HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

J

JavSanz

New member
I’d like to mod a SD little 59 single coil sized humbucker in the bridge. I have an SSS MIM strat, which has extra space for humbucker under the hood. There are many diagrams out there but have not seen some of the options I’m thinking all together. Here’s my wish list:
• Keep it simple and low budget: I was considering Fender S-1 and 5 way superswitches but would rather keep to Gilmour type recessed mini switch and/or tone pot blending to cover the options.
• Keep classical strat SSS 5-way switching as base option, with the bridge being either the Lil59 in parallel, or one of its two coils split (not sure which would sound best on its own)
• Have full humbucker in series
• Have a Telecaster style mode: neck plus bridge (either humbucker in parallel or single coil as above)
• Any other sounds than the above would be optional and nice to have, like in or out of phase, 3 pickups at once, etc.
• Another nice to have: have separate tone control for each of the humbucker pickups, one of which would be shared with the single coils. If too complex, then at least one tone for neck and middle single coils, the other for the bridge HB. Also, considering converting one or both of the tone pots to no load, to leave the HB cleaner sounding at 10. Is it worth it and easy to do with existing ones?

To turn on and off one of the two coils, I’ve thought to use a recessed Gilmour mini switch, but to leave the looks as unspoilt as possible I also thought to use one tone pot to blend in the second pickup in the bridge humbucker (probably the one furthest from bridge). Disengaged , I’d have normal 5 way position Strat with single coil, and when engaged, the second coil is activated on top of all other 5 positions. So this means that in every position, you have the option to blend in / switch on one of the pickups from the bridge, so you can combine it with the rest. What I don't know is if should be in series or parallel, etc.

The above doesn’t give me the option of having the bridge in parallel though, it would be a single coil split when not using the humbucker in ‘full HB’ series mode. So I’m open to suggestions to use a combination of an on-on-on mini switch and a tone knob to give me the best part or all of my wish list above.

I attach some pics of the current setup, with my current SSS normal wiring and before installing the new pickup or any switches or mods. Any help would be appreciated, ideally clear schematics and explanations of polarities, etc. I only have basic knowledge of electronics and soldering so be gentle!
 

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Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

this sounds like a fun project. I'll start with some suggestions and we can take it from there. Once everything is figured out I'll happily draw something out as I have a few hours to kill today.

Alright so one suggestion you mentioned how you wanted parallel in position 2. Perhaps an "autosplit" mod in position 2 seeing as you've got a standard 5 way blade. This would make position 2 sound like a strat by turning half the bridge humbucker off and pairing it with the single coil in the middle assuming it's still the original 2 wire single coil in the middle when the project is done. For reference the Ibanez RG guitars that are HSH tend to have this such as the RG350 and the steve vai jem.

I like the idea of what you describe as the "telecaster option". Guitar wirings usually call this the 7 way mod. Very simple to wire up like David's black strat. We can achieve this either with a mini toggle similar to David or a blend. It's entirely up to you. As much as I love the idea to blend the pickup in the way I play anyways I would just have it on full blast. But let me know what works best for you.

for the most versatility I'd suggest a bridge/neck tone as well as a middle tone by itself, however if you want for this for example it's an easy thing to do
neck - tone 1
bridge / middle - tone 2

now if you wire up the tone control what premier guitar calls the 1950s method it'll give you some extra brightness and clarity. It'll save you 20$ or so from buying two no load fender potentiometers

The super 5 way switch or S1 can offer a lot of sounds but all of this is doable without so far. Any other suggestions or questions about the wiring let me know. There is plenty of wiring experts on here to help you out.
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Thanks for the quick response! Yes, an auto split mode would be great, but wasn’t sure how it would work with the idea I had of having a dedicated always on or always off pickup from the bridge, regardless of the 5 way switch position. I also prefer the mini switch than the blend but perhaps they can be used in unison for two different things? Eg can I use the switch for series vs parallel HB, and the tone knob to blend in one of the neck pickups regardless of everything else?
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Not a problem. You could pair a 7 way mod (bridge or neck pickup in any position) with the autotap mod. I'd add the bridge pickup to any of the positions because it would add some extra power and still retaining the hum cancellation on paper anyways. I've spent most of my time with 2 humbucker guitars.

For blending pickups in perhaps try the Dan Armstrong wiring below. You gain a master tone control which you could wire the 1950s les paul way which is not in the diagram. in some ways superior to the way tone controls are hooked up on guitars today. No additional switches or anything. It's attached at the bottom. Not the video that's another idea to try on the same subject. The best approach I think would be to add a coilsplit with a push pull pot. This way you achieve an extra tone as well as the ability to use both tone controls any way you feel. If you would prefer a blend knob instead of the 7 way mod we could.

with the 7 way mod there would be hum in position 5 where the bridge and neck are together, whether there is a coilsplit on or not because
with the humbucker / neck single coil - it's an odd amount of coils
with the coilsplit on the humbucker / neck single coil - both coils are going the same way so no hum cancellation.

