Never having owned one (but have used plenty), why were they sold with a behind-the-nut string lock? Was it just because locking tuners weren't very common back then? Were those locks just not needed?
I think Kahler has lost their minds
- Thread starter Securb
- Start date
Never having owned one (but have used plenty), why were they sold with a behind-the-nut string lock? Was it just because locking tuners weren't very common back then? Were those locks just not needed?
Sirion
Well-known member
Locking tuners were around in the eighties, but they were still extremely niche. And, of course, Floyd Rose still had a patent on a locking nut proper.
Yes. Quoting your post I was suggesting the Gotoh as FR, not Kahler alternative.
JMP/HBE
Well-known member
https://reverb.com/item/14908403-go...CheckoutMailer#notify_buyer_purchase_complete
Bought this yesterday as ive needed one for a long time. Our vacation plans this year fell thru for now and the Mrs, let me spend.
The German all steel FR are going for $200 to $400 which is insanity.
I bought 3 push in style FR upgrade bars the last couple months and each was $30+ bucks.
The new GOTOH has the upgrade bar that both push-in and screws.
Prices on everything are up and won't go back just like taxes.
Bought this yesterday as ive needed one for a long time. Our vacation plans this year fell thru for now and the Mrs, let me spend.
The German all steel FR are going for $200 to $400 which is insanity.
I bought 3 push in style FR upgrade bars the last couple months and each was $30+ bucks.
The new GOTOH has the upgrade bar that both push-in and screws.
Prices on everything are up and won't go back just like taxes.
Chris Pile
Well-known member
It was popular to have string locks because of Floyd.
Also, if you're going to dump the bar all the way, a string lock will allow the pitch to drop a little lower as compared to no string lock. Seems odd to me, but I could never quantify the reason.
larryguitar
Active member
I'm not doubting you, and I admit I'm operating from a sample of exactly one; I had a Dean years ago that had been built for Derek St. Holmes, and it had a Kahler on it. It's not that it wouldn't STAY in tune, it's that it was nearly impossible to GET in tune. I was new to trems back then, so admit it could have been user error to a degree, but I worked on that thing for months and never got it right.
Larry
GuitarStv
Sock Market Trader
Locking tuners don't fix the stability problems caused by friction that occurs at the nut. Locking tuners are fine, and can work in a pinch but will never have the same tuning stability as a locking nut. The locking nut eliminates a friction point.
The Kahler behind the nut locks had all the disadvantages of just using locking tuners in addition to all the disadvantages of a Floyd nut. Total fail.
Chris Pile
Well-known member
Not true if the setup is properly done. My Vintage Icon is equipped with a Wilkinson VS100 and locking Grover - NEVER a tuning problem, ever. A lot of people thought they could make it go out of tune - they were wrong.
As long as you could set the string height on the nut before you installed the Kahler string lock, there wasn't a problem. On Floyds you can never get every string just right. The diecast parts just aren't that well made.
NegativeEase
New member
Ive never had a Kahler, but those pics look damn nice..... but not 500-600.00 nice.
Demanic
PenultimateTone Member
I always preferred locking tuners with a Graphtek nut.
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Demanic
PenultimateTone Member
NegativeEase
New member
yall stop with the trash riffs and you wont have to rely on divebombs.
I kid I kid
I kid I kid
Securb
One of Jerry's Kids
I have locking tuners on 4 tremolo guitars. 2 Babicz, Kahler and Bigsby. Two with traditional nuts and two with LSR nuts. I don't have any tuning issues with any of those guitars.
JB_From_Hell
Jomo's Nimions
Dude, it's more than a little lower. I'm still blown away when I flip the bar around, dump it completely so the strings are falling off the neck, then having it go perfectly back in tune.
For a very short time, I owned some solid body Ovation with a Kahler. I loved that Zakk Whyle 10-60 string set at the time, and the .060 wouldn't fit in the saddle. That killed it for me.
NegativeEase
New member
All I know is it takes a Floyd Rose to do this effectively 
44) I was there to witness.
44) I was there to witness.
Chris Pile
Well-known member
Do what?
Chris Pile
Well-known member
They still offer several versions for sale, but I don't think they include them with the system anymore. Basically - same as Floyd Rose. You buy the trem you want, then choose the locking nut you want.
I quite like the cam system on the Kahler and the fact that you can adjust the string height individually. What if it used the Floyd saddles system behind the cam, together with the fine tuners? Or viceversa, implement Kahler's cam with the individual string height adjustment system on the Floyd Rose, the spring retainer screwed into the body on the Floyd, Gotoh, Edge etc is pretty trashy and substandard compared to the rest on. Combined with the locking nut it'd have to be the best trem in terms of stability and usability.
Ah patents...
Ah patents...
NegativeEase
New member
Just messin' Im sure any trem can be set up to drop the strings off the board.