Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
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SirJackdeFuzz
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
I understand what he means by saying the 'Right Way'. And i agree with him.
Regardless of the guitar and pick ups that was used . . .
. . . the SAME guitar, with the SAME pick ups, with the SAME cab and speakers was used for the demo, to eliminate as many variables as possible.
Makes the playing field (so to speak) as equal as possible.
Lets use sports cars as an example.
It is completely useless to say that X-Porsche is faster around a 3 mile race track than X-Ferrari, if X-Ferrari was driven on a completely different 3 mile race track.
Only when you put both sports cars on the SAME race track, with the same driver, and do individual time trails, then you can start to compare them.
In other words eliminate as many variables as possible.
Simple.
I understand what he means by saying the 'Right Way'. And i agree with him.
Regardless of the guitar and pick ups that was used . . .
. . . the SAME guitar, with the SAME pick ups, with the SAME cab and speakers was used for the demo, to eliminate as many variables as possible.
Makes the playing field (so to speak) as equal as possible.
Lets use sports cars as an example.
It is completely useless to say that X-Porsche is faster around a 3 mile race track than X-Ferrari, if X-Ferrari was driven on a completely different 3 mile race track.
Only when you put both sports cars on the SAME race track, with the same driver, and do individual time trails, then you can start to compare them.
In other words eliminate as many variables as possible.
Simple.
Toe-Knee
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
Those DIs were done with emgs and most likely it was a krank cab with v30s or a bogner uberkab going by Lasses usual gear. He will have also thrown a tubescreamer in front of every amp.
Just to point out you can reamp those DI's through any amp and they virtually sound the same regardless. I have used them quite extensively when trialling mods.
To me the main difference in these amps is the feel when playing them.
Also the 5150II/III have a considerable amount more gain and compression.
The SLO & 5150III cut a lot better in a live situation too.
Those DIs were done with emgs and most likely it was a krank cab with v30s or a bogner uberkab going by Lasses usual gear. He will have also thrown a tubescreamer in front of every amp.
Just to point out you can reamp those DI's through any amp and they virtually sound the same regardless. I have used them quite extensively when trialling mods.
To me the main difference in these amps is the feel when playing them.
Also the 5150II/III have a considerable amount more gain and compression.
The SLO & 5150III cut a lot better in a live situation too.
UberMetalDood
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
You're not catching all I'm saying. The settings are not the same on each amp and therefore not the *right way* to do it. Same pickups, agreed. Same cab, agreed. Same speaker, fine. However, there are a few things. Someone said he might have used a tubscreamer. I have many of them and can tell you they do alter the sound and aren't completely transparent. They usually tighten the bass and affect the midrange. Also, the higher a pedals level/vol is set the more it pushes the preamp doesn't it?
Back to EQ though. I have had amps with very active EQ controls, so adjusting one affects another. I have had other amps that seem to only add to each frequency. These amps aren't set to a neutral setting. They are dialed in to sound similar. Moreover, the mids are kind of scooped. Look at how high the presence is set. It's almost all the way up on the Soldano. The bright switch is engaged on the 5150. There's no bright switch to match on the Soldano. It's hard to tell but the bright switch looks off on the 5153.
What's the point of using the same guitar, speaker, etc... if you're going to dial the amps in differently? These things, other than the aforementioned, are where I think the demo went wrong. I see what he was TRYING to do but I don't agree that it was done *right*.
You're not catching all I'm saying. The settings are not the same on each amp and therefore not the *right way* to do it. Same pickups, agreed. Same cab, agreed. Same speaker, fine. However, there are a few things. Someone said he might have used a tubscreamer. I have many of them and can tell you they do alter the sound and aren't completely transparent. They usually tighten the bass and affect the midrange. Also, the higher a pedals level/vol is set the more it pushes the preamp doesn't it?
Back to EQ though. I have had amps with very active EQ controls, so adjusting one affects another. I have had other amps that seem to only add to each frequency. These amps aren't set to a neutral setting. They are dialed in to sound similar. Moreover, the mids are kind of scooped. Look at how high the presence is set. It's almost all the way up on the Soldano. The bright switch is engaged on the 5150. There's no bright switch to match on the Soldano. It's hard to tell but the bright switch looks off on the 5153.
What's the point of using the same guitar, speaker, etc... if you're going to dial the amps in differently? These things, other than the aforementioned, are where I think the demo went wrong. I see what he was TRYING to do but I don't agree that it was done *right*.
