How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

[Casey Jones]

Hey,

So like the title says I got a strat body that I got painted in a very nice green by a professional auto body guy. Problem was that he didn't put a clear coat on it, so I was left to do that on my own. I did that and everything looks good until final sand and polish. I sanded with 1000 grit (might be my first mistake) and used mother swirl remover (possibly second mistake) which left a residue on it even after buffing a lot. So I used quick detailer to get the residue off which it did but it seemed to take away the nicely buffed and:smokin: polished shine.

My questions are:

What type of clear coat should I use in this application (with automotive paint base) and where should I get it?

Should I wax it to get that thick clear coat finish look?

The 1500 grit sandpaper didn't seem like it was doing anything for the orange peel which is why I resorted to using 1000, was that a mistake?

I'm thinking of sanding a couple layers back and re clear coating it, the finish looked best after a fresh layer of clear, but when start sanding, buffing, and polishing to a perfect shiny glass smooth finish it looks a little matte and not so polished.

I wonder if this is an easy fix, or should I re clear this thing?

Cheers.

 

[rumblebox]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

the enamel you used is probably so hard you just have to sand more than normal to take down the orange peel.

photos?

 

[Bfeeney]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

Use 1500 and wet sand it. it will take much longer but I've made the impatient mistakes and ended up repainting the whole thing. PATIENTS IS A VIRTUE!!! If you don't have a bunch of sand scratches the buffing compound will do a better, faster job at shining it up.

All my guitars I painted and cleared with automotive paints, and I'm sure other paints are the same, you have to wait a month to wax it so it can cure.

 

[kramersteen]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

My questions are:

What type of clear coat should I use in this application (with automotive paint base) and where should I get it?

Should I wax it to get that thick clear coat finish look?

The 1500 grit sandpaper didn't seem like it was doing anything for the orange peel which is why I resorted to using 1000, was that a mistake?

I'm thinking of sanding a couple layers back and re clear coating it, the finish looked best after a fresh layer of clear, but when start sanding, buffing, and polishing to a perfect shiny glass smooth finish it looks a little matte and not so polished.

I wonder if this is an easy fix, or should I re clear this thing?

Cheers.

Acrylic lacquer

You can wax but only at the very end once the clear is on and its cut and buffed.

You can use 1000 if you want, I think your problem is you havent wet sanded or as i do kerosene rub back

My guess is if you did a good job on the clear coating a good cutting compound and a circular motion in small areas using a damp rag will bring out a nice shine.

Don't use that wax if you plan on putting more clear on.

 

[Casey Jones]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

Okay so I should clarify, the 1000 grit was wet sand. When I buffed it using mothers swirl remover it shined pretty good, but when I wiped the excess away with quick detailer the shine went with it. I don't have a problem with scratches or swirls, only the final pop of the clear coat isn't coming through like I want it to. I I suppose that I just need to do this process many more times?

What does it mean to cut it? I waited a good few days before I started wet sanding and buffing. I buffed by hand and a globe pad for the inside of the horns, my next purchase will be a buffer and a foam pad and repeat these steps I've already done. Is that going to give me the final desired effect or do I need to wax as well?

This close up looks okay, but you'll tell from the next photo that it's still a bit dull looking.


There is no orange peel effect, only not getting it to shine.

 

[DankStar]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

cool color

 

[Casey Jones]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

cool color

Thanks,

I just really want to get the most out of it.

:smokin:

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

Looks to me like the paint/lacquer is going on too dry. You won't get a glassy-looking gloss unless the surface is perfectly flat. Fine-sanding can only remove so much without damaging the paintwork.

Clean the job with naptha and shoot a few more clear coats ... if you're using rattle cans, experiment on something to establish the best spraying distance where the finish looks wet, not powdery, when it hits the job surface.

When you do the wet sanding (start with 1200 if you feel confident, but still work very lightly and carefully), work in an area that gives you good natural daylight but have a good worklamp available also. As you take the top of the finish away with the paper, the surface will go matte ... any tiny glossy areas that remain are low points. When all those little glossy dots have disappeared, you can then progressively work through finer grades of paper, i.e. 1500, 2,000, 2500 and 3000. Each grade will remove the scratches left by the previous grade.

Then use an automotive cutting compound (fine) and finish off with a swirl remover.

For small jobs like guitar bodies, working by hand is probably prefereable to using some kind of machine ... you can work more slowly and keep an eye on the progress. A machine can take too much material too quickly, esp around corners and edges.

Most importantly, this stuff takes time, and you will need to excercise great patience. Never set yourself a 'completion date' for this kind of work ... it takes as long as it takes, which is usually longer than you'd expect.

