It's time.

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Re: It's time.

ok I see $1500...that is not as extreme...if its not broke dont fix it especially when you dont have the $$

as for degrees, consider someone that wants to write love story novels thinking they have to go to college to do it. I say no! you have permission to start writing novels (or painting) right now! if you want to learn more words or more combinations of paints, then buy a book and get hands on training! the richest artists like madonna and mick jagger and producer Rick Ruben did not go to school to learn their art, and you dont NEED to either, it will prolly just slow you down since you are already playing stadiums.

great stuff dude, good luck :)
 
Re: It's time.

LedSabbath said:
The guitar doesn't make the player.
Click to expand...

Hear Hear. As long as the thing stays in tune, has a good neck, and has killer tone who needs fancy stuff. If I ever got the chance to play a stadium, I would not be thinking "I need a flashier fancier axe", I would be thinking "How do I make everything bulletproof". I see f holes and start to panic, and I play clubs.
 
Re: It's time.

It kind of seems like you guys are against the idea of me having a high quality second guitar.

i can't stress this enough: the loan is coming whether or not I get a guitar with the spare money. I NEED the loan. college is not AS expensive here in PR. we're looking at tuition of about 2,000 per semester.

I won't go into it too much because this is all personal info, but I need the loan for things like a new computer, etc. I can pay the loan, but I can't just go and drop 1,300 on a macbook on any given day.

and I can't go and drop 1,500 on a gibson any given day either. I CAN pay about $50 a month for say 9 or 10 years though.. (this is based on a friends experience at the same college).

say I take out a $6,000 loan. I get 3,000 up front and 3,000 when the semester is over, I don't know about the US but thats how it works here.

Say I need 1,000 to help with tuition, I have 2,000 left over. say I buy a macbook, I have $700 left over.

at the end of the semester, I have $3000 I don't need for ANYTHING at the time, not even if I need money for the next semester.

a $1200-1500 one time investment in a guitar doesn't seem like such a bad choice considering I can take advantage of it when it comes to my major and my music career.
 
Re: It's time.

Then get a smaller loan. If you have money to spare then I don't think any justification for buying a new guitar is necessary.

If you are taking out a loan and you already have a guitar which plays well and in tune and sounds good, then I do not think there is a good reason to buy a $1000+ guitar.
 
Re: It's time.

In the end, it's your ass that's going into hock but since you asked...

It's not so much the nice guitar as it is the debt you're looking to incur with its acquisition. Go through this or most other guitar discussion boards and the consensus is that going into debt to buy a guitar is generally a bad idea. Doesn't really matter if the debt is on a credit card, student loan, or store financing.

Finally, dropping that kind of coin on a guitar isn't an investment, it's a luxury. It's not like you're booking a tour that would pay off the guitar. Do you need a backup guitar as a pro guitarist? Absolutely! Does it need to be a $1000+ guitar? Not so much.
 
Re: It's time.

innerdreamrecords.co said:
Used Telecaster American made $600.00 that's what I'd be looking for or a used LP studio.
Click to expand...

ya those are pro quality and are legit looking on stage! same here, and


I would AVOID school for music - if you go for 4 years there is at least 30000$ loans that take forever to pay off...
 
Re: It's time.

Consider the buffoon Metal
Manaic Astro.
10 Grand in Credit Card debt with all kinds of great gear. Problem is, Im a certified ass clown, and all that great gear I got for such a good deal will end up costing me a whole hell of a lot IF I dont end up going delinquint on all me credit .
 
Re: It's time.

astrozombie said:
It kind of seems like you guys are against the idea of me having a high quality second guitar.

i can't stress this enough: the loan is coming whether or not I get a guitar with the spare money. I NEED the loan. college is not AS expensive here in PR. we're looking at tuition of about 2,000 per semester.
Click to expand...

Nope you got us all wrong dude. If you had tons of spare cash noone would care what money you spent where.

The issue is going into debt over it. Your not at all grasping how student loans can haunt you for a long time. If you dont need 1500 of that loan get a smaller loan.

You need to keep in mind that music degrees arent high dollar high demand degrees. If you do wind up scoring a nice slot and making lots of cash I'm willing to bet that it will be something that you could have gotten without a degree. I'm really not trying to be a jerk here. Just trying to be realistic about it. Most people who get music degrees wind up teaching. I'm pretty sure teaching is no better paid in PR than it is in the US.
 
Re: It's time.

