HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

[greekdude]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

oh well sorry greekdude, I didn't see your post till I redid my neck. I used my double edge crowning file again, and I noticed after I had applied black sharpy that I must not have finished crowning my frets when I started polishing last night. it took awhile but a finally got them crowned properly, then I used a sponge with 400 grit sand paper underneath it thinking the sponge would help keep equal pressure and conform to the PROPERLY crowned frets. then I did the same with 600 grit, 800 grit, 1000 grit, 1200 grit, 1600 grit then I used 0000 steel wool. now the frets are great nice and smooth when I do my bends, intonation is correct, and the guitar plays better then new. I have my action set at 0.06 approx. where used to have to set it approx. 0.1 to not have buzz. I do have a little relief in my neck approx. 0.005. and it plays great. thanks guys for giving me the insight and help to do my first fret level.

where/how do you measure action height and relief ?
PS
it just feels good to do your guitars, doesn't it

 

[greekdude]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

You can find very high grit sanding pads at hobby shops. Well up past 12000. Little square ones in packages that go through several grades. Maybe 1-1/2"x1-1/2".

Also, I might've missed this, but isn't there a file to use to crown with? Does anyone have a resource for that? Or even a entire file kit meant for this purpose that won't fund Dan Erlewine's video budget.

i have a steel one, that costed about 30 euros, it does its job, but leaves a rather harsh surface. I guess the diamond one does a better job. But if a man will do that 3-4 times in his life, 30 euros are justified, 100 not so. The diamond aims a more professional target i guess.

 

[jackson111]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

hey greekdude, i don't know if this is corrct but it's how i always set up my guitars, i measure the relief with the strings on and tuned up, then i take my straightedge lay it down the center of the neck between the D and G strings, and i use a set of feeler gauges and check around the 7th to 9th fret (out of my 4 guitars the max relief point seems to be different but usually on the 7th 8th or 9th frets). as far as action height i use a small machinist pocket rule that is measured in 1/32" and place it on the top of the 12th fret and check every string. i see how low a can get them without fret buzz. i like my action as low as i can get, just seems to be easier for me to play and the intonation seems to be easier to set and seems to stay more stable at low action.

 

[DreX]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

Loosely on topic, another big factor in getting low action is the nut height. I have to admit I neglected it for a long time, sort of assuming the factory set up was adequate, until I got an HH Tele with a very high nut, and at that point the obvious finally occurred to me, that if you put a capo on the first fret and the guitar is much easier to play, then there's no reason the nut can't be lowered to a similar extent. You really should have a feeler gauge on hand to monitor what you're doing, though.

 

[uOpt]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

A couple tips from experience:

• Be careful not to level the middle of the frets more than the outside
• Protect the nut. It is easy to knock off a Les Paul nut or chip a Strat nut
• The level is easy, the work comes in with the crowning
• Use non-magnetic "steel" wool if one of your steps involves that grade
• I use masking tape for the frets while I use chemicals such as metal polish or the steel wool. It is quicker to move a pair of tape strips than to mask the whole fretboard first. You can move each strip a couple of times. I use double or triple thickness strips

Keep in mind that as you lower the frets you could lower the nut without snarl, if you want to fulfill the dream of lowest combined action enabled by the now-level frets. However, cutting nut slots not too deep is an art of its own.

 

[DreX]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

[*]I use masking tape for the frets while I use chemicals such as metal polish or the steel wool. It is quicker to move a pair of tape strips than to mask the whole fretboard first. You can move each strip a couple of times. I use double or triple thickness strips

I tried this once, but it seemed like more work to continuously move the tape from fret to fret.

 

[greekdude]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

hey greekdude, i don't know if this is corrct but it's how i always set up my guitars, i measure the relief with the strings on and tuned up, then i take my straightedge lay it down the center of the neck between the D and G strings, and i use a set of feeler gauges and check around the 7th to 9th fret (out of my 4 guitars the max relief point seems to be different but usually on the 7th 8th or 9th frets). as far as action height i use a small machinist pocket rule that is measured in 1/32" and place it on the top of the 12th fret and check every string. i see how low a can get them without fret buzz. i like my action as low as i can get, just seems to be easier for me to play and the intonation seems to be easier to set and seems to stay more stable at low action.

your relief seems almost right for a guitar aimed at low action, but your actual action height not so. I mean if you like, then by all means keep it there, but i have lower than 1.5mm (0.06") in my shred guitars at the @24th fret. So if light picking and tapping is how you play, then you can get lower than that.
1.5mm at the 12th fret is e.g. the official Ibanez factory spec. Very few guitars will buzz that high.