Right now I'm just throwing some ideas around to see what works best for you. Once that is done I'll draw you out a diagram


This is one strat wiring I'm thinking of trying next as well as some other cool basic strat wiring concepts.
 
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Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

I’m getting a bit confused by the options! I personally would rather not have a push pull pot, had one in the past and didn’t like it. I’d rather stick with current pots and perhaps a mini switch.

I found this online, looks like option 6, dial a tap for HSS, is close to what I’m thinking

http://www.guitar-mod.com/strat.html

It blends in the screw coil with a no load blend pot (I could convert mine or get one) and a switch for neck on-off (I originally thought to have this for the bridge)

Anyone has experience doing this or improving on it? What this wouldn’t have is parallel or series selection on the HB, or of course separate tones per pickup.

Where I’m leaning towards, if anyone can tell me if it’s possible, is this:

Normal volume knob

Tone 1 bridge (convert to no load for brighter HB if needed?)

Tone 2 neck and middle

3 way mini switch with following positions (1 is closest to bridge)
- 1 HB in series
- 2 HB in parallel
- 3 One coil from the bridge always on, the be able to mix in parallel with the other pickups with the 5 way

The above would be coupled with the auto switch mod for the 5 way switch

1. Bridge on HB series, HB parallel or single depending on 3 way switch position
2. Middle in parallel with bridge single (auto switch) or in series with bridge single if mini switch in on 3
3. Middle only, or in series with bridge if mini switch is on 3
4. Neck and middle in parallel, adding bridge in series if mini switch is on 3
4. Neck only, or in series with bridge if mini switch is on 3

If this makes sense and is doable, I’d appreciate some schematics as I’d like to do this weekend!!

Thanks all
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

On second thoughts I’d like to simplify the control, and not have too many switching options. I think a two way mini Gilmour style switch should cover most of what I need.

The mini switch would essentially turn on or off one of the two bridge pickups (the one closest to the neck). So in position 2 of the mini, it would be fully SSS strat 5 way style, the bridge being the single coil near the bridge and the other pickup off. Position 1 would activate the other pickup in series with any other pickup that is selected with the 5 way. This way I forego having the HB in parallel on its own but can do without that.

Description below:

Tone 1 for both bridge pickups (convert to no load tone pot)

Tone 2 for middle and neck pickups

Mini switch pos 1 towards bridge (classic strat mode) with the following 5 way switch options:
1 - single coil closest to bridge
2 - single bridge coil + middle in parallel
3- middle
4- middle + neck in parallel
5 - neck

Mini switch pos 2 towards neck (alternative mode) with the following in the 5 way switch:
1- both bridge coils in series
2- both bridge coils in series + middle in series
3- single bridge coil (closest to neck) + middle in series
4- single bridge coil (closest to neck) + middle + neck in series
5- single bridge coil (closest to neck) + neck in series

Some of the above may sound muddy, so thoughts on improving these are welcome.

Is this easy to do? I’d appreciate your help with wiring diagrams!
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

I agree though about push pulls the more I use them the less I like them. I just bought about 10 super 5 way switches myself. For the wiring and all your questions I'll break it up into points so it's easier to digest as usual. Today was a long day so I didn't realize you replied.

The important thing is we're getting close to finding something you're after. Parallel on a lil 59 pickup. The regular SH-1 (59) starts off at 8k DC resistance and about 4H of inductance. Going to parallel would give you approximately 25% of the output of the pickup. It's not set in stone and DC resistance doesn't tell us everything but 8k becoming 2k you're left with pretty much a clean channel. Some may love it, some may hate it.

For the first question to convert a pot to no load is a difficult task, you'd have to take the cover off of a pot with a flat screw driver and apply clear nail polish or krazy glue. It's much better to do the 1950s switch mod. As this would send the pickup selection to the input jack without the capacitor. The 1950s switch mod is only one extra wire to the volume pot. Super simple to do.

For tone 2 as in the one closest to the input jack right?