Sit down and take a long deep listen bro...a few issues to think seriously about. I'm being real and not going to hate.

#1 Major in Pop-music? This sounds skeeby 15 different ways from Sunday. If "pop" music doesn't work out you are likely screwed in the real world. Before you do this, carefully consider:
- Are you REALLY in this permanently and forever? No matter what.
- Is the content of this thing REALLY useful? Business, teaching, performing etc...
- What are the success rates of graduates in various areas?

I'm not going to say "have a fall back plan" because that sucks. But I am saying that by careful planning you can seriously hedge your bets. Business major, pop music minor. Music ed major, pop performance minor. Etc....

At the end of the day, performance success is about practice, playing, getting gigs, and connecting. Formal education is not about most of those things usually.

If you are spending the money on college (whatever the cost is there) make it an investment, and make it a wise one. You KNOW music is likely going to have some lean years, or be a wash. Balance the investment. It does not have to be a ALL IN or FAIL proposition, and it doesn't have to be a PREPARE FOR FAILURE to the exclusion of SUCCESS kind of thing. Most people will present the latter, however, and the road to ruin is littered with the others. Balance dude, balance....

#2 Someone said it - Play and write good songs. Perform well. NOTHING else matters. If the gear is reliable, you are successful. The audience is not 1 in 100 guitar players. If image is key, investing in refinished Headstocks would be a better use of the money. Most real working musicians I have met do not care about the gear beyond reliability and good sound (good sound is not Uber-Tone). That's how they GOT to be that. They played/performed/connected. They didn't spend all day gear-heading.

Old Dear, as viewed by all, is honestly a beat to death POS. You would NEVER buy that hanging in a store if it wasn't a famous bro's guitar, and I bet Wah Wah is the only person who likes the way she feels. Mincer plays through a fricken Tech 21. Seriously? What does Wattage have? A strat and a Marshall? Woo Hoo. Those three guys play more than ANYONE here. Hell, even Seymour is banging on a beater Schecter C-1 that cost less than the Antiquities in it. See a trend here? (No offense guys - trying to make a point)

#3 If you are going to get a good guitar, do it. Everyone should have one. But I will say this: Get the guitar that speaks to YOU. This needs to be the guitar that you will have even after you lose a hand. It is not your #2, your backup or anything. It may not even be your stage guitar. If that's the guitar you are getting, get it and don't worry about the price. But if you EVER trade it - you effed up. It should be your sig guitar. The one you will play even when no one is looking, or the one you will play and don't care who is looking or listening because it is you and you make music with it.

#4 As a serious PRO - you need to consider the value of numerous types of gigs. Seriously consider the value of the midline high utility guitars:
- Ibanez RG with HSH and Floyd for almost anything (Pop, Rock, Metal, Blues, Jazz)
- Strat, for any Pop, Blues and total single coil needs
- Les Paul Studio or PRS SE for the dual Humbucker/Mahogany Pop, Metal, Rock thing.
- An Epiphone Sheraton or Dot for old skool Blues, Rock, Pop
- Jagstang etc... for your quirky pop funk grungey whatever
- Acoustic Electric for solo acoustic time

I could play all kinds of gigs with maybe any three of those in pairs:
Metal - RG + PRS
Rock - RG + LP Studio, or PRS + Dot (depending)
Pop - RG + PRS, RG + Jag
Blues - Strat + Dot
Jazz - Dot + PRS

An LP, a Strat, and a Dot will take you everywhere you need to be, and fit in.

Of course, if country is on the Agenda, Tele might be good. Think utility. Then go for the fantasy.

I'd rather have a MIM Strat with a splitable hum, a LP Studio with Split buckers, and a Dot with P-rails than a real Gibson 33? if I were a serious working musician. I need a basic sound and style for the gig.

Not one thing i have ever heard you post here though, says 335 style to me.

Just a few thoughts - good luck bro.
 
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Re: It's time.

Yeah, I have to agree. Can you imagine the classified ad?

"Wanted, guitarist for The Rolling Stones. Must have Bachelor's Degree in Popular Music. Salary, $1.5m per annum."

Most of my friends and acquaintances are professional musicians. Out of a hundred of them, half a dozen will have some sort of degree in music. They will be either brass players or the occasional keyboard player. Most of them will have theory out the wazoo, but be lousy feel players. One or two will have both. Most of them will lean toward jazz, until they realise they can't feed themselves playing it. They end up doing theatre gigs or big band corporate shows. Personally, I'd rather have scurvy, but to each their own.

