I'm desperate...

Re: I'm desperate...

He fixes things that you don't want being tampered with your guitar, then charges you more for doing so. Sadly, he's the only guy around here that does this kind of stuff.

The good news is you don't need him. You can do any wiring yourself. Turn people on to this forum & they'll be self-sufficient too.

Even without the cost factor, you're better off taking control of your sound and knowing where your tone comes from. You learn things you never would have otherwise. And you can instantly make changes if you don't like something. No waiting on anyone.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Robert S.: Yeah, I purchased the SHR-1b, but that's because the dude didn't know what the difference was, so I had to return it. And that's definetly good to know! That definetly would've been a roadblock for me. Thank you!

Bluesman: I'm anxiously awaiting for my pickup to arrive and do this!

By the way, if anyone could show me a picture of what the things you use to take off the metal that's soldered onto the pickup wires look like, I'd definetly appreciate it! I went to my local hardware store, and no one knew much about soldering.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Radio Shack, eh? Alright, I'll get some. All I do is have it make contact with the metal, and it'll stick on to it?
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Also, it's a good idea to list your actual location. This forum reaches people in all corners of the world, and you might get lucky enough to find a guy who will do it for you, while showing you how......all for a 12 pack!

At least that's what I'd charge ya. Welcome to the forum. And use the search function anytime you want fast answers. Every topic has been covered.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

I receintly fixed a forum Bros guitar, did some troubleshooting on his amp and gave him a preamp tube for free.

I could have gotten a 12 pack?
 
Re: I'm desperate...

I never use braid or anything to remove wire. My pots end up with some unused solder gunk on the back, but it sounds the same to me.

Don't forget to "tin" your wires - get some solder on your iron tip, then pass it onto the pickup wire. This will save you some headache.

Here's what I do when I swap pickups - hold the hot iron tip to the connection I need to remove, then pull the wire off 1-2 seconds later when it heats up. "Tin" the new wire, heat up the connection point, slide in the new wire, hold it for a few seconds while it cools. Pull on the wire to ensure that I made a good connection.

I started with a 30 watt iron, then moved to a 40 watt, which made all the difference. 30 watts is *not quite* enough IMO.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Gearjoneser: A 12 pack sounds like a much better pice than **** $85! Haha! I'm in the Bay Area, by the way. And thanks for the forum advice, I barely found the search engine, I couldn't find the **** thing.

alex1fly: Thanks for the info! That does seem like a good idea.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Just wanted to add, for your own confidence, two things:

1) Charging $85 for a pickup swap is legal thievery.

Before you go slagging off someone charging $85 for changing a pickup let me ask you all one thing;

Has anyone thought to mention to this poster that he needs to establish the electrical polarity of the replacement pickup relative to the existing one or to map the relative magnetic polarity before installing? Both are essential if the sound of the guitar is not to be affected.

Do any of you even know how to do it?

A good technician will address these issues as well, it's not just about solder and screwdrivers.

And I see bad workmanship all the time from people who think they know how to solder and make statements exactly like the ones I see here... ;)
 
Re: I'm desperate...

I agree that magnetic and electric polarity are important (actually, that important that sometimes we take them for granted and forget to mention them) but you'll have to agree that they're not 85$ a pop important.

I mean, would it take you more than perhaps 5 minutes to tell which is which and install the pickup(s) accordingly?
Really now.

Our top notch local luthier (as in, makes kick@ss guitars from planks of wood luthier) asks for a mere 16€ for the first pickup and another 11 for the next one(s) (plus 6€ if he won't be doing the guitar a setup and he HAS to remove the strings and re-string the instrument which, in most cases you can get away with it).

I mean, he asks 32€ if he has to ROUTE the body for the pickup to fit for crying out loud! (plus again another 11 for the next one(s) ), 16€ (and 6€ for the next one(s)) if it is the pickguard to be routed.

So yeah, 85$ just for a simple SINGLE pickup installation is larceny IMO...
 
Re: I'm desperate...

I agree that magnetic and electric polarity are important (actually, that important that sometimes we take them for granted and forget to mention them) but you'll have to agree that they're not 85$ a pop important.

I mean, would it take you more than perhaps 5 minutes to tell which is which and install the pickup(s) accordingly?
Really now.

