Jackson vs. ESP

[B2D]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

The only Jacksons I've ever been really happy with were Soloists that cost around $2000 (SL1 and SL2H) and even then while they're awesome guitars they just don't click with me. Those guitars always felt like they were missing something.

ESP rox my sox off. I've never found an ESP yet that I have not liked. The first one I ever tried was an EC1000 and it was GREAT. Like a Les Paul but more hi-tech, more streamlined, more of a cutting edge feel. And IMO their SRC model 7-string is the best one on the market right now... felt super-high quality but cost way less than a comparable Jackson. It clicked with me in a big way.

ESP gets my vote.

 

[rocksoldier]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

Do you need 24 frets?
If not, a production model should be just fine....

 

[rocksoldier]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

Do you need 24 frets?
If not a production model should be just fine....

 

[Metalman_666]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

At any rate, I envy you! Buying a custom guitar is a fun process (barring the wait )

I wish I could buy this guitar right away but I have a long wait until I can actually purchase it. My Ibanez is great but I think larger frets and a floyd would improve playability and entertainment value greatly! Plus the neck just isn't fast enough for me :smack:

 

[JeffB]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

I wish I could buy this guitar right away but I have a long wait until I can actually purchase it. My Ibanez is great but I think larger frets and a floyd would improve playability and entertainment value greatly! Plus the neck just isn't fast enough for me :smack:

I'm not familiar with all the Ibanez model numbers these days (too many numbers, yeesh), but does your guitar have a Wizard or Wizard II neck? If it does, I'm not sure you'd find the Jackson neck any faster, at least the ones I've played/owned.

I've got a new Ibanez S470DX on the way, and the neck is one of the big reasons I chose an new Ibanez over a new Jackson Dinky or a Fender Strat..the wizard necks are the fastest I've encountered.

 

[TwilightOdyssey]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

I've got a new Ibanez S470DX on the way, and the neck is one of the big reasons I chose an new Ibanez over a new Jackson Dinky or a Fender Strat..the wizard necks are the fastest I've encountered.

I think you're right in theory, Jeff, and my Jem has a ridiculously fast neck.
But, so do my Lynch guitars and they're all 1-3/4" at the nut, medium C profile, jumbo frets -- not supposed to be real fast, but they ARE ... so, I think it's just a matter of taste when it comes to how "fast" a neck is.
By contrast, when I play a Jackson, I sound like I've been playing for 2 weeks for some reason -- I just can't dig into it, and I sound aweful!!!

 

[Zerberus]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

.....

- Mahogany or Alder body with flame Maple top, Rhoads shape (ESP can do it too)

AFAIK, the ESP Rhoads are not available in north America (incl. Canada) for trademark reasons, as Jackson owns it and (IMO rightly) has sued ESP over it in the past.

- Floyd Rose Locking Trem system
- Maple or Mahogany neck with Ebony fretboard (one abalone inlay at 12th fret)
- 24 Stainless steel extra jumbo frets
- Jackson style pointed headstock (ESP makes it too)

See again my post about the body shape. The headstock I know for a fact ESP will NOT make for "Standard humans" living in North America. Many have tried, AFAIK none have succeeded.

- Locking nut, Sperzel locking tuners
- EMG 81/60 bridge/neck pickups
- 2 volume 1 master tone control
- 3 way toggle pickup selector switch

I think that's everything... Anyway for all that criteria, and a fast neck, do you think ESP or Jackson would be the better way to go? Oh and what sort of finish on the neck would make it the smoothest and fastest to play?

thanks

*edit* Judging by my name I think you can guess what type of music this would be used for

Having played and sold both earlier as a dealer, definitely the Jackson. Same quality, cheaper, and to boot it´s the ORIGINAL, why pay more for a knockoff.

And specifically the Rhoads shape is something that most people seem to feel is one of those "Jackson or nothing" deals, at least here in Europe. And HERE ESP Rhoads are readily available, just like Tokai Love Rocks or Fame PRS copies.

But again, I think your greatest hurdle will be having ESP make that axe if they know it´s for the US or Canadian market, because they KNOW they will be sued for all it´s worth if Jackson finds out. Except that this time, it´s a repeat offense, doesn´t look too good before a judge, and they were already issued Cease and Desist orders on both the Rhoads shape and the Jackson headstock by a US court. I doubt that they´re willing to take that risk

That´s also why for example the Michael Amott Flying V and Alexi Laiho Rhoads are NOT available in the US

 

[Metalman_666]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

Do you need 24 frets?
If not a production model should be just fine....

The one thing I've heard about with having 24 frets is that 24 frets somehow moves the neck pickup out of its natural place, meaning a decrease in proper tone. I read this in the new issue of guitar one (Noise and Feedback section). Why does this make a difference? Doesn't having 24 frets on a 24.75" scale make the frets closer together than 22 frets on the same scale?? And how the hell does this affect the neck pickup?

 

[Metalman_666]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

I'm not familiar with all the Ibanez model numbers these days (too many numbers, yeesh), but does your guitar have a Wizard or Wizard II neck? If it does, I'm not sure you'd find the Jackson neck any faster, at least the ones I've played/owned.

I was never quite sure what sort of neck my Ibanez has, but I knew it wasn't a Wizard neck. I just looked on the site and it says my neck is a "3pc SZ set-in neck" so there you go.

 

[rocksoldier]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

What i ment was that the production rhoads only have 22 frets, so if you want 24 you have to go custom shop...