 

[greekdude]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

Loosely on topic, another big factor in getting low action is the nut height. I have to admit I neglected it for a long time, sort of assuming the factory set up was adequate, until I got an HH Tele with a very high nut, and at that point the obvious finally occurred to me, that if you put a capo on the first fret and the guitar is much easier to play, then there's no reason the nut can't be lowered to a similar extent. You really should have a feeler gauge on hand to monitor what you're doing, though.

+1

 

[Ayrton]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

1.5mm (.060) is "high"...lol

I usually set my guitars between .060 and .070 (12th) with the relief set to a max of .010

 

[Securb]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

It is harder than using a cap lock button

 

[darthphineas]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

It is harder than using a cap lock button

I'm getting my attorney on the line so I can trademark the CAP LOCK.

 

[jackson111]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

Ok so I must be seting my action to high. I will try to lower it some more. I have noticed that I needed to take the nut down. It is hard to play anything on the first fret.

 

[Archer250]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

1.5mm (.060) is "high"...lol





I usually set my guitars between .060 and .070 (12th) with the relief set to a max of .010

lol you should see mine: relief of .011-12, action around 2.1-2.5mm 12th fret.



I never have to endure buzz.

The trick is to find a sweet spot where your fingers like it best. Some people aim for the lowest possible action, and I respect their decision.

Action is pretty much compromise. You gotta give and take SOMETHING. High action will make bending easier and make the tone more airy, but will rob intonation and will tire your fingers. Low action will limit your picking hand and your bending capabilities. Medium action (like mine) will balance between both, but each man's balance is not equal to his peers'.

 

[jackson111]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

ok i must have miss read the post. ayrton we pretty much set our guitars up close to being the same. i usually want tolerate a guitar that i have to have more then 0.06 at the 12th fret or needs more relief then 0.010. i usually like the neck a straight as possible. maybe me but it seems like i get better sustain from a straighter neck. when playing my cheap little washburn last night i did notice that it plays great between the 4th fret to about the 17th, it takses way to much force to play on the 1st fret, so i am sure i need to cut the nut grooves deeper. all in all not bad for a 150.00 guitar after i gutted it and re did all the electronics, and put in the SD pickups. the neck is still a little funny though, the relief point on the neck seems to be between around the 7th fret which to me seems a little high, i would like it about the 9th, but it is what it is

 

[Ayrton]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

String tension can do funny things to a neck. Especially with thinner or import necks. There is no right or wrong with string action or set up, just find something that works for you. While most of my guitars fall into the range I posted above, I do have some that are down in the .040 range and just seem to like it there.

While you hear people say "I get it as low as I can", I actually try to get it as high as I can play comfortably with. To my ears it sounds better, and I don't like buzz.

 

[DreX]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

so i am sure i need to cut the nut grooves deeper.

WAIT WAIT WAIT.. why not file down the nut from the bottom? Cutting into the grooves themselves should only be done if you believe that specific string are too high, or maybe if the nut is stuck in place with a whole bottle of glue, but then that means if you screw up the string slots, you have no recourse, and so I'd take it to a pro at that point, if for not other reason that to transfer the liability on to them.

 

[darthphineas]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

Or just take the nut off and file down the nut shelf. Oh, wait...that works well on a FR nut. Not every one here enjoys the 100% benefit and 0% downside to a FR rig? No way....I don't believe it. Next you'll tell me that there a players that don't like a middle humbuckers. Insanity, I tell you. Insanity.

 

[jackson111]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

Ok good idea. I also have a Jackson dinky I think a dkm2 made in japan that can not be adjusted any lower because the floyd rose is bottomed out on the pocket and it plays beautfully

 

[darthphineas]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

Of the bridge is bottomed out, consider a shim at the heel of the neck.

Some dudes use sandpaper. Some use business cards. I get the thin brass strips from the hobby shop or the hardware store. Different widths and thickness. Figure out what works for you.

I have a Hamer with a Schaller trem and the nut on it needed a shim. Figured out the size and got some of that brass to use to make a shim.

 

[greekdude]

Re: HOW HARD IS IT TO LEVEL FRETS?

1.5mm (.060) is "high"...lol

I usually set my guitars between .060 and .070 (12th) with the relief set to a max of .010

you wont find many shredders playing that high. Only some over aged blues players who think they get bigger tone.