Oh, and forget about wax at this stage. Any forms of silicon are your enemy right now. Even your own fingerprints are your enemy. Work cleanly and keep the job free of contaminants by washing it down with naptha often, and keep your hands clean when sanding.

 

[Casey Jones]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

Ah I see, I'm using a spray gun, and when I went over with 1500 grit wet it barely did the job that's why I used 1000. The surface is pretty smooth though, and the clear looks great when I spray it on, it just doesn't smooth out as easily as I hoped. Thanks for the tips, I'll use this as a reference when I go back to re spray the clear coat.

Cheers!

 

[crusty philtrum]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

With a spray gun, you can experiment with the mix between the clear and the thinners. I usually start with a couple of mist coats and then move on to heavier coats to build the thickness. But i finish off with a couple of coats using more thinners and less clear. In fact my last coat is often close to being straight thinners. The spraying conditions also play a large part in the 'off the gun' finish, as well as distance between gun and object being sprayed. Obviously the less orange peel you can generate with the gun, the less work there is to be done afterwards. If conditions are creating coarse orange peel, then build up a thicker finish to allow for the amount of material that will have to be removed to level the surface.

Think of the finish as being like the surface of a golf ball .... basically flat but with dimples all over. The task is to eliminate the dimples by levelling the surface, but still having enough thickness once the high areas have been levelled down to the lowest levels, i.e. the bottom of the dimples.

The clear will look good when you first apply it, as will a solid colour. It's only when you observe it closely when the paint is dry that you begin to see the tiny imperfections, and it is those details that you have to attend to in order to get the mirror-like finish. If you hold your hand in front of a finish and observe the reflection of your fingers, you may notice that the edges of the reflections are not sharp, but slightly fuzzy. When the surface is levelled so all imperfections are removed, (and when the shine is restored with cutting compound), the edges of the reflections will be razor-sharp, just as they would be if seen in a mirror. Imperfections (low spots) become immediately apparent as soon as you knock the gloss off with the first application of abrasive paper ... the high areas will be matte, the low areas will still be glossy.

 

[scottish]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

With a spray gun, you can experiment with the mix between the clear and the thinners. I usually start with a couple of mist coats and then move on to heavier coats to build the thickness. But i finish off with a couple of coats using more thinners and less clear. In fact my last coat is often close to being straight thinners. The spraying conditions also play a large part in the 'off the gun' finish, as well as distance between gun and object being sprayed.

Very very important points. Especially the last few coats being much more thinned. Also, for bringing out the shine i would use a buffing compound and wheel. Make sure the compound is recommended for whatever lacquer base you are using. You can do it by hand, its just a hell of a lot more work.

Also, what spray system are you using? A pro spray gun or something like the stewmac preval spray cans? If its the cans then its a lot more work.

 

[GuitarDoc]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

Some good advice from Crusty.

However, depending on how uneven the clearcoat surface is, I'll start wet-sanding with 600 grit, then 800, 1000, 1200, 1500, then 2000. Sometimes I may even use 4000 and 6000 grit papers. Then I polish with medium and fine polishing pastes, and finish with swirl remover. This gives me a flat-smooth mirror finish.

In those areas that can't be effectively polished, I use small "Micro-Mesh" foam polishing pads to get to a mirror finish. I go through the entire range of 1500, 1800, 2400, 3200, 3600, 4000, 6000, 8000, and 12,000.

This is a lot of work, and indeed patience is a virtue, but it results in a perfect glass finish every time.

The very fine grit sandpapers, polishing paste, and the Micro-Mesh pads were all purchased from StewMac.

 

[AlexR]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

^ This is good advice too.

The other issue is how long has the clear been drying for? You often need a few weeks for it to firm up properly/sink/settle before you commence sanding and buffing.
When sanding you want the paper to do the work. Soak wet 'n dry for 24 hours in water before use to soften it. You should use each grade and press lightly so the paper works without big scratches. The low grits are for removing the surface imperfections, the higher grits for removing the scratches left by the previous grit.

 

[kramersteen]

Re: How to get the perfect shiny finish using automotive paint

With a spray gun, you can experiment with the mix between the clear and the thinners. I usually start with a couple of mist coats and then move on to heavier coats to build the thickness. But i finish off with a couple of coats using more thinners and less clear. In fact my last coat is often close to being straight thinners.

That's pretty common practice with straight thinners. When my dad taught me he called it ''wetting it in'' It really helps.

Crustical You should do a tutorial.

I would but i'm too lazy.