No, but could you? That's the point. I have the skill, experience and diagnostic tools to do it and have taken the time to learn the correct procedures, which makes my time and effort more valuable than someone who hasn't. OK, I'm not the repairer in question and I have no idea whether he would be doing this either but you can't assume and call him a thief or a rip off merchant just because you don't like his price; you have no way of knowing what he offers for that price.

KeeperOS;1907388Our top notch local [B said:
luthier[/B] (as in, makes kick@ss guitars from planks of wood luthier) asks for a mere 16€ for the first pickup and another 11 for the next one(s) (plus 6€ if he won't be doing the guitar a setup and he HAS to remove the strings and re-string the instrument which, in most cases you can get away with it).

I mean, he asks 32€ if he has to ROUTE the body for the pickup to fit for crying out loud! (plus again another 11 for the next one(s) ), 16€ (and 6€ for the next one(s)) if it is the pickguard to be routed.

Well that's peanuts and all i can say is you are lucky to have someone who will undersell himself. In any case you live in Greece! No offense but I expect things to be cheap in Greece. I used to work for a giftware company and they used to get a lot of their range made in a factory in Corfu at a fraction of the price we could make it here.

If he was in Minnesota though, i think he'd have to put his prices up. He's have heating bills to worry about...

So yeah, 85$ just for a simple SINGLE pickup installation is larceny IMO...

No you are wrong; it's just market forces. If the guy is the only game in town then he is likely to be busy. If he can do $85 worth of work in the time it takes him to fit a pickup then that's the price he has to charge. There's no obligation for him to subsidise his customers' thrift. The potential buyer has the option to refuse the offer and go elsewhere or do the job himself. to call it larceny and thievery is ridiculous (and libellous, and perhaps the moderators should be thinking about removing such posts) especially since the repairer in question has had a large amount of vitriol directed at him without any right of reply.

Anyway I'm not going to say any more on the matter as I don't want to see this thread hijacked by a discussion on prices.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Suit yourself man, but for what it's worth, I lost a lot of respect for you today.
You might be one heck of a tech/luthier but I must say that I am not impressed with your business ideas (and also probably practices as well) and just so you know, I'd take a tech I can trust over a more competent but shadier one any day of the week...
 
Re: I'm desperate...

i would also echo "its like riding a bike". just do it.

OR

go buy a used cheapo guitar and solder the crap out of it. the world is not gonna miss a "first act" guitar. for $85 you can pickup a "starter" guitar at a music store somewhere, i'm sure.

also, what i like to do . .. . .

when you open the "real" guitar take a digital picture of the stock wiring. that way you have a reference point. if phase is an issue, no big deal. just flip the hot and the ground of the replacement pickup.

i also like to check the pickups before i completely reassemble the guitar. you can do that by just plugging the guitar into an amp and gently touching the pickups with a screwdriver. make sure you check vol and tone knobs as well. if you tap a pickup with a screwdriver and turn down a tone knob, well, the tone changes. that way you know the tone knob will affect the tone of the strings.

there are a zillion pics/tutorials on the web about pickup changing, PLUS a zillion posters here that can answer specific questions.

i understand supply and demand, but $85 seems high to me. it must be the "pickup speculators" that are messing with the price.

nike says do it!
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Before you go slagging off someone charging $85 for changing a pickup let me ask you all one thing;

Has anyone thought to mention to this poster that he needs to establish the electrical polarity of the replacement pickup relative to the existing one or to map the relative magnetic polarity before installing? Both are essential if the sound of the guitar is not to be affected.

Do any of you even know how to do it?

A good technician will address these issues as well, it's not just about solder and screwdrivers.

And I see bad workmanship all the time from people who think they know how to solder and make statements exactly like the ones I see here... ;)

I thought to mention it except that Ibanez and SD humbucking pickups are compatable so adding phase and polarity issues to the conversation would most likely just confuse the reader who already stated that he was new to all of this.

I did take the time to mention the fact that he needs to address the splits in the 2 and 4 positions when changing the middle SC to a HB. That should count for something!

West coast or not $85 sounds quite high for a bench charge to swap a pickup. I don't care if the guy has a doctorate in nuclear physics. It's only 3 solder joints and maybe a 1/2 hour of bench time.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

Suit yourself man, but for what it's worth, I lost a lot of respect for you today.
You might be one heck of a tech/luthier but I must say that I am not impressed with your business ideas (and also probably practices as well) and just so you know, I'd take a tech I can trust over a more competent but shadier one any day of the week...