 

[JeffB]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

I think you're right in theory, Jeff, and my Jem has a ridiculously fast neck.
But, so do my Lynch guitars and they're all 1-3/4" at the nut, medium C profile, jumbo frets -- not supposed to be real fast, but they ARE ... so, I think it's just a matter of taste when it comes to how "fast" a neck is.
By contrast, when I play a Jackson, I sound like I've been playing for 2 weeks for some reason -- I just can't dig into it, and I sound aweful!!!

Agreed, my post was more of a generalization in that Ibanez wizard necks have that reputation for being about as fast as it gets (and justifiably so, IMO). But certainly that would not be the case for every individual.

Yet I have a similar scenario....way back when I almost bought a Schecter Strat. At the time, the Schecters were higher dollar near custom level instruments (Now I see they are more of a mid priced model similar to Ibanez and have taken on their own aesthetic style). Those beautiful quilted maple top Schecters at the shop had probably the fastest neck for me (and best action) that I can remember on any guitar...just effortless to play..yet the neck was a bit wider and fatter than the Fender Dlx Strat Plus that was my # 1 axe at the time. Go figure. I still shake my head at times wondering why I never bought one of those. :duh:

 

[Metalman_666]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

does anyone know anything about the 24 frets and the neck pickup issue?

 

[DeadSkinSlayer3]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

Neck pickups are placed under the harmonic node on a 22nd fret, the "sweet-spot." Some say there's a huge difference, some say there isn't. I honestly haven't played enough guitars with the correct pickups to make a clear assumption, but 22 fret's seem to have more clarity. Only get the 24 frets if you're going to use them, I honestly only use mine for Children Of Bodom solo's, which need them.

 

[Zerberus]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

Neck pickups are placed under the harmonic node on a 22nd fret, the "sweet-spot." Some say there's a huge difference, some say there isn't. I honestly haven't played enough guitars with the correct pickups to make a clear assumption, but 22 fret's seem to have more clarity. Only get the 24 frets if you're going to use them, I honestly only use mine for Children Of Bodom solo's, which need them.

IMO The "Harmonic node" theory that everyone uses is total BS, just like saying a brass nut will make your guitar all bright and screechy... Why? Because, like the nut, it only applies to the OPEN STRINGS. As soon as you fret a note, that node is somewhere else, so no longer part of the equation.

What IS true: being closer to the bridge it will have a slightly thinner, clearer sound. Just like a middle pickup will have a clearer, thinner sound than an identical Neck, and an Identical bridge wil again have less output, be clearer and have less bass.

For most people, the tonal difference is IMO negligible, I hear it but it doesn´t bother me in the least.

Side Note: Jackson traditionally has their bridge Humbuuckers about 1/8" closer to the neck than most other manufacturers. One of the reasons they seem to develop more power from the bridge pickup than most others

BTW, If you like the neck on your Ibanez, then I recommend you getting the thinner "speed" profile instead of the "Soloist" Profile, which is standard on production Rhaods as well

 

[JB_From_Hell]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

IMO The "Harmonic node" theory that everyone uses is total BS, just like saying a brass nut will make your guitar all bright and screechy... Why? Because, like the nut, it only applies to the OPEN STRINGS. As soon as you fret a note, that node is somewhere else, so no longer part of the equation.

What IS true: being closer to the bridge it will have a slightly thinner, clearer sound. Just like a middle pickup will have a clearer, thinner sound than an identical Neck, and an Identical bridge wil again have less output, be clearer and have less bass.

For most people, the tonal difference is IMO negligible, I hear it but it doesn´t bother me in the least.

Several excellent points above.

I think the neck pup thing is kind of dumb. The difference is very noticeable, but to call either placement "correct" is asinine. That's like saying it's incorrect to play death metal rhythm with the neck pup. I think the placement of the neck pup is another myth, probably started by Gibson freaks j/k

 

[Metalman_666]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

BTW, If you like the neck on your Ibanez, then I recommend you getting the thinner "speed" profile instead of the "Soloist" Profile, which is standard on production Rhaods as well

When you say the thing about the speed neck... do you mean the thinner profile would be like my ibanez but thinner?? sorry I don't quite understand what you're trying to say :blackeye: ... and would this neck still be really f'in fast/does the thinner contour make it faster?

 

[Zerberus]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

When you say the thing about the speed neck... do you mean the thinner profile would be like my ibanez but thinner?? sorry I don't quite understand what you're trying to say :blackeye: ... and would this neck still be really f'in fast/does the thinner contour make it faster?

No, I´m saying that Jackson´s "Speed" profile is thinner than Jackson´s "Soloist" profile

Slimmer necks tend to be faster as a general rule.

 

[Davey]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

No, I´m saying that Jackson´s "Speed" profile is thinner than Jackson´s "Soloist" profile

Slimmer necks tend to be faster as a general rule.

but you DONT want to overdo it *cough* wizard II *cough*

 

[orbiter]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

for an RR .. I'd go w/ jackson .. thou I'm not too crazy about the neckshapes on em . thats just a personal pref.

did you check out abstract?

 

[Forbes]

Re: Jackson vs. ESP

for an RR .. I'd go w/ jackson .. thou I'm not too crazy about the neckshapes on em . thats just a personal pref.

did you check out abstract?

yer it could be a good idea to check out some smaller custom guitar companies, you could end up paying/waiting less. and getting exactly what you want.