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SirJackdeFuzz
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
I totally agree with you on the tubescreamer thing.
Although, i have not read anywhere that the blog posting person did in fact use a pedal of any sort.
Afaik, the pedal thing is just an assumption - not fact.
Getting back to the EQ.
I can not see that it is a problem or even cheating.
I do not care that you have to crank the tone knobs wildly to get one amp to sound similar to another.
What it shows me is, that with enough knob twiddling, you can make amp X, sound like amp A.
And to me, that is all that matters.
If i buy an amp for $800.00, and all it takes is some tone knob adjustment, to make it sound very similar (not a carbon copy, but close) to a $4000.00 Holy Grail amp, then i am very happy.
I totally agree with you on the tubescreamer thing.
Although, i have not read anywhere that the blog posting person did in fact use a pedal of any sort.
Afaik, the pedal thing is just an assumption - not fact.
Getting back to the EQ.
I can not see that it is a problem or even cheating.
I do not care that you have to crank the tone knobs wildly to get one amp to sound similar to another.
What it shows me is, that with enough knob twiddling, you can make amp X, sound like amp A.
And to me, that is all that matters.
If i buy an amp for $800.00, and all it takes is some tone knob adjustment, to make it sound very similar (not a carbon copy, but close) to a $4000.00 Holy Grail amp, then i am very happy.
UberMetalDood
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
It's funny because the other day I saw something on the news about a golf ball that Rory Mcilroy threw in the crowd after he won the British Open last week. Whoever got it apparently sold it on Ebay for like $11,000 or something. Jeez, that kind of money could buy 3 SLO's. Man I have been fortunate enough to own the cream of the crop amps, and to be quite honest with you, I would be happy with a Blackstar Series One or Mesa Boogie or something if I couldn't afford the stuff I've gotten. That being said though, there really is a difference in any of the high-priced amps if you have enough technique to expose it. Every now and then an amp gets built that just seems to get all the right ingredients like the SLO, Ecstasy, Fender 57 Deluxe, JCM800, etc... Guys like Reinhold Bogner and Mike Soldano are so talented that they can do it in every amp they make. Then again, it doesn't matter when inspiration comes because whatever gear you are using when inspiration hits you, it's going to sound good.
I totally agree with you on the tubescreamer thing.
Although, i have not read anywhere that the blog posting person did in fact use a pedal of any sort.
Afaik, the pedal thing is just an assumption - not fact.
Getting back to the EQ.
I can not see that it is a problem or even cheating.
I do not care that you have to crank the tone knobs wildly to get one amp to sound similar to another.
What it shows me is, that with enough knob twiddling, you can make amp X, sound like amp A.
And to me, that is all that matters.
If i buy an amp for $800.00, and all it takes is some tone knob adjustment, to make it sound very similar (not a carbon copy, but close) to a $4000.00 Holy Grail amp, then i am very happy.
It's funny because the other day I saw something on the news about a golf ball that Rory Mcilroy threw in the crowd after he won the British Open last week. Whoever got it apparently sold it on Ebay for like $11,000 or something. Jeez, that kind of money could buy 3 SLO's. Man I have been fortunate enough to own the cream of the crop amps, and to be quite honest with you, I would be happy with a Blackstar Series One or Mesa Boogie or something if I couldn't afford the stuff I've gotten. That being said though, there really is a difference in any of the high-priced amps if you have enough technique to expose it. Every now and then an amp gets built that just seems to get all the right ingredients like the SLO, Ecstasy, Fender 57 Deluxe, JCM800, etc... Guys like Reinhold Bogner and Mike Soldano are so talented that they can do it in every amp they make. Then again, it doesn't matter when inspiration comes because whatever gear you are using when inspiration hits you, it's going to sound good.
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
I havent heard the clips and cant wait to check em. Thanks for the link and info. Now, to throw my .02 into the debate. I have NOT played an slo, so I am going ONLY by what I have read in great detail. YES, Im sure there IS some tonal diff tween the SLO and all the others. Even Mike S said that about the JEt city. They are based on the same circuit, so there there will be tonal differences based on materials. The 5150, was designed to be similar, the Jet city, similar and the 5150 III similar, but with some tweaks over the 5150. The Soldano is going to be smoother and most likely, better in some aspects. The main key Im not seeing mentioned in the debates is cost. The other amps are aimed at the SLO, but they are going to differ someone due to construction. Bottom line, if you want the SLO tone, with no compromises, shell out the big bucks and get the real deal. For cost and accessibility, the others offer a similar tone at a much better pricepoint.
