How to - P90 in series out of phase

[396Peter]

Hi Guys, I have a puzzle, or at least to me it is.

Here is the set up:
Two P90's
One Volume
one Tone
Three way toggle

Desired configuration:
Bridge Pup
Neck Pup
Neck/Bridge Series and Out of Phase

I've been able to get the pups out of phase by way of a DPDT pull pot on the volume pot. But I have not been able to wrap my mind around how to get them in series too.

Ideally, the toggle would go like this:
Position 1- Bridge
Position 2- N&B series/out of phase
Position 3- Neck

Pups are two wire.

Thoughts or recommendations?

 

[Artie]

It can be done, but, you'd need a 4PDT switch, since the phase and series are two different functions. Also, on a 2-wire pup, one pups cover will be hanging on the "hot" side of the circuit. Could be a problem if you touch it while playing.

Do these P-90's have metal covers?

P.S. Does this have an "LP-style" toggle?

 

[eclecticsynergy]

I'm not aware of a 4PDT that'll fit in place of a regular three-way toggle. Doesn't mean they don't exist, though.

I think your best bet would be one of the Freeway switches. They're the right size.
And they offer six positions; you could probably wire up a few extra options that way, if you chose to...

 

[396Peter]

These are soap bar P90's with plastic covers.

The toggle is a LP style toggle.

THe guitar is a semi hollow T style with all the controls grouped together in proximity to the output jack.

Switchcraft makes a DPDT (NC)/DPDT(NC) LP style toggle.

https://www.switchcraft.com/dpdt-nc-dpdt-nc-right-angle-nickel-finish-welded-silver-contacts/12015x/

My preferred solution would be to incorporate the feature into the toggle but the reality may be that I will need two DPDT pull pots which is fine as well.

Right now I am able to get them out of phase (with a caveat). I did have the DPDT originally configured to put them in series but found the result to be muddy and lacking clarity. My thought is the by throwing them out of phase prior to putting them in series would add some thickness to an otherwise ultra thin out of phase sound.

 

[freefrog]

Ideally, the toggle would go like this:
Position 1- Bridge
Position 2- N&B series/out of phase
Position 3- Neck

It's doable with an ON/OFF/ON 3 ways switch. Botched pic below, with twice the same schematic in 2 versions, just to be clear (?). FWIW.

 

[396Peter]

It's doable with an ON/OFF/ON 3 ways switch. Botched pic below, with twice the same schematic in 2 versions, just to be clear (?). FWIW.

Alright. This looks promising. I'm just not completely clear how the bridge wires into the schematic.

 

[freefrog]

Alright. This looks promising. I'm just not completely clear how the bridge wires into the schematic.

Doesn't matter IMHO. If it's enabled in the "wrong" direction of the switch, turning the switch upside down should solve the issue.

 

[396Peter]

Doesn't matter IMHO. If it's enabled in the "wrong" direction of the switch, turning the switch upside down should solve the issue.

Ok, I'll give it a try. Thank you for your idea.

 

[Gstring]

You can actually get combined OOP and series with just one push pull . I have posted the diagram on this forum several times. The small issue is that when p p is engaged the wiring works when selector, switch is in position one (neck pu) and selecting bridge gives you a kill switch. .Some might consider this a bonus.

 

[MikeS]

You don't need a switch to get these out of phase - since you're not trying to get them in phase, just wire one of the pickups backwards.

The diagram freefrog put together is a typical north/series/south diagram for humbuckers, if you want some other Google terms to search for. This can be done with either an on-off-on SPDT or an on-on-on DPDT. The trick is going to be finding one the same size as a LP toggle. Note, this switch is in place of the LP toggle, not in addition to it.

Here's a cleaner diagram for a on-off-on SPDT:
https://guitarelectronics.com/north-coil-humbucker-south-coil/​
​​​​​​In place of the wiring descriptions in the diagram in the above link, substitute as follows:
North-Start = Neck Hot
North-Finish = Neck Ground
South-Finish = Bridge "Ground" (the original ground, which will be now connected to output).
South Start = Bridge "Hot" (the original hot lead, which will not be connected to ground).

 

[MikeS]

I don't know why that link isn't working, and forum software won't let me edit the post. Copy/paste that link into a Google search and it will be the first search return.