Now mixing a "SSP" (series / split / parallel) wiring with the autosplit mod your best bet is to just get the mini toggle to do all the work. It's much easier to wire and no spots on the guitar that would produce no sound. Going to google a secondary way to approach this because there is a risk that the 59 may be out of phase with the single coil in the middle. I haven't worked on a guitar with single coils in a while so anyone who wants to chime in go for it.

and yeah we can add the 7 way mod easily to the series / split / parallel wiring. You'll need an on/on/on mini toggle. There is two types of on/on/on is the only down side. Luckily they are easy to differentiate with a multimeter.
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Thanks for the reply. Anywhere I can find the schematics for all this then? I guess it’s a mix of 3 way switch with 50s tone wiring, but I’m not familiar enough to do myself from scratch


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Alright so idea one
since you're not a fan of push pulls this will do the trick. This uses a "type 2" on/on/on switch. If you got a "type 1" I'll show you how to tell the difference if you got a multimeter. I haven't drawn out a blend diagram in 5+ years so I had to do a bit of googling. I'd probably approach this a bit differently but this is how they say it'll work. Oddly enough it was another premier guitar article that reassured me of this. Dirk has written a lot of great articles how to mod guitars.
https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/28921-mod-garage-the-blender-7-sound-stratocaster

master volume
master tone - all 3 pickups - Gibson 1950s style wiring - any capacitor value, 0.01uf - 0.022uf values I'd suggest.
blend knob - blends the bridge pickup into any position - similar to the 7 way mod but knob wise.
on/on/on mini toggle - series / coilsplit / parallel
standard 5 way blade

with tone capacitors
the higher the value the warmer the guitar and stronger the cut of frequencies as you turn towards 0. A good example of higher is 0.047uf (47nf) or 0.1uf (100nf)
the lower the value like 0.022uf (22nf) to 0.01uf (10nf) the less compressed the guitar gets , yet the less frequencies you cut as you go towards 0.
the worst thing people can do is buy overpriced or "Vintage" capacitors. It's not a hifi sound system or tube amp with a lot of heat and electricity. Anything besides ceramic or MLCC capacitors will do a good job. Polyester like squiers use are fine. I could buy a bag of them for the price of an orange drop and measure one out that is say 10nf.

Now assuming the on/on/on mini toggle you get working, if you coilsplit the bridge pickup and pair it with the middle pickup in position 2 and it hums.
change the pickups colors from
black to white
and
red to green
so white will be going to the switch , red will be ground

if you get anything that sounds out of phase (nasally, hollow, almost wah like) that is fixed by changing the color code on the bridge pickup on the switch like so.
black to green
white to red
this is some of the better examples of out of phase I've seen the guys a bit of a talker but very insightful

this is the first concept. No wires are soldered together unless you see black squares.


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Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Thanks again for the help. Which pickup would the tone pot blend in? Would it be best to make this tone pot no load to remove from circuit when it's on 10 and get full pickup sound?

In any case, is there an easy mod as I mentioned in post #6 just with one mini switch to activate one pickup always on - off, and keep both tone pots for tone?
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

if you did go with a no load tone pot, use it as the middle pot only. It's advantage is to de-activate the capacitor completely, when 9 and below it's your standard tone control. This will also increase your pickups resonant peak (brightness). It's a nice improvement.

However the way the tone capacitor is hooked up on 1959 gibson les pauls is a very good option in it's own ways. Premier guitar describes it as "the tone getting stronger, a smoother volume drop" the only down side is that when you turn the volume down the tone goes with it too. I keep everything at 10 so this isn't a deal breaker for me.

alright so the mini toggle is a type 2 on/on/on , it would make the bridge pickup go series, it would split the coil and go parallel depending on your position. There is 4 ways to approach this. Sounds scary or complicated but depending on the way the magnet is in the middle pickup and the direction of the coils in position 2. Best case scenarios. Position 2 with the bridge pickup in series will not be out of phase. Thin and nasally like that youtube video of the guy rocking out on a bunch of guitars with it. Now splitting the coil to get the little 59 to turn into a single coil, best case scenario is no hum as it should replicate position 2 on a strat. Whoever has more experience with this feel free to jump in and recommend the best approach for the colors in case anything happens.

The blend knob (bottom knob near the jack) would put the bridge pickup into any position. Turn it towards 0 and it adds the bridge pickup to the extra positions. Brejatoneworks I realized had a diagram on this subject too. Don's wirings have always been really reliable.

sound good or how can this be better?
 
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Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

I’m still a bit lost with these options sorry! Is there no easier way just with a 2 way mini switch connected to one of the bridge pickups for always on or off, and let the 5 way blade select which other pickup(s) to activate?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

The bottom tone control acts the same as the 7 way mod like on David Gilmour's black strat. If you want to add a second mini toggle switch you could as there is plenty of space under the pickguard. My record is 3 mini toggles and one of them was this 4PDT one (twice the size)

so what the difference is between a 7 way mod and blend?
the 7 way mod gives you the bridge pickup in any position on the blade switch
the blend knob does the same but you have control over how much or little the pickup does