They are close, but obviously there may be some differences.
I havent heard the clips and cant wait to check em. Thanks for the link and info. Now, to throw my .02 into the debate. I have NOT played an slo, so I am going ONLY by what I have read in great detail. YES, Im sure there IS some tonal diff tween the SLO and all the others. Even Mike S said that about the JEt city. They are based on the same circuit, so there there will be tonal differences based on materials. The 5150, was designed to be similar, the Jet city, similar and the 5150 III similar, but with some tweaks over the 5150. The Soldano is going to be smoother and most likely, better in some aspects. The main key Im not seeing mentioned in the debates is cost. The other amps are aimed at the SLO, but they are going to differ someone due to construction. Bottom line, if you want the SLO tone, with no compromises, shell out the big bucks and get the real deal. For cost and accessibility, the others offer a similar tone at a much better pricepoint.
They are close, but obviously there may be some differences.
dystrust
Well-known member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
How are you able to tell it's a Hot Rod? I watched the video and didn't see any shots of the entire front panel of the amp. With the amps you're building you probably know them better than I do (I have played both) and I'm kinda curious how you determined which amp this is.
Regarding SLOs, Hot Rods, and lead circuits, they're supposed to be the same circuit but they sound different. I don't know if it's the custom OT or higher quality components, but SLOs have this amazing, cutting midrange that I just haven't heard in any other amp. I really wish I could get along with a Soldano (I've tried), but my personal sound seems to be a Marshall Jubilee.
How are you able to tell it's a Hot Rod? I watched the video and didn't see any shots of the entire front panel of the amp. With the amps you're building you probably know them better than I do (I have played both) and I'm kinda curious how you determined which amp this is.
Regarding SLOs, Hot Rods, and lead circuits, they're supposed to be the same circuit but they sound different. I don't know if it's the custom OT or higher quality components, but SLOs have this amazing, cutting midrange that I just haven't heard in any other amp. I really wish I could get along with a Soldano (I've tried), but my personal sound seems to be a Marshall Jubilee.
Toe-Knee
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
There are a few reasons how I can tell that it's a Hotrod. Firstly it doesn't have Deyoung transformers which are the only transformers that are ever used in the SLO and secondly I am a big fan of Lasse and I have been following his work for quite some time and he only got a SLO about a year ago which is finished in the traditional boa snakeskin up to that point he had a hotrod that was black which he later recovered in blue snakeskin.
Also regarding the various Soldanos the main differences between them is in the first two gain stages, the power amp filtering and negative feedback and of course the different transformers.
They do all have a family sound but some are distinctly different the Avenger for example can often be more aggressive and raw sounding this is a big part due to it having no effects loop.
There are a few reasons how I can tell that it's a Hotrod. Firstly it doesn't have Deyoung transformers which are the only transformers that are ever used in the SLO and secondly I am a big fan of Lasse and I have been following his work for quite some time and he only got a SLO about a year ago which is finished in the traditional boa snakeskin up to that point he had a hotrod that was black which he later recovered in blue snakeskin.
Also regarding the various Soldanos the main differences between them is in the first two gain stages, the power amp filtering and negative feedback and of course the different transformers.
They do all have a family sound but some are distinctly different the Avenger for example can often be more aggressive and raw sounding this is a big part due to it having no effects loop.
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Johtosotku
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
It is interesting how different amps can be made to sound the same. In fact, I can make all amps sound awful and the same at that. It doesn't mean that they sound the same when they're each dialed to their own optimal tone.
Then there is always how they feel and respond to each individuals playing and guitars.
It is interesting how different amps can be made to sound the same. In fact, I can make all amps sound awful and the same at that. It doesn't mean that they sound the same when they're each dialed to their own optimal tone.
Then there is always how they feel and respond to each individuals playing and guitars.
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
I have an EVH 5150 III Stealth 100s, a Jet City 50w (Chinese Soldano), and recently sold my Peavey 5150 Head w/bias mod. The PEAVEY 5150 had a great lead tone, but it was a 1 Trick pony amp. The EVH 5153 while it doesn't quite have a Fender Clean Channel it is a damn good clean channel, the Blue channel was revised for more gain and mids, and the Red Channel is like the 5150 lead channel, it's a fantastic modern switching amp.
