to my friend, even with SD's 21 day guarantee.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

I didn't mean to suggest that a Tele and a jazzbox are the same, but it seems to me that if, for a given application, the Duncan Designed P90s in a guitar that has a tendency to sound bright and brittle came out sounding much too dark and muddy (when clean) that putting a P90 into a guitar design that already tends to sound bassy and boomy (though the all-maple construction of the Artcore 75 helps a lot with that) then the result would likely not be satisfactory.

I think you missed part of my point. It's not just any Tele, it's a Squier Tele. Chances are it would make any P90 sound wrong for the sound your friend is looking for.

The other part is that if you want something with more twang than a low-output P90, you're talking Strat/Tele single coil. Humbuckers just aren't going to get you the chime and twang you're looking for, and split humbuckers will be too far in the other direction. There's a reason you don't find a lot of 3.8k ohm pickups around, single coil or humbucker -- they're just too weak.

If you're dead-set on humbuckers, though, the Spin-A-Split mod should really be able to dial in what your friend wants.

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

Thank you.

 

[Zhangliqun]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

Also consider a pickup called Filtertron or TV Jones. These are Gretsch-style pickups and they make one designed to fit a humbucker slot. They're specially designed for the Eddie Cochran or Brian Setzer style twang. I think StewMac sells them but double-check.

 

[St_Genesius]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

I think you're right. I believe I recall seeing them at Stew-Mac once.

 

[Benjy_26]

Re: HBs to emphasize the airiness and twang of a full hollowbody

I pretty much agree with everything zhangligun said about the PC's and the TV'trons.

BTW, I get killer country tones from my Sheraton loaded with Phats, and from my Lester (?!) with Pearly Gates, proving that either a P90 or 'bucker will work for country.