Brejatoneworks video for this is down but these are some examples, its a shame the person who made the video doesn't go in between in the sounds

a blend knob this is the best example I can think of, Joe Gore (Tonefiend) did a bunch of articles for Seymour Duncan back in the day when I was new to wiring it was always fun to see what he would come up with in his videos. I can't post two videos in one reply but.. this link will do the job.
https://youtu.be/mETOjlcey_Q?t=86
 
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Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

I was thinking more to simplify my original wish list and also make the selections quicker than a combo of tone knob and mini switch. So just a 2 way mini switch for the options I described, is there such a mod available?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

got it , this is very similar to the Black strat. If there is any ways to improve this I'll get to it later today. Got a few things to do. I'm sure there is a bunch of people on here who can bounce ideas back and forth with this project too.

you get to turn the bridge pickup on in any position, instant like you want.
this features the autosplit mod in position 2 so therefore you'll get hum cancellation in position 2 without this the position would hum. With the apparent correct of phase (haven't owned a Fender in years)
this uses one tone capacitor which is not only cost effective but a brighter guitar with less compression

because of the autosplit the only way to make the guitar brighter is either two no load pots for the tone controls. Some things to consider. If you wanted a bridge tone control you can only pick two maximum. Bridge and neck for example being my choice if I had to pick. I never use the middle pickup by itself. The other thing with two no load tone controls you'd need two tone capacitors as I can imagine this method of wiring up the one tone capacitor would run into some issues. The advantage to two different tone capacitors is you could mix and match. 1950s Fenders used upwards to 100nf (0.1uf) for warmer tones.

I'd suggest steel strings such as super brights by Dunlop or the stainless steel strings Ernie Ball for example makes. Just about any major brand has steel strings. Not nickel plated steel. Perhaps acrylic or graphtech tusq "bright" picks as well. Also be sure to ground your copper shielding. Solder a wire from the copper tape to the back of any volume or tone pot

Same as before, no wires are soldered together, the autosplit makes this wiring look complicated but I'm sure you'll pull it off. The inspiration for this is from Ibanez RG guitars for the switch. But the mod you're after is below in two real world examples.
View attachment 101922

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Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Thanks, this looks great, getting there! Couple of things: what do you mean no wires are soldered together? Is it not possible to have the middle tone control for neck and middle single coils pickups together, and the other one for the bridge (both HB pickups)? Not sure how the tones are working in this diagram right now. And does this wiring mean I cannot do the 50s tone mod and avoid no loads?
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

for no wires soldered together it just means when say the say yellow wires from the single coil go to the switch and tone control they don't solder to anything. The only two wires soldered together before going anywhere such as to the back of a pot or contact on a volume or switch is the black/bare wire on the little 59.

the tone controls are like a usual fender stratocaster
neck first
middle near the input jack
position 2 you could cut the frequencies in the bridge and middle position
the advantage to this is the bridge pickup would be a little louder and brighter without the capacitor or extra pots in position 1 which is why Fender does this.

The only way to improve this wiring would be to add either a secondary on/on mini toggle to bypass all the electronics. Some reason we call it a blower switch. It works similar to a "true bypass" effect on a pedal how it skips all the components and goes from the input jack to the output jack of the pedal. It's a very easy modification to do.

if you did go with two no load pots you'd have to use two capacitors to prevent any issues I'm sure
with the "autosplit mod" it means you can't have all 3 pickups using the two tone controls unfortunately. You could turn them both into master tone controls doing two different things but the only one I'd recommend is a passive mid cut using an audio transformer you hear almost nothing about as guitarists are more obsessed with paper in snake oil capacitors from the 50s and alnico magnets.

Buffer pedals are always a great investment, especially if you use a cable that is over 15ft (over 4.5m) to keep the highs in your guitar. Active preamps are option 2, such as the EMG afterburner (Expensive) to Guitarfetish modboards also provide this. The only down side is you would need a 9v battery in a guitar. It's doable with a strat and a quality 9v will last 6 months to a year but it'll get annoying.

this is what a buffer pedal does. One I've had my eye on was the seymour duncan pickup booster. I made one using a veroboard one summer
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

Hi. So I’ve got all the parts and will be doing the mod soon. I got a an on on DPDT switch, a recessed Gilmour style mini switch pre drilled fingerboard, a CTS vintage 250k volume pot to replace my current.

Some clarifications before I go into surgery:
- sorry but I did t understand what the tone pots do. I’d like one to control neck and middle, and the other one for bridge.
- Do i do this 50s wiring for all tone pots and is this reflected in the diagram?
- I got a DPDT two way on-on switch, is that the proposed one?
- are the caps I have (see original photos in my post) ok to use?
 
Re: HSS split coil with mini switch or tone blend

You should wire it up with as many combinations as you can and then note which ones actually sound best to your ears and don’t seem redundant. Then stick with those.
 
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