An ad hominem attack. You clearly don't have a counter argument.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

West coast or not $85 sounds quite high for a bench charge to swap a pickup. I don't care if the guy has a doctorate in nuclear physics. It's only 3 solder joints and maybe a 1/2 hour of bench time.

I agree Robert, but as I pointed out it's about how much other work he has on and the value of work that would be displaced by undertaking such a job.

I have people in competition with me who charge twice as much as I do but don't put as much work into it but there is no reason why my charges should be the basis for everyone elses. The customers are free to make their choice and I wouldn't dream of accusing any of my competitors of "thievery" and "larceny" just because they value themselves highly, that is just ridiculous.

The irony is that many of the people making such claims are from America, the world bastion of the free market economy and laissez-faire trade.

Individual traders are not charities; they do not have any obligation to tailor their prices to meet their customers' demands. Market forces will do that and where there is no competition, there are no regulatory forces to control price, but if someone overvalues themselves they will get less business, simple as that.

These are not my rules KeeperOS, and not my business practices either, it's simply the way the world works. I read somewhere that Dan Erlewine charges $500 for a set up; I don't see anyone tarring and feathering him as a criminal.

And if you were any kind of administrator Robert, you would reprimand KeeperOS for his unwarranted personal attack on me and my "business practices" which he knows nothing about.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

wow,

why so serious?

nothing says "welcome" to a new forum member like having a silly internet fight (because everybody wins in a forum argument .. .. .. .. )

when someone calls it a "crime" to charge a price, i would assume its probably more of a figure of speech. thats just my humble opinion.

i think joe barden pickups are insanely overpriced, but he gets sales i'm assuming. bill lawrence pickups are a fraction of that price, but their website sucks. neither one of those places are getting my business. again, thats just me.

wow, russian chicks are hot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SaL780naRc
 
Re: I'm desperate...

An ad hominem attack. You clearly don't have a counter argument.
Well, let's see:
Anyway I'm not going to say any more on the matter as I don't want to see this thread hijacked by a discussion on prices.
I was going to let it go but you went WAY to freakin' far man so yeah, I CAN and now am GOING to answer you, point to point in fact.
stigmata_97 - I am sorry for hi-jacking your thread man but I think you'll agree that the guy is so PAST the line that, saying that he crossed it would be an euphemism.

No, but could you? That's the point. I have the skill, experience and diagnostic tools to do it and have taken the time to learn the correct procedures, which makes my time and effort more valuable than someone who hasn't.
Oh really? Ok man, I may not have read a gazillion books and how tos but I think ANYONE with half a brain can read from the manufacturer's page/diagram/whatever which is the north and south pole and which is the hot and ground or, with a little trial and error, be able to tell for himself. Sure, he may not have your very high tech "instruments" and may not do it as fast but I think even like that unless he's a total buffoon he'd be able to make due...

OK, I'm not the repairer in question and I have no idea whether he would be doing this either but you can't assume and call him a thief or a rip off merchant just because you don't like his price; you have no way of knowing what he offers for that price.
If he knows what he's doing and actually does it then he charges 85$ for a 5 minutes (less?) job. If he doesn't know what he's doing then clearly not only he's overcharging but also is in the wrong line of work.
Pure and simple.
Well that's peanuts and all i can say is you are lucky to have someone who will undersell himself. In any case you live in Greece! No offense but I expect things to be cheap in Greece. I used to work for a giftware company and they used to get a lot of their range made in a factory in Corfu at a fraction of the price we could make it here.

If he was in Minnesota though, i think he'd have to put his prices up. He's have heating bills to worry about...
Ok, now it's MY turn to tell you than you don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Official European reports place us among THE most expensive countries in Europe (second to Portugal and a couple of others), way ahead of the UK, and even if they didn't say it, trust me when I say that we know that fully well.
The guy is simply an honest man. He knows how long sth will take him to do it and how hard it is and charges accordingly - which is why he's overbooked and has a 2 month waiting list. It is the honest one that gets all the work, not the cocky one.
No you are wrong; it's just market forces. If the guy is the only game in town then he is likely to be busy. If he can do $85 worth of work in the time it takes him to fit a pickup then that's the price he has to charge. There's no obligation for him to subsidise his customers' thrift. The potential buyer has the option to refuse the offer and go elsewhere or do the job himself. to call it larceny and thievery is ridiculous (and libellous, and perhaps the moderators should be thinking about removing such posts) especially since the repairer in question has had a large amount of vitriol directed at him without any right of reply.
See how you contradict yourself here?
You admit that the only reason he charges that much is because he knows he's flying solo and KNOWS that unless people are in the mood for an interstate roadtrip they'll HAVE to go to him.
There is NO such thing as an 85$ worth of pickup changing work.
As for the busy part, read above answer.