Go to Lollapalooza or another big festival and ask around the successful acts how many of them have degrees in music. Most of the people who are making popular music are too busy already doing it to go to school to study how to do what they are already doing. It's difficult to even imagine 'popular music' as a subject that would take more than a couple of months to cover! Go ahead and learn theory if you feel so moved, but to take out loans to pay college fees to study 'popular music' so you will be qualified to do what, exactly? Teach kids? Surely you've heard the maxim, "those who can't do, teach."

Clearly the music industry has changed drastically in the past few years, due to the shifting paradigm brought about by downloading and file sharing. Most of the major record companies don't even have A & R departments any more. The days of big advances on recording and publishing contracts are dwindling away, and the new paradigm is still a mystery, yet to fully reveal itself. Now more than ever, musicians will have to use guile and marketing acumen to build a career, and hopefully one that generates an income. This is not a time to be going into debt, spending up big on degrees of dubious distinction and usefulness in the real world. It's a time to play smart and tight, with minimal outlay for maximum efficiency.

You have a possible foot in the door with these high profile supports, and there may be something that can be made of them. But per se, without follow up, they only amount to a handful of fun experiences. The real challenge is carving out a career doing what you love in this current, volatile climate. Starting out by getting yourself into debt for a degree that may be useless and a guitar that keeps other guitar players from looking down their noses at you does not seem like a wise move. Use what you've got, play yourself inside out, and those other guitar players can go blow a goat.*




Cheers........................................ wahwah


* Disclaimer...giving oral sex to goats is a health hazard and may contravene local laws.
 
Re: It's time.

I agree that relying on borrowed gear looks unprofessional and should be avoided when making contact with people who will influence your future career.

I just don't understand how the connection between the SG and the 335 or 339 comes together. Surely there must be one music style in play here, and it's hard to imagine how that is served equally well by a SG and a semi, unless it's some hip band with daily haircut updates.
 
Re: It's time.

This dude didn't get a real guitar until after he made it big:

Slash-LesPaulMain.jpg


I know you're going to do whatever you want, because you always ask for advice and rarely follow recommendations here, but damn, this is a STUPID idea. First, you're getting a completely worthless degree. (Unless you plan on TEACHING music.) Get something that can at least translate into something in the real world. Business, law, something. Even if you get a job in a completely different field a business or law degree of some sort will still look better on a resume than Music. Yes, you may be playing a couple of stadiums here and there, but you may not ever leave P.R. and will probably just be an opening band for whatever major acts come through.

Like many people have said, the music industry has changed. I'm friends with two people that have been very influential and sold plenty of records (one of them has two gold records) and have had their songs covered by other bands, and they're not selling as many records as they should be. Record labels just want whoever can make them a quick couple of million and then move on to the next "artist".


:edit: wahwah beat me to everything I said as I was multitasking while responding. :D
 
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Re: It's time.

Again - I am a huge advocate of education.

But if this is your profession of choice sitting in class is NOT time:
- learning the latest tune
- crafting a new song
- making calls on the next gig
- putting together a side band

The guys doing that are the ones who will be getting those jobs. Not you.

There is a "professionalism" deal...but the quality of the instrument is not it. If it works, if it stays in tune, if it doesn't sound like @$$ (which we all know is more about the pups and the mags....),

Being there, being available, being ready to play, and looking the part (be that leather and a black Explorer or skinny jeans and a Jagstang) is very important.

Now - learning business, production, recording....all VERY helpful. But not the target.
 
Re: It's time.

This is not addressing your original question, but since it has been brought up...

dominus said:
First, you're getting a completely worthless degree. (Unless you plan on TEACHING music.)
Click to expand...

To push back a bit here, a lot of available college degrees are "worthless." Unless you get a degree in math, engineering, or some hard science, I don't think many college grads actually use their degrees. How many people with bachelor's degrees in history become historians? How many philosophy majors become philosophers? It is not worth getting a degree in an area you hate just because it "looks" better on your resume. If you want to do a music degree and you can afford to do that, I'd say go for it. In the end, you have to be happy with what you're doing in school, or else it is just a waste of time for you and your professors.

However, be aware that there are tradeoffs to everything. Should the music thing not work out, your degree might matter for some employers/positions, while others may include the prerequisite of a degree as nothing more than a gatekeeper.

What is the most important is that you fully think through what you are doing (not necessarily implying you haven't) and that you will be happy with your decision after the dust settles, however that may be.
 
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