Here is a clip of me playing my wolfgang through my 5153, with my CC loaded Baretta on the lead. Song is only rough mixed and un mastered. The only FX on the guitar are a Roland SDE 3000.
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=57368&d=1410965167
I have an EVH 5150 III Stealth 100s, a Jet City 50w (Chinese Soldano), and recently sold my Peavey 5150 Head w/bias mod. The PEAVEY 5150 had a great lead tone, but it was a 1 Trick pony amp. The EVH 5153 while it doesn't quite have a Fender Clean Channel it is a damn good clean channel, the Blue channel was revised for more gain and mids, and the Red Channel is like the 5150 lead channel, it's a fantastic modern switching amp.
Here is a clip of me playing my wolfgang through my 5153, with my CC loaded Baretta on the lead. Song is only rough mixed and un mastered. The only FX on the guitar are a Roland SDE 3000.
https://forum.seymourduncan.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=57368&d=1410965167
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Shooter.556
New member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
I honestly think of my 5150iii as a half price Soldano Decatone.
My buddy has a Deca and I have played it a bunch, it's probably my favorite amp I have ever played in my life.
It does everything well. My 5150iii sounds pretty much just like it but at half the price.
The Soldano is a better amp don't get me wrong but my EVH nails that vibe.
He is an amp guru and has a room full of cool tube amps so he knows his ****. He said EVH basically had Peavey copy the SLO circuit design because that was the sound in his head.
That has also transferred to the Fender versions. They are pretty much a Soldano copy.
Good for me! I ain't got $3500 to drop on an Decatone head.
Thanks for sharing this! Its my new favorite blog..
I honestly think of my 5150iii as a half price Soldano Decatone.
My buddy has a Deca and I have played it a bunch, it's probably my favorite amp I have ever played in my life.
It does everything well. My 5150iii sounds pretty much just like it but at half the price.
The Soldano is a better amp don't get me wrong but my EVH nails that vibe.
He is an amp guru and has a room full of cool tube amps so he knows his ****. He said EVH basically had Peavey copy the SLO circuit design because that was the sound in his head.
That has also transferred to the Fender versions. They are pretty much a Soldano copy.
Good for me! I ain't got $3500 to drop on an Decatone head.
Thanks for sharing this! Its my new favorite blog..
Gearjoneser
Gear Ho
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
This is one reason I don't base anything on clips or opinions from newbs.
The primary place where guitar sound quality is tested, besides the recorded tone, is in the feel. Fans of youtube clips and modeling amps totally miss this.
Skilled guitarists and owners of every style of amps are the only people who's opinions matter in these comparisons.
This is one reason I don't base anything on clips or opinions from newbs.
The primary place where guitar sound quality is tested, besides the recorded tone, is in the feel. Fans of youtube clips and modeling amps totally miss this.
Skilled guitarists and owners of every style of amps are the only people who's opinions matter in these comparisons.
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Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
I used to have a 5150 (first run), modded to be as close to an SLO as possible. I now have an SLO. Different worlds, truly. The SLO is a ton less gritty. It's not smooth. No, it's simply 'not gritty'. Very saturated lead tones, superb cleans. Really best of both worlds for me. It became my favorite in an instant. I could never handle the 5150III, though. Just felt and sounded 'cheap' for some reason.
I used to have a 5150 (first run), modded to be as close to an SLO as possible. I now have an SLO. Different worlds, truly. The SLO is a ton less gritty. It's not smooth. No, it's simply 'not gritty'. Very saturated lead tones, superb cleans. Really best of both worlds for me. It became my favorite in an instant. I could never handle the 5150III, though. Just felt and sounded 'cheap' for some reason.
dystrust
Well-known member
Re: Heh, SLO/5150/5150-III comparo
That really depends on how you define 'the goods'. It certainly sounds great with the master on 5 and that's really loud, but it also has an excellent master volume. It'll sound good with the master on 1 but gets gradually better as you open it up, provided that you don't run the preamp gain too hot. Above about 6.5-7 it gets so saturated and compressed that the tone really doesn't change much as you turn it up.
That really depends on how you define 'the goods'. It certainly sounds great with the master on 5 and that's really loud, but it also has an excellent master volume. It'll sound good with the master on 1 but gets gradually better as you open it up, provided that you don't run the preamp gain too hot. Above about 6.5-7 it gets so saturated and compressed that the tone really doesn't change much as you turn it up.
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