As a side note, if you're going to use a "difficult" word first make sure it's not one of the million words English "borrowed" from Greek (which it is) and secondly, at the very least spell it correctly (it's libelous, one L), you're supposed to be the English native between us.

But nice touch trying to force the moderators hand.
 
Re: I'm desperate...

The irony is that many of the people making such claims are from America, the world bastion of the free market economy and laissez-faire trade.

Individual traders are not charities; they do not have any obligation to tailor their prices to meet their customers' demands. Market forces will do that and where there is no competition, there are no regulatory forces to control price, but if someone overvalues themselves they will get less business, simple as that.
Funny thing you answered that one yourself for me.
You admit that it is other US residents that find it ludicrous (so the whole different country argument goes down the drain) and then basically try to justify it by saying that, since both he and they live in a capitalist-based country that everyone should have the "milk them for everything they got" and "get whatever you can" mindset lest they be called idiots.
These are not my rules KeeperOS, and not my business practices either, it's simply the way the world works. I read somewhere that Dan Erlewine charges $500 for a set up; I don't see anyone tarring and feathering him as a criminal.

And if you were any kind of administrator Robert, you would reprimand KeeperOS for his unwarranted personal attack on me and my "business practices" which he knows nothing about.
Dan Erlewine? As in THE best known, MOST recognizable tech/luthier alive?
Look man, if I were to ask KISS to play for my birthday party and they asked me 1000$ I'd think it to be a bargain.
If the local KISS COVER band asked me a 1000$ I'd simply ask them if there was a history of mental illness in their family...

Ok man, first you are the sole person in a forum full of both experienced guitarists as well as techs and luthiers who tried to justify his pricing and then even go as far as say things as "it's not me, it's how the world works" and then expect me to imagine that even though you find this totally justifiable you in fact only charge what is fair based on your time and effort?
Perhaps you do, in which case I apologize (even though I used the word probably), but you have to agree that this wasn't exactly a huge mental leap right there.

In any case, since this is strike two at trying to manhandle Robert and since I DO think he is an excellent moderator I expect for this thread to be locked before long.

In case it isn't however do not expect me to reply to it again, out of respect to stigmata_97; The poor guy came here for a simple advice, not to see an on-line international cat fight...
 
Re: I'm desperate...

It's not my pricing I'm trying to justify (I actually have a guide price of £25 for one pickup, not as cheap as your guy but half the price of the one I'm trying to defend); what I'm saying is that it is wrong to make assumptions about a service offered based on what one other person charges for it or what you think should be charged.

The OP quite rightly commented that $85 was more than he was prepared to pay, no problem there, but then a whole load of others chimed in and started personally insulting and ripping into the rep of someone who is not a member of this forum and who has no right of reply, probably no awareness even of what is being said about him, and all because you don't like his price. Then you attack me and my business philosophy without knowing anything about it.

And the fact that you think polarity mapping is only about reading from the manufacturer's instructions shows how little you actually know about the subject. I spent several hours a couple of weeks ago trying to unravel the wiring of a set of DiMarzios that had been fitted to an Ibanez two humbucker guitar with a dedicated Cor-tek switch for which I had no circuit diagram. The guy who fitted those had followed the manufacturers instructions as well, but he still got it wrong because he hadn't done the due diligence.

The hysterical nature of your response only serves to underline the lack of substance in your arguments... :)

In English libellous is spelt with a double L in the middle syllable. Only Americans spell it with one, like kidnaped, and, for the record, I'm not English...

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/libellous

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/greenslade/2008/07/why_did_newspaper_lawyers_allo.html

http://gimpyblog.wordpress.com/2008/08/17/the-libellous-simon-singh-article-on-chiropractors/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...d-16322000-over-libellous-profile-876803.html

http://club.cdfreaks.com/f20/forum-...llous-remarks-posted-users-their-forum-50314/

The last of those should be worth a look, in context.

Your American is very good otherwise, but it's "make do" not "make due".
 
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